Anyone try building with metal?

[VanLifeCrisis]

I was considering making a build out of a cargo trailer, and weight started to be a factor for me.   Has anyone tried building out with metal studs instead of wood 2x4?  Could use self tappers.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/ClarkDi...ized-Steel-Wall-Framing-Stud-120159/206843784

Its about 3 bucks more (about $9) than the same length 2x4 ($6), but it is 13lbs lighter (7lbs) and stronger.

 

[abnorm]

OK................ but who starts out their build using 2x4's ?

 

[John61CT]

Are you rebuilding the whole shell or just working on the interior? Walls?

Cabinets, bed platform?

 

[Canine]

I tried doing that and for the life of me was not able to figure out how to use self tappers without breaking off. They worked only on the lightest of steel. I tried and tried and tried. Several people told me just to get the correct screws, but for some reason all the screws I used broke. No matter what brand or how much I spent, it didn't work. If you are screwing into wood or aluminum, that is easy. Screwing into a steel frame is another animal. Stainless steel screws are nice (and $$$), but they don't have the strength. Even professional cargo trailer makers use a high quality, zinc-coated screw on their aluminum trailers which is what I would recommend. Self tappers would go through 25 gauge steel studs no problem and probably 20 gauge, but I've never tried. Traditional steel studs are quite flimsy by themselves, but when fastened to each other or something else, they get a lot stronger. They won't hold a screw worth a darn, though. If you are thinking of fastening cabinets to a traditional metal stud using screws, it won't work. 2X4s or 2X3s are a lot easier to work with. Wood is so easy. 2X3s are more expensive and harder to find, but they will save weight and maybe space. I'm not sure how well a screw would hold in the studs you linked to. With the standard metal studs, sometimes you need to put wood behind it for it to work properly, so it may never have been a 100% steel stud construction; wood may have always been a part of it. The ones you linked to likely need occasional wood to hold a screw, too, but since it is a new product, I don't know. I'm a big fan of rivets. Using a hand riveter with steel rivets is tiring, though. Aluminum rivets are way easier, but I'm not sure how strong they are. I bet they would be pretty darn strong and would hold better than any screw.

I converted a cargo trailer and eschewed 2X4's entirely. I slapped up a solid wall of rigid foam (Polyiso) insulation then screwed 3/8 plywood and OSB on that using #8 pan head screws into the aluminum frame. Then fastened everything onto that. If I were to do it again, I would use entirely plywood because it holds screws much better and takes paint better. I would also sacrifice a 1/4 inch of space and upgrade to 1/2 plywood. The screw holding difference between 1/2 inch and 3/8 inch is considerable. Don't go less than #8 screws. #10 is a great size without getting expensive. Most of the time #8 is good enough, but I went with #10 if I needed extra holding power. I didn't use the cheap crappy screws, either. I'm a HUGE fan of quality screws like ROK, GPX, Gri-Tite, etc. I love Torx bits. I did use a lot of Philips, but used an impact driver to make the screwing in easier. With wood, the more coarse the screw, the better they work.

 

[Weight]

I used dimensional lumber. 1 inch clear pine measures 3/4 inch thick. I used 1x4, 1x3, 1x2 and some cut to my sizes. My miter saw makes 90* cuts and a Kreg Jig makes assembly better than metal studs. Pine is very light. Much easier to work that those shaky metal studs. There are many different sheet metal and self taping screws than you have found.

 

[VanKitten]

Two ribs are steel. (Front where it joins the cab, last rib in the back)

Everything else is 2x3.   (2x4 is not necessary).  Because of the curve of the exterior wall, the studs had to be trimmed out around the windows.  

I don't think there is any advantage to having all the ribs be in metal...but, I like how solid this rig feels with everything tied to those two ribs.

 

[Minivanmotoman]

Yes, framed the whole tiny trailer with them. The light 2*4 drywall studs from HD.
Reinforced the c sections by doubling to make one fully enclosed stud using self tap screws to hold together.
Solid enough but as others said, did not suspend anything from them. Was a fun project, extended a HF to 6*10*6, insulated, etc. Nice size for solo and pretty light weight. Cheaper than a tear drop and more room.

I could tell you stories about that trailer. What an adventure. Chuckling to myself just remembering.
This was version 2.0 now that I remember. Version 1.0 was called my Armor Haul. .

 

[VanLifeCrisis]

I was doing some research. I remember seeing a video or reddit post with architecture or engineering students who did a van build with it but I cant find it. But I did find this video of people making a tiny home with it. In the comments they said they consulted an architect and did load bearing calculations. They do go into exactly how the screw and anchor things.



Of course I'm just looking to make interior walls and storage. I should note that you have to buy the tracks too to get the strength out of them (youd have to use a 2x4 in the same capacity as well). They are cheaper than the studs at 4 bucks.

Here is a guy who is building a bbq island of it (basically a kitchen setup), and it seems pretty strong. He uses cement board to sheath it but id go with a lighter panel of some sort.

 

[VanLifeCrisis]

Was a fun project, extended a HF to 6*10*6, insulated, etc. Nice size for solo and pretty light weight. Cheaper than a tear drop and more room.

I'm real interested in this, do you have more pics/info about your build somewhere? How much did it come out weighing. Id imagine you can pull that with anything short of a bicycle



They have a thinner version at menards (25 gauge as opposed to 20), but it is twice as cheap.

 

[John61CT]

Also check out the TTNT.com PMF idea of just using rigid foam and painted dropcloth as structural loadbearing materials.

 

[Minivanmotoman]

I'm real interested in this, do you have more pics/info about your build somewhere?  How much did it come out weighing.   Id imagine you can pull that with anything short of a bicycle.

Well that was built about 10 yrs ago before the fame and glory of building, posting and objectifying became the norm online with Facebook, Instagram and YouTube. Heck, Bob only had an online blog at that time. Put it together on a deadline and it was rock and roll, go go go to build. Only a few pics, none too great.

Now that I think about it, maybe even used the thinner and cheaper 2*3 overlapped and screwed together making an enclosed stud.
Basic construction, nothing extraordinary but did finish the interior nicely with a blue and silver modern decor throughout to match the exterior. painted the galvanized sheet metal with $1.25 Walmart spray cans which turned out to be surprisingly durable, adhered well and fade resistant even in the Southwest sun after a couple years.

1" ply floor, reinforced ply bracing in all corners, 2*8 cross braced roof, fiberglass insulated walls, poly iso roof insulation on harbor freight heavy duty 1720 lb trailer. All wrapped with standard roof metal sheets. Never weighed as was towing it with my v6 GM minivan and made as light as possible. Could probably calculate and be around 1000 lbs guesstimate. Before loading the interior of course. Lol. Even had a small 30 watt solar panel that I played around with. Useless and got a small generator later.

Took it cross country at hwy speeds, twice, no problems. Towed easily but did hit the fuel economy by a few mpg, more than I expected. 4-5 mpg less. 

Can remember coasting into a gas station at 1am on a dark, cold, wet stormy night outside Buffalo. Had run out of gas and was on the side of the highway. Waited a couple minutes, pondering my options on how to stay warm and dry. Allowed the inline fuel to drain back into the tank. Started back up and crawled to the next exit. Luckily, it had an open gas station. Didn't have to walk the couple miles in the rain with a gas can. Phew, was a close one. Life's adventures gambling with lady luck. Won that one. 

 

[VanLifeCrisis]

Thanks for the info, that's really awesome! I might keep my out for a cheap small trailer. Apparently HF stopped selling them.

 

[Minivanmotoman]

Harbor freight apparently got fined and cited on their trailers for tires technical DOT non compliance. They have pulled them all off the shelf.
Another cheap option but stronger trailer is a boat trailer which sometimes can be had cheap. Instant vnose, strong base to build on, usually galvanized.

Or try building something like this, spotted at the RTR. Road Chief. 

 

[Minivanmotoman]

Fyi, video on steel frame tiny home assembly.

 

[breeze]

Commercial Van builders do shelves and everything almost in metal (mostly AL sheet metal.) If I can find basic structural pieces, beams, and/or caged lockers; it will save a ton of development time and it will last forever. Guesstimating off the cuff, the weight differential should be negligible (of course the costs go up in materials and down in labor and processing time.) But on the other hand, you will be able to secure it better to help prevent theft and it should last forever for a better value.

Whatever the right material for right job is, should not be limited by artificial material limits or inclusions. Continuous van evolutions are definitely not free, so there is a value in doing right the first time if the capital is available. For me, I usually go by the 'greedy' heuristic: "The easiest way is the best way."