Thoughts about the Spring Fire in Colorado

[mpruet]

I'm one of the nomads who doesn't have to be nomadic.  I chose to be nomadic.  I have a lot of respect for the folks who have to be nomadic because of their situations and have learned a lot from them.  I particularly enjoyed talking with folks at the last RTR and learned a lot from those discussions.

OK - I don't HAVE to live nomadically.  I don't have to constantly find part-time work to make it through the year.  I'm not forced to live on BLM land.  I have had a fortunate life and also was fortunate to have a passion for my work.  So my work was never just a job, and because of that in retirement I'm in a fairly good position - enjoy donating to folks less fortunate than myself, etc. 

I have (or may have had) a place in Cuchara Colorado.  It is in the San Isabel forest.  I was forced to leave my Cuchara place because of a mandatory evacuation last Friday caused by the Spring Wildfire.  I don't know if the fire has reached my place, so don't know the full impact of the fire on my life.

I have seen several folks in the forums whining about how the BLM and forestry service has tried to enforce their rules. There is no place for that.  They enforce those rules for a reason - period. 

Now I don't know if Jesper Joergensen was a nomad or not, but I doubt it.  From what I've read he was a rather vocal anarchists and somewhat anti-Semitic - not what you would call a nice guy.  And to try to claim that he was simply negligent is somewhat absurd because there have been signs all over the place for the past couple of months stating all of the fire restrictions.  The ONLY fire allowed was in a self-contained propane grill.  Anyone who has been in the Colorado forests has seen all of the warnings about open fire - not only this year but every year.  And this yahoo decided that those rules didn't apply to him. 

If they can make the arson charge stick - and I suspect that they will be able to do that - then this guy deserves whatever penality they can charge him with.  Unfortunatly since he is not a US citizen, he will probably end up with only an eviction.  

He has caused a LOT of people to lose all that they had - and there are a lot of folks in that area that didn't have very much to begin with. 

Now - for the folks on this forum whining about the BLM and forest rangers - - - ...  Colorado has long encourgaged open usage of their forests, but that sentiment has been shifting along the I-25 highway.  If this guy is what we would call a nomad, then I wouldn't be surprised to see the state shutdown free camping - period.

 

[highdesertranger]

"I have seen several folks in the forums whining about how the BLM and forestry service has tried to enforce their rules. There is no place for that. They enforce those rules for a reason - period."

I agree with this part. however,

" If this guy is what we would call a nomad, then I wouldn't be surprised to see the state shutdown free camping - period"

Colorado as a state cannot shut down the National Forest or BLM land.

highdesertranger

 

[mpruet]

Colorado as a state cannot shut down the National Forest or BLM land.

highdesertranger

They can shut down the state roads accessing those areas...

 

[highdesertranger]

"They can shut down the state roads accessing those areas... "

no, no they can't. highdesertranger

 

[mpruet]

"They can shut down the state roads accessing those areas... "

no,  no they can't.  highdesertranger

I don't want to have to argue with you, but ---   I grew up in the Talladega National Forest and I saw how the state of Alabama was able to exclude camping within the forest by simply closing the access to the forest camping areas by blocking the access to the state and county roads.

 

[wagoneer]

That would be interesting indeed but the pushback would be monumental. Just run a tight camp No BS All the fires here in California are feeding the no burn flame. I understand that.

 

[AreWeLostYet]

"I have seen several folks in the forums whining about how the BLM and forestry service has tried to enforce their rules. There is no place for that.  They enforce those rules for a reason - period."

I agree with this part.  however,

" If this guy is what we would call a nomad, then I wouldn't be surprised to see the state shutdown free camping - period"

Colorado as a state cannot shut down the National Forest or BLM land.

highdesertranger

If you heard today's live talk by Bob Wells, you heard him say that local governments may be influencing federal agencies to block access to public land, particularly if it's near their town. Now with these fires everywhere you can extend that out a few hundred miles.

 

[mpruet]

Let's not hyper-ventilate.  ;-).  He was burning trash on his own private property.  He was not a nomad, but is a non-citizen.  However, there was a major NO BURN in effect so it is considered arson since he was in violation of the current burn rules. 

Colorado doesn't really care about weed.

 

[lenny flank]

Geez, the tinfoil just keeps getting thicker and thicker.

 

[highdesertranger]

I don't want to argue either but state and county roads cannot be closed just because some one wants to. the roads are owned by the people in the state/county. they can be closed but there is a whole lengthy process that the state/county must go through. of course emergency closures for natural disasters are an exception and temporary. it's actually easier to decommission a road, this is used when a new road has replaced the old road. highdesertranger

 

[AreWeLostYet]

I don't want to argue either but state and county roads cannot be closed just because some one wants to.  the roads are owned by the people in the state/county.  they can be closed but there is a whole lengthy process that the state/county must go through.  of course emergency closures for natural disasters are an exception and temporary.  it's actually easier to decommission a road,  this is used when a new road has replaced the old road.  highdesertranger

> natural disasters are an exception and temporary<

Like baggage searches, phone tapping, data collection and hoarding, equipping police with military armored vehicles, Patriot Act, real ID were all temporary measures after 9-11. Uh Huh

The press is running with the current wildfire disaster and in some quarters they are bound to be speculating out loud about 'how many more of these fires are caused by these Gypsy Nomads living on public land. We will all be slimed.

 

[John61CT]

And what?

What is to be done?

 

[DLTooley]

Stay cool for one. Talking to local rangers, as well as the local District management is crucial. The people that I find the most malicious are those that own property near the Forest boundary and are just seeking to restrict access and make it their own private domain.

Colorado is a State heavily influenced by oil and gas conservative interests. The outgoing Democratic Governor is definitely an oil and gas guy, as are both Senators, one from each party. Battles between these conservative interests and the hippie environmentalists have been going on since the 70's. In my community I work hard to end those stereotypes and the divisiveness that results. It is not easy. I do find that hunters and fishermen are in tune with the natural environment and this is a good place to open communication.

 

[mpruet]

I just listened to one of the daily press conferences.  Yesterday the area had a significant rain storm and currently the fire is over 105,000 acres but is 35% contained.  I think that my condo is going to be spared.

 

[QinReno]

This site shows the extent of the Spring Creek fire on a topo map, apparently updated 37-minutes ago.
https://inciweb.nwcg.gov/incident/5875/
https://inciweb.nwcg.gov/photos/COC...g-Fire/picts/2018_07_06-15.24.36.457-CDT.jpeg