Van Choice: Old vs. New

[CarmeCoolidge]

Just brainstorming right now, so this doesn't have to be super technical. I know old is cheaper at the start but more expensive to maintain and run (lower MPG). However, I don't have enough experience with vehicle ownership so I struggle to even guess how long old would be cheaper than new. I am still young, so I think its a safe bet my nomadic lifestyle will evolve which means I will require different things from my house. This makes me lean towards old since I won't have it very long, or I guess I could I tear it out and rebuild the new van. Another question that could change things is whether I could sell the build/vehicle when I'm done. I plan on a pretty light build, so stripping it to it's original state shouldn't be an issue, right? I don't know about much I can expect to get out of the used "new" van or even more used old van, either. I'm fairly tall (6'2") and want to be able to stand up in my build. Is it hard to find used high-tops?

I know a lot of this depends on tons of variables, but if you have experience in this area I'd love to hear it!
Also, this is a random question. I rock the campgrounds most of the time so I was wondering what I'd need to safely run home outlet electronics off of the campsite hookups, the 30 or 50 amp connections. Some campgrounds have household outlets, but a lot just have 1 or 2 of the rv connections. Do I just need an inverter? Or am I overthinking and don't need anything but the dogbone converter I already have?

 

[bullfrog]

A lot of campgrounds have patched together barely functioning plug ins. Get yourself A cheap plug in tester that will verify a correctly wired plug. Most all RV campgrounds have single phase 110 to 120 volt AC power just like wall plugs in a regular house. Use the same protective devices you would use at home to prevent damage from line surges. You can adapt 50 Amp and 30 amp RV plugs to a regular 3 prong plug with an adapter but be sure to check them with your plug in tester before plugging in any devices.

 

[maki2]

Buy what you can afford to pay cash for. Worry about the electric later. But you really do not need any kitchen electric appliances for camping trips. Buy a Gas One Mini Stove for cooking.

I have been full time on the road for three years. I do have a single 150 watt solar panel and a 160ah AGM deep cycle marine battery. I have a diesel heater, a modest sized 27l 12v fridge. By no electric kitchen appliances other than the fridge. I use a small butane stove for cooking. No need for other electric kitchen appliances. KISS principal the polite translation is Keep It Simple Sweetheart. The fewer chores required kitchen cleanup time the better. The less water needed for cleanup the better.

 

[Camper]

New van if you can afford it..... used if not. Buy the newest you can afford.

 

[afblangley]

It's hard to make specific suggestions without knowing the details of your specific situation. But in general, the lowest risk approach is to treat a van purchase like you would a car purchase. That way, no matter how your circumstances change, you still get utility from the vehicle. I replaced my daily driver (a full sized SUV) with a van. It fills every role my SUV had (plus a few more). It didn't cost anymore than I would have spent on buying another SUV. While I would never choose to live in a vehicle full time, vans are so versatile, I will never go back to owning a car/SUV.

So, if you were buying a car, how much would you spend? Would it be new or used?

 

[CarmeCoolidge]

A lot of campgrounds have patched together barely functioning plug ins. Get yourself A cheap plug in tester that will verify a correctly wired plug. Most all RV campgrounds have single phase 110 to 120 volt AC power just like wall plugs in a regular house. Use the same protective devices you would use at home to prevent damage from line surges. You can adapt 50 Amp and 30 amp RV plugs to a regular 3 prong plug with an adapter but be sure to check them with your plug in tester before plugging in any devices.

Something like this? I would check with that device to make sure I get the "Power on/Correct Wiring" result then I can just plug in my 30amp to house outlet converter, an extension cord, then my surge protecting power strip? That's easy! Thanks for the help

Buy what you can afford to pay cash for. Worry about the electric later. But you really do not need any kitchen electric appliances for camping trips. Buy a Gas One Mini Stove for cooking.

I have been full time on the road for three years. I do have a single 150 watt solar panel and a 160ah AGM deep cycle marine battery. I have a diesel heater, a modest sized 27l 12v fridge. By no electric kitchen appliances other than the fridge. I use a small butane stove for cooking. No need for other electric kitchen appliances. KISS principal the polite translation is Keep It Simple Sweetheart. The fewer chores required kitchen cleanup time the better. The less water needed for cleanup the better.

I plan on living full time in the van using mostly campgrounds, not just trips, so I figured I'd pay the extra couple dollars a day (or volunteer host) for the electricity and skip all the cost and hassle of installing my own electrical. I already have electrical kitchen appliances from sticks and bricks living so that reduces equipment replacement cost as well. I definitely agree with KISS, it's just simpler for my situation to go electric. I've tried solar, but I have a huge electrical demand as I remotely work, play video games (pcs capable of gaming gulp power), and have an electric bike that I use to get around town instead of my van. My "cheap" solar setup (275 watts) was nowhere near capable of it even before the electric bike tripled my demand. I'd have to invest at least 2-3k more to have a proper solar setup. The $2-3 a night for the hookups is hard to beat. Thanks for your input

 

[bullfrog]

Just to be safe I would get a second tester to plug into your regular house sockets before you plug your appliances in, that way you know you know you are good. Don’t be surprised if you have to move to another site to get a good service, in fact we check before we set up.

 

[maki2]

Huge electrical use is typical of gamers. It is hard for them to “unplug” from the grid.

Camp host tend to be constantly interrupted. Als such that is not a good job for someone working online and playing online games. Also many camp hosting jobs are not in areas with good cell coverage or speed. You will be needing Starlink to have a decent access to the internet. The Wi-Fi in RV parks is typically abysmal.

But you will get it all figured out before too much time on the road goes by.

 

[CarmeCoolidge]

Just to be safe I would get a second tester to plug into your regular house sockets before you plug your appliances in, that way you know you know you are good. Don’t be surprised if you have to move to another site to get a good service, in fact we check before we set up.

Got it! Thanks for the advice

Camp host tend to be constantly interrupted. Als such that is not a good job for someone working online and playing online games. Also many camp hosting jobs are not in areas with good cell coverage or speed. You will be needing Starlink to have a decent access to the internet. The Wi-Fi in RV parks is typically abysmal.

I don't mean to info-dump, but communicating this helps me process and develop it in my head. Plus, putting how I do xyz on the forum may help some onlooker figure something out. Thanks for your input

I know they get interrupted by camper issues, but I don't think it's anywhere near constant. I've spent three weeks camping with a campground host couple and even when it was busy there wasn't many issues that weren't solved in a minute or two. I've read and heard a lot of experiences and they rarely mentioned constant camper issues, but this is super anecdotal so I guess a lot of it is luck. I do plan on staying in/near smaller towns so I can get around on my bike easier, which has meant smaller campgrounds usually. I never camp at the big RVer campgrounds either. They feel like worse trailer parks, everyone packed in like sardines with giant rigs.

I have an amazing internet solution. I use a sim card with an unlimited data plan in a sim card router that I can configure. I just need to change the TTL (time to live) setting to 65 (and some optimization settings depending on the router and situation). TTL at 65 will mean that the service providers see the wifi connection the router produces as a phone connection. This sidesteps the extremely expensive roaming wifi data plan costs and prevents them from throttling it as much. ****THIS BREAKS THE TERMS OF SERVICE AGREEMENTS!**** It is not illegal, but the service providers will discontinue your service. You can only really get caught by telling them that you're doing it, though. This functions off of cell signal, so I don't know how well it does boondocking but in campgrounds near a town it gets great reception and speeds.

I don't play online games! I like single player stuff.

I am very fortunate to have a super flexible job. As long as I get what needs done done, I'm not bothered by anyone. I can even do stuff ahead of time. That makes it a good pairing with hosting. It's a weekday job too, so during the busiest times I'll be off work!

 

[Happy Camper]

In your position I would get a decent cheap used van. Make sure it's in good running order and put some money to the side for repairs. And possibly upgrades.

Knowing you are doing a minimal build, you can build, change, and adjust until you find what you like. At that point you can decide if a new van makes sense in the future. I think from reading here they most people do around 3 different builds before they find one that really works for them the best.

Since you have a full time job, just throw as much into savings as you can, without going too crazy. Then you have money to buy something new later if you deem it necessary.

I would seriously consider a battery system at least. This way your electronics can run off the batteries and you don't have to worry about intermittent power, or worse, brownouts. Brownouts will fry electronics faster than most things. Think of it as your power conditioner/buffer.

You can charge your batteries from the available power at the park. This way you can be anywhere and use your goodies. And have clean power.

You can add a DC to DC charger to alternator charge them while driving. If you get the urge, you can add a solar panel later on if you want. If you have the resources to get a battery back and do internal power correctly, do so. It'll simplify your situation.

 

[Tony's Dream]

I'm not macanically inclined so I usually buy new. I also wanted a high top but ended up with a cargo van. The high tops I found were over $40,000. Like you, I wasn't sure if I would keep the van very long or if I would even like van life. I kept the build very, very simple. Everything I put in could be removed within 30 minutes. The only thing attached to the van was the kitchen cabinet (like you would find above a fridge). It could be removed and it would only leave a couple of screw holes.

I don't live in my van full time, I only take trips of 10-14 days at a time. After a couple of trips I was hooked! I then installed a window and then an RV plug. I installed only one outlet to be used for charging my phone and running small applancies. I have a container, that stores under my bed, with power cords and adaptors to connect if I stay in an RV park. I installed a small roof vent just large enough to vent out any hot air and allow for air flow.

I'm 60 now and in time I may upgrade to a hightop. It would not fit into my garage, so I would have to consider storage or garage modifcations. I hope the modifcations will not impact the trade in, but it might. Van life is still popular and I hope I could fine a buyer if it comes to that.

 

[CarmeCoolidge]

In your position I would get a decent cheap used van. Make sure it's in good running order and put some money to the side for repairs. And possibly upgrades.

Knowing you are doing a minimal build, you can build, change, and adjust until you find what you like. At that point you can decide if a new van makes sense in the future. I think from reading here they most people do around 3 different builds before they find one that really works for them the best.

Since you have a full time job, just throw as much into savings as you can, without going too crazy.

I would seriously consider a battery system at least. This way your electronics can run off the batteries and you don't have to worry about intermittent power, or worse, brownouts. Brownouts will fry electronics faster than most things. Think of it as your power conditioner/buffer.

I've gotten the same impression. 3 builds is the average. I'm going to go for 2 vans but many builds. A big part of my minimal idea is just as you said, I can easily change it later. Add this or that one at a time instead of having to basically learn how to build an entire house and do it right the first time. I'm even doing that now with my current build to try my ideas out.

I'm ahead of you on the savings! I've got 40% going into a portfolio and I have a cushion in savings. I'm midwest cheap with the rest!

In my current setup I have a couple of jackerys, 275w of solar, a home battery hooked up to the alternator, and i'm planning on doing electric sites also like you said. The solar isn't nearly enough for my high demand. Plus, I can switch from gas to electric for cooking which I much prefer.

Brownouts are when the voltage drops, right? My surge protection doesn't do anything for that, does it? To protect against that, could I plug the hookup into the house battery and then connect all my electronics to the battery instead of a direct connection to the hookup?

Thank you for your detailed comment, good to know I've got a lot of the recommended stuff already!

I'm not macanically inclined so I usually buy new. I also wanted a high top but ended up with a cargo van. The high tops I found were over $40,000. Like you, I wasn't sure if I would keep the van very long or if I would even like van life. I kept the build very, very simple. Everything I put in could be removed within 30 minutes. The only thing attached to the van was the kitchen cabinet (like you would find above a fridge). It could be removed and it would only leave a couple of screw holes.

Nice! I've got a similar idea. I'm going to start with what I know (not much) and go from there instead of trying to do it all at once at the start. I'm glad it works well for you! It's pretty awesome when it all comes together.

The hightop price-tag is killer! I agree. If I'm going to spend that kind of cash it needs to be a sure thing. If my experiments with my current build go well I might be confident enough for that kind of investment but we'll have to see.

Thanks for your comment!

 

[LargeMarge]

... am I overthinking and don't need...

.
a)
Probably.
.
b)
Irregardless of your next decision, the decision after that tends to be the opposite:
* "This one time at van-camp, everybody had zip-off shorts, so I want zip-off shorts!"
* "This one time at van-camp, everybody had electronic gizmos, so I want electronic gizmos!"
* "This one time at van-camp, everybody got rid of their zip-off shorts and electronic gizmos..."
.
Our Best Suggestion For All Travelers:
* acquire a suitable candidate,
* toss in some car-camping gear,
* go have fun.
.
Inevitably, your first rig is 'the worst possible choice of all worst possible choices'.
With that out of the way, you fine-tune your realizations about your next rig.
.
At various points during our Full-Time Live-Aboard Experience®, we were absolutely positive the only rig we would ever need was:
* a semi-tractor conversion
* a semi-trailer conversion
* a van conversion, because van-camp
* a sailboat
* three mules and two dogs
* some weird old box-truck converted to a nifty-neato ExpeditionVehicle something something you-have-to-be-kidding-me.
.
Looking back, What! Were! We! Thinking!.
And yet, each of our decisions fit our RequirementsStatement for that era.
.
Fortunately, we somehow managed to survive our choices.

 

[Happy Camper]

Most power strips and electronic protection devices protect against power surges and spikes. And that's great for standard things overall. Power spikes can cause damage if not stopped quickly.

Brownouts are low power situations. These are very bad for electronics.

Dirty power is bad as well. If you've ever seen "The Outer Limits" beginning scene where you see the wave patterns on the screen, that's what clean power looks like. If you took the top and bottom of the wave curve and name then flat and spiky, that's dirty power. It can cause many issues. Which is why most here recommend a pure sine wave inverter.

Since you have the batteries already I would definitely run things off of them and use any external power to recharge those batteries.

There are a lot of others here that have great power setups that can add to this.