Quick Charge House Battery E car charger

[bullfrog]

Over at tnttt foamies fourm there is someone that is building a foamie trailer that also carries an ev battery pack to extend the range of his ev tow vehicle. In one of the linked videos they suggest it could be used as a battery bank for other uses also. Reminds me of some of the powered trailers we used to see built out of VWs by just mounting the drive train to a trailer with cable/ hydrolic controls to the driver in the tow vehicle. Some of the beach patrols in California used their's with their patrol buggies for on demand 4 wheel drive when needed all you had to do was hitch up the trailer to the vehicle that was stuck. Early electric vehicles did the same thing with VW Rabbits as a gasoline powered backup when the battery died. I would think an ev powered cargo trailer would meet the Volta requirements and be handy when you van gets stuck as well. Better start looking for wrecked Teslas!

 

[highdesertranger]

the problem I see with that is if you say the trailer can propel itself it is no longer a trailer by definition it's know a self propelled vehicle and must be registered and insured as such to meet Volta's requirements to be a propulsion battery. now you have open a new can of worms with federal safety requirements. highdesertranger

 

[kllcbosmetris]

who ever is paying for the electricity is ME -

Charging station Owners are Happy to sell electricity to who ever wants to pay for it -ME

How about you keep your Opinions on what is legal about what I am doing to out
of my posts - you  have no real knowledge on this subject - ie security guard

you already slandered me in a earlier post - you accused me of theft of services -
I have documented this - so just stop -

Ton of jealous & uneducated people, who have never been to a charging station, love to spread the rumor that it is theft (no buddy, you stealing WIFI from McD without eating there is theft) not realizing that you have to either have a (paying) membership or use your credit card to use most if not all of these charging stations.

 

[bullfrog]

Since it can't be operated without a vehicle towing it I would be inclined to think of it as an accessory/ev conversion of the vehicle towing it much like a powered winch and therefore covered under the towing vehicle's insurance and registration.

 

[highdesertranger]

all the ones around here are free. read the email I posted Volta's are free and they are spread though out the country. I asked for you people with the pay to use ones to email the company that owns them and ask for there official position and to post the email here. no jealous or uneducated people here. I emailed the company and asked. btw I don't use public wifi so your info there is totally wrong and if I use wifi I am not paying for I ask permission before I use it. hey if you don't want to email them post their name up here and I will email them for you. highdesertranger

 

[kllcbosmetris]

now why didn't you say that in the first place.  I said I didn't know about Texas.  around here all the charging stations are free to EV's so far as I can find only EV's are allowed to use them,  there isn't even a way to pay.  I didn't  accuse you of anything I said,   "using the electricity for uses other than what it is intended is theft."  around here the charging stations are intended for EV's only.  highdesertranger

How a moderator doesn't know what a "thread crapping" or "thread hijacking" is, I have no idea: 

"Thread crapping occurs when a person comes into a thread and posts something contrary to the spirit/intent of the thread, often derailing the discussion or turning it into an argument."

"A thread hijacking occurs when individuals commenting on the original posting, go off topic, creating a separate conversation. This is rude, and bad internet etiquette. If people want to discuss a different topic, they should start their own thread."

This isn't a discussion about people using free facilities inappropriately. OP has clearly stated he in Austin. On more than one post, made it clear he is and will be a paying customer. Why would you accuse him with theft and alienate a relatively new member (with limited posts)? You have done this in the past as well (any time this topic came up). Why would you not allow a friendly environment where a conversation (about the implementation mini split A/C unit OR connecting  heavy-duty lithium 24v Tesla batteries OR installing a charging unit to accompany the system, all of which were mentioned in the original post and none of which were properly covered in this forum -- and therefore can be very educational to a lot of people) can help the community members who can benefit from (which may not include you and that is okay) the discussion. 

P.S. Clearly uneducated because admittedly you didn't know charging stations were not all free. 
P.P.S. I don't see you fighting this hard to kill a discussion for any other situation (i.e., people dumping their casette toilets or worse sh*t bags into Walmart restrooms or people using McD WIFI or Taco Bell toilets without buying an item), so one can only conclude there has to be some jealousy towards people who has the means to develop such (one may say capital heavy but sustainable) system.

A while ago, the founder of this site made a 'may i have your attention' announcement that _such unwelcoming negativity and thread hijacking_ would not be tolerated. That should include moderators as well.

 

[tx2sturgis]

the problem I see with that is if you say the trailer can propel itself it is no longer a trailer by definition it's know a self propelled vehicle and must be registered and insured as such to meet Volta's requirements to be a propulsion battery.  now you have open a new can of worms with federal safety requirements.  highdesertranger

Federal safety requirements (NHTSA, FHWSA, DOT, etc) do not apply to any kind of home-built trailer, self-propelled or otherwise, as long as it is not used for commercial purposes and crossing state lines.

States establish the rules that apply to home-built vehicles and trailers for personal use.

 

[tx2sturgis]

How a moderator doesn't know what a "thread crapping" or "thread hijacking" is, I have no idea: 

"Thread crapping occurs when a person comes into a thread and posts something contrary to the spirit/intent of the thread, often derailing the discussion or turning it into an argument."

I can see both sides of this one. On the one hand, there was the misunderstanding by HDR of how other states provide EV charging services, but, there is also the desire to discourage members who have asked about something that pushes a 'hot button'.

Suppose a new member with a few posts asked about how to set up an outdoor big screen movie and entertainment venue at the RTR, complete with a 50,000 watt surround sound music system, remote sound towers, 45 foot jumbo-tron, elevated brass poles with scantily-clad women, 40 foot tall neon palm trees, strobe lights, smoke generators, and a full bar, but only asked about the solar array and batteries needed, cable sizes, fuse ratings, etc.

Do we answer the specific questions, or do we condemn the original idea?

I'm fairly certain that HDR or another moderator would 'crap' on that thread, right away.

They have a job to do. Occasionally they err on the side of keeping this forum's integrity intact.

Of course, when *I* have made errors, I publicly apologize in the relevant thread. (twice, recently, in fact)

Like I said, I see both sides of this....but I do like the fact that the OP is 'thinking outside the box'...as long as the details are all worked out, and if the E-charge companies are fine with it, so am I.

 

[Matlock]

To the OP,
I'm curious and always interested in mobile power storage options. A Tesla battery is worth a look but as always a couple questions.

I'm reading that a new, complete battery pack will take between 300-500 charge cycles. Using 2- 5kwh battery packs, that are (I'm assuming) "used" and out of the vehicle, no mileage is available to determine approximate charging cycles, how can I know that a roughly $1k + pack is worth purchasing? Calling cycles a Time Vs Travel thing for my use.

Second question, I'd plan on charging from a plug-in-pay station. Have you looked into what plug adapters will work for charging and who sells them? My "assumption" again is there isn't a one-size fits all available.... yet.

I'd like to keep my existing solar/battery setup and use a tesla type pack for more demanding use that does not require immediate recharge.

Looking forward to your battery system thread.

 

[terranaught]

You may have problems from heat if you quick charge w/o the cooling system connected, as different temp batteries will have different voltage/state of charge.

 

[John61CT]

OK we've established that **some** public-access charging stations are not free.

It may also be the case that some are fine with people drawing power for use other than vehicle propulsion.

I don't know, but just because you are paying does not mean the latter is true.

Many private companies & organisations and also tax dollars are committed to subsidizing these stations for the purpose of encouraging EV adoption rates.

If you want to be **sure** you are not stealing, identify the owner of the public access station, the one who paid for the installation and is paying for the electricity, and learn what their policies and restrictions are.

 

[John61CT]

Little confussing on the new plug in hybred vehicles they state you can use it to power an RV yet state charging stations are to be used only for drive train batteries. Will those vehicles not be allowed to use charging stations?

The battery storage in a hybrid is very limited. Extended off-grid living will require running the gennie off gasoline to charge your House bank.

 

[John61CT]

Obviously, spend enough money and have all the electrickery knowledge, anything is possible.

That said, I strongly discourage regular people from trying to use EV packs removed from all the car's BMS and temperature control systems as a House bank in a mobile context.

Hobbyists working on Science Projects, hopefully figuring out how to reverse-engineer and DIY **replace** those BMS and temperature control systems should be doing so out in the back shed or otherwise safe location when things go wrong.

I am sure the day will come when sources I trust will release the tested gear required along with detailed step by step instructions. Then hundreds of people will be early adopters alpha-testing in their RVs and vans IRL, living in close quarters on top of very dangerous banks.

That is the point where I might consider it appropriate to post in general dwelling forums, as opposed to electric hobbyist and EV ones.

And should always have warnings like this posted ideally by the OP.

Meantime, the only non-lead chemistry I consider safe enough for mobile use is LFP, and within that, only purchased new, either packaged systems supported by vendors active in the buyer's country, or if DIY, then based on large known-quality prismatics.

 

[highdesertranger]

no one has offered up any info on these pay to use charge stations. I want to see verification from the company running the station that it is ok to use for other than EV use. until we get that we are just speculating. the 2 members were quick to talk smack but so far have offered no proof to back up their assertions. highdesertranger

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

I wasn't going to comment again until OP returned to report success in using EV charging stations for a month or two, since up to now it is all speculation.  But here goes:

And nobody needs to ... offer info on those charges (other than the fact they you pay for the electricity you use and service is not free or theft -- in OP's area) because this thread is not about charge stations . . .

The OP made it an issue with his response to those who raised possible issues with his plan.  Those two issues remain unanswered:  
     Is it legal in Texas to park a non-EV at an EV charging station? 
          In most states it is not.
     Plug-in Austin charge stations are subsidized, so how will city look on non-EV uses?

Others may try to copy this in states where it is clearly not legal.

I'm anxious to hear OP reporting repeated success.

 

[bonvanroulez]

I just did a quick google image search with the keywords "Austin Energy EV charging stations" and "Plug-in Austin".
Here are 3 images, all originating from austinergy.com.
Each picture shows a sign "Electric Vehicle Charging Only", and the charging pedestal also says in orange "EV charging only".
I would be shocked to learn that their meaning of Electric Vehicle Charging extends to RVs and vans powering their air conditioning.

 

[tx2sturgis]

Thanks for the pictures! There are very few charging stations near me, and none that are operated by Austin Energy. 

A bit ironic, since a huge majority of their wind energy is generated within a few hundred miles of my 'home base'.

I fired off an email to Austin Energy, If I get a reply I will post it here.

 

[tx2sturgis]

I finally received a reply from Austin Energy.

Here is the text of the email I sent:

______________________________

Staff:


I belong to a forum concerning RVs and the question has come up:

Is a paying customer allowed to charge the 'coach' or 'house' batteries in a ICE (internal combustion engine) powered van or RV at your EV charging stations?

These batteries are used for running electrical loads such as air conditioning, refrigeration, and lighting in the van or RV, not for propulsion.

Another question: Are vans that are true EVs allowed to charge these 'house' batteries along with EV propulsion batteries on the vehicle?

Some information regarding the allowed use and legality, or whatever applies, would be helpful for our members.

Thanks for any insight you can provide.

Signed Brian H------



Here is the reply:

_____________________________

[font=Calibri, sans-serif]Hi Brian,[/font]

[font=Calibri, sans-serif] [/font]
[font=Calibri, sans-serif]I thought I had emailed you a while back, sorry about that! It was quite overwhelming before and after the Holidays with requests. What an interesting question! I don’t know of any laws or our own guidelines to prohibit such charging. [/font][font=Calibri, sans-serif]From program/payment perspective, you can technically use your PIE ChargePoint card to charge cell phone, bike, car. As far as the hardware goes, you could also technically charge your van/RV if it has the appropriate outlet and is equipped to take 240V charge.  Some of our old generation chargers have 110 V plugs that you could use as well. If you do decide to use these stations, please be advised to practice good charging etiquette and not hold up a popular charging station at a popular destination. Let me know if you have any other questions, and I can ask someone if I do not know.[/font]
 
[font=Calibri, sans-serif]Thank you,[/font]
[font=Calibri, sans-serif] [/font]
[font=Calibri, sans-serif]Caitlin Bullock[/font]
[font=Calibri, sans-serif]EV Operations Specialist[/font]
[font=Calibri, sans-serif]Electric Vehicles & Emerging Technologies, Austin Energy[/font]
[font=Calibri, sans-serif]Office: 512-482-5331[/font]
[font=Calibri, sans-serif] [/font]
[font=Calibri, sans-serif]Follow us on Facebook! - www.facebook.com/AustinEnergyElectricVehicles/[/font]
[font=Calibri, sans-serif]www.pluginAustin.com[/font]
[font=Calibri, sans-serif] [/font]

 

[highdesertranger]

thanks Texas that's a totally different response then I got so I guess it depends on who's charging station you want to use and maybe where you are at. highdesertranger

 

[GypsyJan]

I appreciate the differing ideas and opinions on each post as debates help me become better informed.