Battle Born Batteries

[Optimistic Paranoid]

New company.  Price is ridiculous compared to Lead Acid, but may be right in line for what Lithium batteries are going for.  Claims to be a drop in replacement for ordinary batteries.  There's a thread on them over on the Escapees forum.  Member there who bought some praised the customer service, said they contacted Morningstar, Trimetric, and his inverter/charger manufacturers to provide him with the correct settings to work with their batteries.  Anyway, posted FYI.

https://battlebornbatteries.com/shop/12v-lifepo4-deep-cycle-battery/

 

[John61CT]

Their G31 apparently fits nicely into an ArkPak 730, as if designed for each other.

Note these "drop-ins" are not good as the sole load dump for an alt. The internal BMS cuts off with no warning, no way to wire to a Field Disconnect or Load Dump redirect like you can with external protection.

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

Their G31 apparently fits nicely into an ArkPak 730, as if designed for each other.

Note these "drop-ins" are not good as the sole load dump for an alt. The internal BMS cuts off with no warning, no way to wire to a Field Disconnect or Load Dump redirect like you can with external protection.

If I'm understanding you correctly, you're saying don't use this in place of the engine battery, cause it can cause the vehicle alternator to blow.  I assume it's no problem with a solenoid as the house battery with a regular battery in the engine?

 

[caretaker]

dang, and i thought ROLLS are expensive

 

[Ballenxj]

dang, and i thought ROLLS are expensive

$900. per 100ah battery? WOW! I think I'll wait till they come down a lot.
https://battlebornbatteries.com/shop/12v-lifepo4-deep-cycle-battery/

 

[Trebor English]

Gel batteries were marketed as drop in replacements for flooded lead acid batteries.  They are not the same.  They are better in some respects and have different limitations.  Marketers ruined the reputation of gel batteries by selling them into inappropriate applications.  

If marketers get their way they will make every possible sale even if it is doomed to fail.  Then the technology gets the bad rap.  LiFePO4 are a promising technology.  Selling them as lead acid replacements that don't weigh as much, "a sleek 29 pounds", is a bad idea if you want to stay in business making LiFePO4 batteries.  Oh, wait, they don't make them, they just stick on a label and sell them.

 

[John61CT]

LiFePO4 is generally 5+ times the price of lead.

The packaged system solutions including proprietary BMS from quality vendors like Victron & Mastervolt, much more than that.

Even marine $uppliers say they're only worth it for racing yachts.

 

[John61CT]

If I'm understanding you correctly, you're saying don't use this in place of the engine battery, cause it can cause the vehicle alternator to blow.  I assume it's no problem with a solenoid as the house battery with a regular battery in the engine?

I prefer the alt directly charge the House bank. LFP requires for longevity a maximum of 13.8V, so you need to have a precisely adjustable voltage regulator, like Balmar's MC-614.

Or leave the stock alt setup, and use a Promariner or Sterling DCDC charger for the LFP, just that the big-amp versions are pricey.

But you can do what you like, as long as the alt output always has a load, or you otherwise rig protection for the diodes.

IMO these drop-ins are best left to auxiliary portable pack use anyway, not for an installed House bank.

 

[John61CT]

The Firefly Oasis also comes in G31, lead based chemistry, so less need for special infrastructure, and uniquely (among lead batteries) able to handle PSOC abuse, one of LFP's key advantages.

Cheaper, at "only" $500 per 100AH.

But backordered for months at the moment.

 

[SternWake]

When firefly Oasis does have stock to sell, it could be from their new factory, in India..............

 

[John61CT]

Not as long as you go through the official US distribution channels, headed by Bruce at Ocean Planet, only G31 though. They are constantly delivering, just that demand has currently created a waitlist.

The U.S. staff and dealers are going to be doing thorough testing of the Indian product, 6V and 2V I believe, before selling within the U.S.

Apparently some guy had prematurely started selling direct-shipped of the latter, but I doubt these would be covered by the US operation's excellent warranty and customer service.

 

[VanKitten]

LiFePo4 is only super expensive when you insist on buying "plug and play" batteries.

Really good BMS systems are coming available, Build it yourself and the cost for 200ah system with BMS runs about $1000.

Lithium does not like to be hot. Do not place it inside your vehicle engine compartment.

Anyway. I am building a 300ah battery from the cells...Dacus will supply the BMS. Morningstar the charge controller.

Yeah, steep learning curve, but lots of good folks to help you on the way.

The companies that are building the plug and plug batteries are doing their best to scare people. Of course, they want to sell you theirs...at 2+ 3+ the price. Look at electric cars.com. They sell somewhat pricier individual cells....they are in the USA if you are worried about reliability. But, even their drop in batteries are pricy compared to just building it yourself.

 

[John61CT]

Dacus will supply the BMS.

By DIY do you mean just buying the large prismatics as bare cells and then adding an all-in-one BMS?

Or buying piles of the small cylindrical ones and wiring them together to build up to high-AH packs yourself?

Could you please list or link to BMS vendors or products suitable for 300-500AH 12V banks?

Ideally with no active balancing, allowing high 1C+ charge rates, and adjustable voltage protection setpoints and delays.

Most I've seen allow continuous operation <12V and charging >14V. So what's the point?

Also ideally I'd like to have the BMS cut of charging based on endAmps, say .02C.

Starting to think I'll need to DIY the BMS via arduino, but would prefer robust pre-built protection.