Starter battery bad- replace with dual purpose battery?

[KatBalouE350]

My son is ready to connect my Maxx fan to my starter battery but he thinks it's not in good enough shape. Reason being that even though the battery cables were just cleaned (3 weeks ago) the negative cable is significantly corroded again. Could be my very short driving habitd or the fact it was accidently drained multiple times in the last 2 months. Non the less, at this time I'm not feeling it is safe for the fan use.

 Would a dual purpose battery be a better choice for the temporary fan hookup? 

I don't have a clue about dual purpose batteries for use as a starter battery.

 Are these called Marine dual purpose?

Does anyone have any suggestions on which dual purpose battery would be a good starter battery for a E350 5.4L van?  What are the best cold cranking amps?

 

[Trebor English]

Corroded terminals happen when the seal around the battery post leaks and acid fumes come out.  Several times I have repaired batteries with a bead of epoxy glue.  Remove, gently, the terminal.  Clean the battery top with a damp paper towel.  Dry it.  Mix some epoxy glue according to the directions.  Using a toothpick make a bead of epoxy glue around the area where the post comes through the top of the battery.  Apply circular pressure to the post to try to get glue into the gap between the post and the battery top.  Be careful not to get glue on the post as the glue is an insulator.  Wait an hour or two for the glue to set

There are at this time two batteries in service that I have repaired this way.  They have had no further corrosion.

 

[Trebor English]

My 1999 Ford Windstar needed a new starter battery.  It had got to the end of the 3 year warranty and was self discharging.  One morning it would not start until I recharged it.  Rather than replace it with a $100 starter battery I got an $80 "deep cycle" battery instead.  

What I did was write down the dimentions of group size 24, 29, and 31.  I measured the original battery location to find the biggest common size battery that would fit.  I folded some cardboard and shut the hood on it to measure the max height.  I thought group size 24 was the biggest size that would fit.

I made a chart to compare different batteries that size.  I compared price, weight, reserve capacity, amp hours, and cold cranking amps.  I also copied the descriptions.  I got the one that had the least cranking amps, the lowest price, and the most weight, amp hours, and reserve capacity.  The words said things like motive power and wheelchair and did not mention starting or dual purpose.  It is less cranking amps than what the Ford owner's manual recommends.  I have not tried to start the engine in North Dakota in January.  I stay mostly in Florida.

Mainsail has disassembled 12 volt batteries and has determined that most are poop.  Deep cycle batteries with significant numbers of cycles in 12 volt are apparently unicorns.  If there is a difference I tried to get one better for deep cycling.  It will take 2 more years to be proved to be better than another group size 59 starter battery.

It's been a year and it still works.  It is supposed to be 75 amp hour and I use about 10 to 15 amp hours with a full recharge almost every day.  Solar works well.  It is not a regular lead/calcium maintenance free car battery as it takes 30 to 40 ml of water per cell per month.  I use led lights, MaxxFan, cell phone charger, electric shaver, and netbook computer.  

There is no solenoid isolator as there is only one battery.  When I don't want to drive I can stay parked indefinitely with the solar.  When there are too many consecutive rainy days the alternator charges it as well as can be expected.  I have never taken a 4 hour drive just to charge it and realize that the partial state of charge cycling is bad for it.  When the sun comes out it will get a full charge.  

I don't have a jump box, lithium or lead.  I have never discharged the battery to the point that it won't start the engine.  I pay attention to the amps used and the recharging voltage and current.  

I don't know about your 5.4 L V8.  My 3.8 liter V6 starts fine with fewer cranking amps than Ford recommends.  Depending on your climate you may need lots of cranking amps.  You may be able to fit a big enough battery to get the recommended cranking amps in a "deep cycle" battery.  You may have a dilemma where a dual purpose has the cranking amps but a "deep cycle" is a bit short on cranking amps but might be better as a "deep cycle" battery resource.  Since you might be buying a battery soon anyway this would be a good time to research and plan an experiment.

 

[jonsun]

I bought those valuecraft things from walmart a week ago for a starter battery. $50 any size. they're made by johnson controls. this is taboo as hell to say buy get a couple of them and use them as deep cycles. they wont last as long but for $50....

the difference is starting batteries have plates with a bunch of indents to give surface area for high output, short bursts. Deep cycles have big thick plates that cant take way more abuse but dont have the surface area to output as many high amps.

 

[user 37446]

Gee guys, you take all the fun out of answering a question. I wanted to give some bit of information that would earn 100 likes but you guys have covered it!  

From "benignblog.com", whatever that is:

Begin quote

"[font='Droid Sans', sans-serif][font='Trebuchet MS', sans-serif]Causes And Compounds Formation:[/font][/font]
[font='Droid Sans', sans-serif]In case of sealed lead acid battery (also known as SLA battery or dry battery), corrosion happens when electrolyte makes its way out to battery terminals through any leaks or joints. In case of flooded lead acid batteries (wet batteries), electrolyte can jump out while carelessly pouring water into cells. Also, fumes of sulphuric acid which is a part of electrolyte and actually responsible for corrosion keeps arising out of vents of flooded lead acid batteries when battery is charging or hot. Overcharging heats up the battery and heat increases the volume of electrolyte filled inside it. This electrolyte can leak out of vents of overcharged flooded lead acid battery if it is topped up with too much water and also SLA batteries through loose joints.Posts of lead acid batteries are mostly made from lead. Lead itself is a stable metal. Its reaction with sulphuric acid is very slow. If contact happens at battery posts, the compound which is formed as a result of reaction is lead sulphate[font='Droid Sans', sans-serif]( PbSO4 )[/font]. The chemical reaction between lead and sulphuric acid is accordingly:[/font]
[font='Droid Sans', sans-serif][font=Times, 'Times New Roman', serif]Pb (s) + H2SO4 (aq) [/font][font=Times, 'Times New Roman', serif]→[/font][font=Times, 'Times New Roman', serif] PbSO4 (aq) + H2 (g)[/font][/font]
[font='Droid Sans', sans-serif]Sometimes, it also happens that copper clamps or ringed copper terminals which are used to connect battery with wires corrode. Copper itself is not reactive even if dilute sulphuric acid is poured on it. But when electricity passes, it reacts with sulphuric acid and produce copper sulphate ( CuSO4 ) along with water and sulphur dioxide gas. The equation of this chemical reaction is following:

[font=Times, 'Times New Roman', serif]Cu (s) + 2 H2SO4 (ℓ) → [/font][font=Times, 'Times New Roman', serif]Cu[/font][font=Times, 'Times New Roman', serif]SO[/font][font=Times, 'Times New Roman', serif]4[/font][font=Times, 'Times New Roman', serif] (aq) + 2 H[/font][font=Times, 'Times New Roman', serif]2[/font][font=Times, 'Times New Roman', serif]O (ℓ) + SO[/font][font=Times, 'Times New Roman', serif]2[/font][font=Times, 'Times New Roman', serif] (g)[/font][/font]
[font='Droid Sans', sans-serif]The white substance which you see around battery terminals is either lead sulphate made from the reaction explained one paragraph above or anhydrous copper sulphate made from the reaction explained in above paragraph. Anhydrous copper sulphate changes to blue colour when water is added to it. The bluish substance which you see around corroded copper terminals or copper clamps is hydrated copper sulphate."[/font]


[font='Droid Sans', sans-serif]So yeah, buy a marine battery from Walmart, it likely will be able to spin that 5.4 ok, as long as its a big one. MOst marine batteries have the CCA and reserve capacity minutes on them, that's the tip off that they are not a true deep cell rv battery... no matter what they say on the top or sides...[/font]

 

[SternWake]

Fitting in the largest marine/ dual purpose battery which will fit is a better course of action than buying a starter battery.

Truth is the marine dual purpose battery's internals, plate thickenss and number and plate paste density, is much closer to a starting battery than it is to a true deep cycle battery.

The only time I would say to go with a pure starting flooded battery is when one is on a budget, but still winters in North Dakota, cannot shoehorn in a larger battery, and is unlikely to ever deeply cycle the battery, intentionally or otherwise.

With starter batteries it is important when they are cycled, to get them back to full, Quickly. Not 82%, not 95%, not even 98%. These passing grades are OK, but only half as good as 100%.

I've been through many marine dual purpose 12v batteries. All of them had 'deep cycle' on the sticker, none of them were designed for deep cycling. A starter battery can be deeply cycled, it just can't do it many times.

If one is really wanting a mega starting battery shich is capable of both deep cycles AND still startgin the engine easily when depleted to below 50%, then the AGM batteries by Odyssey and NOrthstar( X2power at batt+) are impressive in both these characteristics.

BUt they are very expensive, and they are not immune to improper treatment. They also pretty much require that they are high amp recharged when deeply discharged.

I've been using a group 27 Northstar for close to 4 years. It is my only battery. It can easily start my engine depleted 65 of its 90AH capacity. It can take everything my cold fast spinning alternator can make(~100 amps) and loves it. It would however make a poor battery for deep cycling if Solar were the only charging source, or the alternator was the ONLY charging source.

I bet a lot of flooded marine battery's plates are no different than a starter battery, the difference is the Marine battery will have Automotive posts, and Threaded studs where the starter battery will have only posts.

One thing that needs mentioning as well, is that when the green and white corrosion grows arounf the battery terminals, this is a sign the seal at the post/stud is compromised, and this can be caused by OVERtightening. Far too many people really crank down on the nuts and break that seal on initial installation. Every hear of Iffy lube joints overtightening oil filters or drain plugs, well the guys who install batteries from AP chain stores are just as likely to go all mongo on the poor terminal which only needs to be tightened to a pretty low torque spec. Basically just to the point one cannot turn the terminal on the post/stud with their hand. How this leverage is applied to the nut is also a concern as one can put the stress downward on the battery case, or sideways, or use the wrench in a manner where most of the force is just twisting.

Exide batteries are notorious for spewing green and white corosion, and this is likely the cause is that the lid is not strong enough to handle the torque applied by the 99% of people who see Nut and bolt and think they need to exert the same torque as they would on their wheel lug nuts is the course of action to take.

The 'free battery installation' at auto parts stores sounds great, especially as batteries are heavy, but many people who do the installation only know one thing, Lots of torque, and not a lot of torque is required, or desirable. I'd say 1/8th turn past the point one can not twist the clamp on the battery post.

Often, when the battery terminals are heavily corroded the only way to get it to stop twisting on the post is by overtightening, compressing the lead (PB) of the terminal clamp. If this has to be done to ensure a tight fit, the battery post clamp is worn out, and should be replaced, rather than overtorquing the nut, bolt which will compromise the seal where the post/stud leaves the top of the battery, and ensuring that the corrosion quickly forms.

In the post above we see the term Deep Cell battery, which is synonmous with Deep cycle battery.

Why? well a true deep cycle battery is taller, each cell is deeper, with more space under the plates for sheddings to accumulate before they rise and short out the cell.

Basically any fliided battery, designed to fit underhood in a car or truck, Cannot be a deep cycle battery, as none of them are tall enough. If the plates on a group 31 battery were as thick as those on a golf cart battery, the battery would have about 1/3 the cold cranking amps as the starter battery and not be able to start the engine under 60 degrees farenheit. There are no true deep cycle group 31 29,27 or 24 batteries.

There are batteries marketed as such. Trojan, a top quality battery maker sells a group 31 battery and proudly displays deep cycle on the sticker, but it is rated at only half the total amount of deep cycles as their true deep cycle batteries.

Beware of marketing. Marketing in this day and age is lying and trickery and deceit all designed to part the maximum amount of people with the maximum amount of money possible.

The heaviest flooded marine battery which will fit underhood is a good course to follow, if you want to carry a bathroom scale with you, well pics or it didn't happen!

Seriously though, a group 27 starting battery is about 48 Lbs. a group 27 marine battery from wally world is about 52 pounds, a top quality group 27 marine battery from trojan is about 60 pounds.

The wally world group 27 will be rated at 115 Amp hours, yet the heavier and much more expensive trojan is rated at only 105 AH capacity.

The group 27 52 LB wally world battery will be rated at 650 to 750 CCA and 115 Ah capacity
The group 27 60LB trojan is rated at 620CCA and 105 AH capacity and likely costs 70% more.

On paper this makes the wally world battery look superior.

If both batteries are treated well the trojan will last 2x as long in the same usage
If both batteries are treated bad, the trojan will likely last no longer, but an aggressive equalization charge cycle is likely to restore some lost capacity and performance, if one has the ability, tools, experience to perform an EQ charge.

There are few true deep cycle flooded batteries. The trojan t-1275 is one. this size group is generall called the GC12 and was never intended to be put inder the hood of a vehicle. The are commonly called scrubber batteries, for those rotarty floor polishers one sometimes sees custodians using to polish floors with.

Do these have enough CCA to start A V8 engine, well yes, most of the time, but not when well depleted in cold ambient temperatures.

So do stuff the biggest marine battery you can underhood. Do your best to recharge it fully, not relying on just the alternator to do so, especially if you are regularly cycoling it.

But then again, you bought the battery to work for you, not the other way around. Feel free to abuse your battery by discharging it more than you should and not recharging it as much as you should, just do not ecpect it to live a long happy life.

 

[user 37446]

X2

SW is "da man" on all things battery. If your budget allows, do what he has done and get a true 12V AGM Deep Cycle for dual starting and house battery usage. If it doesnt allow, then purchase the heaviest (weigh them as he suggests) marine battery you can cram in. Be prepared to "kill" your battery due to not charging it correctly, but sometimes it is better to learn on a less expensive battery than ruin a $400 AGM.

Read up on our electricals subforum for all things about batteries, wiring, alternator charging methods and solar.

 

[SternWake]

Well technically the Northstar and Odyssey AGMS are dual purpose batteries, very high CCAs, higher than a regular starting battery by a good 20%, and can handle deep cycling, as long as they are recharged at high amperage when deeply cycled. Their marketing says deep cycle on them, but they are not a dedicated deep cycle AGM, though like all batteries, they can be deeply cycled. These can just reconver from it more times, if recharged properly

Lifeline is the true Deep cycle AGM manufacturer They say no less than 20 amps per 100Ah of capcity when cycled to 50%. Odyssey says 40 amps minimum. Northstar does not say but I treat my Northstar like an Odyssey and it always responds very well to a high amp recharge from its most depleted state, and I have never gotten such great performance from any battery, even factoring in the high initial cost.

BUt in general, any flooded marine battery, which will fit in the stock location, will be better than a regular starting battery, except in North dakota, in winter, with 20w-50 in the sump.

Starter batteries are all about maximum CCA, cold cranking amps, and a competitive price.

Beware of higher AH capacities. I used to buy wally world flooded marine 27's long ago, then Crown marine batteries. They advertised 115AH capacity. They weighed 52 to 54 Lbs.

My current Northstar AGM battery weighs 64Lbs is rated at only 90AH capacity and is en route to easily outperform 3 group 27 crown or wally world batteries in the cycles per $ ratio.

I am cycling it way way deeper too.

But I can recharge it properly with 3 diferent voltage optimized charging sources I control manually. If I could not, I would be buying the wally worlds or whatever flooded/wet group 27 or 31 marine battery was cheapest.

 

[Scott7022]

Good suggestions and great knowledge base to draw from. I will add one more if you budget allows for it and you can find something to fit or make something fit. If I had to go with a single battery system and was going to be solar/alternator charging it and using it daily for power my choice would be the new Firefly batteries. My electrical marine guru in Vancouver has put these in all his personal boats, and now most of his customer rigs as well. They are as close to a lithium system without any of the headache and a fraction of the costs. I don't know if they make anything other than a group 31. Not familiar enough with the van to know if the mount can be modified to fit a group 31.
https://www.bruceschwab.com/advanced-energy-storage-systems/firefly-energys-oasis-group-31/

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

One thing no one else mentioned was battery warranty.  "Marine/RV" batteries usually only come with a 12 or 24 month warranty instead of the 48, 60, or 72 month warranties usually found with starter batteries.  And if you use it for a "non-intended purpose"  possibly they wouldn't warranty it at all.  Something to look into as you make your choice.

 

[KatBalouE350]

Wow! A wealth of information given here! Thank you so much!!  I have to get the battery today so no time to research what is best out there.

Sternwake , I told my son about your information on to much pressure applied when hooking up tbe batttey and he is willing to do it himslf accordingly. 

Trebor I did use the cardboard idea to get hieght measurements for the new battery. 

I dont have a good charging system yet, so as SW said I am heading for Walmart to find the cheapest  heaviest 27 or 31 Marine battery I can afford.  Have to keep expenses down so I can get a decent solar set up.

 

[SternWake]

Regarding the oasis firefly, well this is my opinion, but they are not yet proven.  And have also had reports of leaking from the caps.


It would be great if they lived up to their claims of resistance to PSOC cycling, I would spend the 500$ per battery, but the only reports we have regarding this, could be biased. many of the same claims as to resistance to sulfation were made when AGM and Gel batteries were first introduced to the market, and proved very false.

But they have had supply issues, and are now manufacturing them in India.

UNtil I see some real world usage  by an unbiased source, one who does not simply want to pat themselves on the back for their wise purchase, or who is personal friends with the patent holder, I will be sitting on the fence.

It is easy to ring the 'works just fine' bell, when any product is still new in its sevice life, which the fireflys are.  Even easier when one cannot actually quantify remaining capaity or measure performance and its degradation.  Battery failure  for  a high percentage of battery uisers seems to always come as a surprise and right up until that point, everything is just fine thank you very much.

Many of the marine guys really know their stuff. Many are merely Parrots.



Beware of parrots, and marketing.   Marketing is now basically lawyerly  approved lying.  Masters of deception with maximum profit on their minds.

The Firefly is making some really big claims about resistance to sulfation in partial state of charge cycling, and I am not convinced this is true, no matter how many times I read it repeated.

Wal mart calls their group 31 a group 29.  13 inches long, ~9.25 inches tall, about 115 to 125AH capcity.

Could be made by Johnson controls or eastpenn Deka, or possibly someone else, depending on the region of the country and whatever yields maximum profit.

While batteries should come fully charged, full charge takes time, and time is money.  The vehicles charging system is not great at returning a battery to full charge.  It is wise to put the new battery on a charger overnight so one is sure that at least they are starting out with a fully charged battery.

  Relying solely on an alternator to recharge a regularly cycled battery, even a shallowly cycled one, with no other charging source applied somewhat regularly to achieve that 100% the vehicle never has the time or voltage to achieve, is unwise.

Those buying the Odyssey or Northstar for use primarily as a starting battery, occassionally cycled, should deeply cycle it and then recharge it at high amperage soon after purchase to a true full state of charge, to help wake it up.

My Northstar -27 would not hold a resting 13+ volts until I did this, nor did it have that scary fast starter cranking ability which frankly stunned me.  The NS battery was easily cranking the engine faster than 2 fully charged group 27 flooded marine batteries did. 

Approaching 4 years of age and ~600 deep cycles, many to well below 50% state of charge, this 90AH battery has lost some of that starter cranking Oomph, but in terms of voltage held overnight for the same AH removed from it, well I can take 45 AH from it, remove loads and voltage quickly rebounds above 12.2v.

This is not so true if I only do the solar only low and slow recharges for more than 5 or 7 cycles, then the voltage does not quickly rebound above 12.2.  After a high amp recharge to full, it will for another 5 or 7 cycles.

It is now overdue for the 50% depetion and 40 amps applied until 14.7v is reached then 14.7 held until amps taper to 0.45 or less, which is considered full.

 

[Scott7022]

Good points and as the OP has to get a battery today she is not going to be able to get a Firefly. I had ordered eight for my build and then changed my mind and went back to the Battle Born system. My buddy is a true buddy, as in same school, shared girlfriends, woke up drunk in a ditch together buddy. So he makes zero on what I buy and I get his knowledge straight up. I did not know about the India switch and that does make me go hmmm. But it also makes sense as I ordered eight a long time ago and then had some detailed discussions with Battle Born, and a Skype call and then changed my mind and my "Guy" said no issue I can flip your eight to guys waiting cash in hand. Be sad to see the quality take a hit with offshore manufacturing. He swears by them and has them in his 33 Scarab. You can't break them are his words. Keep in mind I rolled his 1976 Triumph TR6 with his girlfriend and future wife in the passenger seat.

 

[SternWake]

Well it is good to have another good report on them.

I'd love if the claims proved to be accurate.

BUT, Ive spent all this time figuring out and acquiring the tools to extract maximum lifespan from a regular top quality AGM that cost 325$. Might still go with the same when that time comes.

 

[Scott7022]

Hey, Sternwake, If you have it worked out then why the heck not! I won't be able to add anything personally as I am going with Lithium and two Mechman custom alternators. Like I said I changed my mind. If you have Ninja'd the absorbed glass matt Rock on my friend!! Sincerely! It takes a great deal of effort and skill! What ever powers your personal boat!

 

[SternWake]

It would be nice to not have to worry about achieving full charge regularly, It would also be hard to unlearn this mindset.

Regarding the india manufacturing, well I am suspicious of all those companies which developed a good reputation then shipped manufacturing overseas, screwing people here, then quality taking a dump and the reputation taking a long time to fade.

My shoulders pull my personal boats.

 

[KatBalouE350]

View attachment 14617Okay. Got the battery. Went to Costco but nothing thst would workrd. My son and I pushed through the weekend crowd and 102 degree weather over toWalmart. They had two 27s but no 31. Bought the Marine/RV  27. It reads: 109 Marine amp hours @1 A. What does that mean? Is different then 109 amp hrs @ 20 hrs? Also it reads 750 Marine cranking amps. Os that the same as Cold cranking amps.

Anyway it was really the only choice as being  correct size. In fact it may be a very tight squeeze. 

Now after all was done and said my son and I agree its just to hot to install a fan so the battery is on a charger. It read 12.7 when connected but the charger  has been on about 25 minutes and it has not yet dropped to float.

 

[SternWake]

Wal mart marketing.

The standard rte of battery capacity measurement is at a 20 hour rate. a 5 amp load for 20 hours until battery voltage drops to 10.5v means it is a 100 amp hour battery.

A group 27 will be anywhere from 100 to 115 amp hours but I would lean towards 100.

I have personal experience with t a very similar schumacher charger to the one you show.

The thing's voltage reading is very inaccurate. Mine was 0.25 volts away from actual at 12 amps and 0.65 volts off at 25 amps output. Also the button which one can push which states the state of charge as a percentage, well this is voltage based and quite inaccurate, especially idf the voltage is no where near accurate.

Marine cranking amps is measured at a higher temperature than cold cranking amps.

Your battery is good enough for your intentions. You have it on a charger, you are doing the right thing.

If you use the battery a lot with the engine off, just put it back on the charger when you get home.

I do have to warn you about these schumacher chargers though. Sometimes they will go upto ridiculously high voltages, Mine would/will regularly shoot up past 16.4 volts and this is abusive. This behavior is widely reported on these chargers all over the internet.

The occassional blast upto 16.4 on an abused battery might be an OK thing to get it back to true full charge, but not every single timeit is plugged in.

I recommend not leaving it unattended especially if it is wired into the vehicle while charging.

I also recommend getting a cheap digital multimeter.

Harbor freight sells a good enough digitial multimeter for checking resitance and voltage. Sometimes they give it away free with purchase of something else or coupon.

https://www.harborfreight.com/7-function-multimeter-98025.html

A more functional digital multimeter is the clamp on ACDC ammeter. When clamped over any single wire, it can show how many amps are flowing through that wire. This is very useful in terms of figuring out how much load is on the battery, like from a fan, or how much amperage a charging source is delivering.
Such as if your battery was accepting 10 amps at 12.7 volts, it is no where near fully charged. If it was accepting 1 amp at 14.7 volts it would be very close to fully charged.

Here is an inexpensive DC clampmeter that I have no personal experience with:
https://www.amazon.com/Signstek-UT2...rd_wg=tFgRz&psc=1&refRID=2BXXNGGS9N8GRY4J6FWR

Any cheaper and it might only measure AC amps, instead of both AC and DC.

Without knowing the amperage flowing, voltage can be quite useless, but knowing how many amps are
flowing at that voltage, in or out of thebattery, can be quite enlightening.

Wal might sell a group 29 which is an inch longer than the group 27, and is basically the same as a group 31, but no matter now.

If that charger goes to float soon, I'd recommend unplugging it, replugging it in, and put it on AGM setting and let it go overnight. it will drop again to float voltage, but instead of 13.2v it will stay at 13.7v and this is more likely to squeeze in the last few percent of charge.

These chargers usually stop a bit shy of 100% charged. Once in float there is no risk of it shooting back upto 16.4v+, that only occurs before 'float'

I'd not leav ethe battery plugged in for 2 weeks on AGM setting in hot ambient tmeperatures, but overnight is fine on the AGM setting.

The AGM setting might also keep the 16.4v masochistic schumacher episode from occurring.

My schumacher of similar appearance is from 2007, Its display no longer works. It is undependable. i don;t trust it on any battery I care about without monitoring it.

 

[John61CT]

Any Firefly Oasis G31 currently sold, and AFAIK into the future, are US made.

It is the other sizes the US distributor (Bruce Schwab @ Ocean Planet) is **testing for quality assurance** through the fall, not yet for sale.

If Bruce & co sign off on them, they have tremendous support & warranty service, then I for one would be happy to buy the new made-in-India sizes.

If someone buys through other channels beforehand, likely drop-shipped from India, then who knows, I would recommend not doing that, just from a service & support POV.

This really is a ground-floor bootstraps operation, not yet fully solidified word of mouth, so I personally won't be worrying about any drops in quality, as long as we're dealing with Bruce and his authorized dealers.

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

More specific addendum to Sternwakes - as usual - excellent report.

Cold Cranking Amps are measured at 0 degrees F.

Marine Cranking Amps assumes it's in a boat, and therefor water must still be liquid.  So it's measured at 32 degrees F.  Thanks to the way cold temperatures affect chemical reactions, MCA will always be higher than CCA on any battery.