Still researching how to insulate the van. there seems to 37 ways to go about it, vapor barriers, mold this material that one. i am thinking of polyiso and maybe, installing an outside trailer vent and on the inside near the roof a register to let the material breath and prevent mold. oh i live in Michigan so it can be a bit chilly. any thoughts? thanks
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TrainChaser
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Hearbob: are you going to try to live in the van, in Michigan, in the winter? If so, it has 'trouble' written all over it.
hearbob said:
Can you explain your proposed vent concept a bit better please? From what you said:
hearbob said:
What is an "outside vent" vs an "inside vent"? Isn't a vent a hole in the unit of some kind that lets air in and out of the unit?
TrainChaser
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If I understand science correctly (this could be pretty iffy), surfaces will sweat in a closed unit if there is a) a living creature exhaling in it, or b) if there are wide swings in temperature.
If you won't be living in it in winter, you won't be exhaling in it.
If it stays cold for long periods of time, there might not be an issue with that, unless you are opening and closing it. I have the same questions about your post that RVtrek does.
If you won't be living in it in winter, you won't be exhaling in it.
If it stays cold for long periods of time, there might not be an issue with that, unless you are opening and closing it. I have the same questions about your post that RVtrek does.
There's no problem living in a van in Michigan, Alaska or Siberia
If it is well insulated, ventilated and you have reliable heating.
Just takes a lot of knowledge, work and time, and of course money, which can to some extent substitute for the other three.
For extreme conditions, consider buying a reefer van, like ice/meat/fish delivery, morgue truck etc
For DIY, try for 3-4", yes space becomes an issue, less insulation then heat source becomes more important.
EPS and XPS foam do better than polyiso where absorbing moisture is an issue.
EPS no offgassing, also Thinsulate MARINE is good but expensive.
Spray foam can fill in the gaps, but some gassing, bothers only some people.
Make sure not to block drain holes bottom of body panels.
Try to create a good vapor barrier inside the insulation, but know it won't be perfect.
Ceiling is always critical hot or cold, floor more so against heat gain. Hot weather you want white or very light paint color outside.
Do all the wiring systems first, or build conduits into the design, also plan for vents, lighting, power plugs & switches, mount points for shelving.
If it is well insulated, ventilated and you have reliable heating.
Just takes a lot of knowledge, work and time, and of course money, which can to some extent substitute for the other three.
For extreme conditions, consider buying a reefer van, like ice/meat/fish delivery, morgue truck etc
For DIY, try for 3-4", yes space becomes an issue, less insulation then heat source becomes more important.
EPS and XPS foam do better than polyiso where absorbing moisture is an issue.
EPS no offgassing, also Thinsulate MARINE is good but expensive.
Spray foam can fill in the gaps, but some gassing, bothers only some people.
Make sure not to block drain holes bottom of body panels.
Try to create a good vapor barrier inside the insulation, but know it won't be perfect.
Ceiling is always critical hot or cold, floor more so against heat gain. Hot weather you want white or very light paint color outside.
Do all the wiring systems first, or build conduits into the design, also plan for vents, lighting, power plugs & switches, mount points for shelving.
jonyjoe303
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I been using rtech foam for almost 5 years, whenever I need more insulation I just hotglue foam on top of other foam. Though I installed the foam to keep cool in the summer, it also keeps me warm in the winter, I only have to run a heater in the morning when I wake up.
I run a swampcooler almost year round (even in the winter when the sun comes up it gets warm), never had any problems with mold.
The more foam you install the better. You can find the rtech foam in home depot (about 9 dollars for a 4 foot by 8 foot sheet 1/2 thick) , hotglue is the best way to install, it drys quickly and sticks to everything. Just cut the foam in small sections.
I run a swampcooler almost year round (even in the winter when the sun comes up it gets warm), never had any problems with mold.
The more foam you install the better. You can find the rtech foam in home depot (about 9 dollars for a 4 foot by 8 foot sheet 1/2 thick) , hotglue is the best way to install, it drys quickly and sticks to everything. Just cut the foam in small sections.
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Every Road Leads Home
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Polyiso seems to be the tried and true material among vehicle dwellers, that would be my choice. Great R value per inch, cost effective, easy to work with, readily available.
RVtrek said:
hi, i would be putting an outside trailer designed vent on the outside bottom of the van and on the inside a register vent at the top of the constructed inner wall that is over the insulation. the intent being that the vent will allow the wall to breath and prevent condensation from building up and causing mold
Overthinking.
Just don't make it that well sealed in the first place.
The vapor barrier approach is one way, some air circulating behind the insulation is the other.
The real key is to avoiding / clearing condensation is decent cfm ventilation while things are buttoned up, and a good strong heater to regularly dry things out.
Just don't make it that well sealed in the first place.
The vapor barrier approach is one way, some air circulating behind the insulation is the other.
The real key is to avoiding / clearing condensation is decent cfm ventilation while things are buttoned up, and a good strong heater to regularly dry things out.
BinDerSmokDat
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If cold weather is your primary concern, research shows XPS provides better results than polyiso....
Remember that R values are calculated at a standard temp. (75F)
They aren't tested across a range of temps.
Remember that R values are calculated at a standard temp. (75F)
They aren't tested across a range of temps.
BinDerSmokDat
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Another thing to consider in the insulation /condensation equation is heat source.
Any heaters that burn fuel are going to produce a lot of water vapor as a combustion by-product.
Electric element heaters produce no water vapor.
Any heaters that burn fuel are going to produce a lot of water vapor as a combustion by-product.
Electric element heaters produce no water vapor.
TrainChaser
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Today I was picking some old hot glue off some wood. It was the first time I had ever done that. Looking at it closely, it looked like wax. I checked online, and it is about 30% wax. No wonder it comes apart after a while! Never expected that...
BinDerSmokDat
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Thanks John61CT , I had actually typed out both of those points but then removed them to keep it simple.
I guess it needed saying after all.
Electric heat is not completely unfeasible off batteries, I've looked into it.
With a well insulated van, some solar boost during the day, it is doable.
Electric element heaters have the benefit of being very efficient, they turn almost all the current to heat.
Remember that the heat doesn't need to run non-stop. I see it as a fill-in to keep the van from freezing during the day when you have solar, without generating condensation, then switch to fuel at night when you are less active and need more heat.
I don't plan on doing a lot of winter living in the van and I have a few fav spots with electric hook-ups that i frequent early -Spring, late-Fall so I will definitely have an electric option in my van.
Another good choice is plain old incandescent bulbs, as they throw off almost as much heat as an electric element, with the added bonus of lighting.
Almost 95% of the current is converted to heat and 5% light. If you run a few hundred watts of 12V incandescent bulbs you can heat and light at the same time.
Though that MAY be a little bright for the inside of most vans.
I guess it needed saying after all.
Electric heat is not completely unfeasible off batteries, I've looked into it.
With a well insulated van, some solar boost during the day, it is doable.
Electric element heaters have the benefit of being very efficient, they turn almost all the current to heat.
Remember that the heat doesn't need to run non-stop. I see it as a fill-in to keep the van from freezing during the day when you have solar, without generating condensation, then switch to fuel at night when you are less active and need more heat.
I don't plan on doing a lot of winter living in the van and I have a few fav spots with electric hook-ups that i frequent early -Spring, late-Fall so I will definitely have an electric option in my van.
Another good choice is plain old incandescent bulbs, as they throw off almost as much heat as an electric element, with the added bonus of lighting.
Almost 95% of the current is converted to heat and 5% light. If you run a few hundred watts of 12V incandescent bulbs you can heat and light at the same time.
Though that MAY be a little bright for the inside of most vans.
If the bank is past the Absorb stage transition, so panel watts would otherwise be "wasted" , then this usage as load shedding would be a good idea.
I would rather see some thermal buffering / storage like a well-insulated hot water tank, can then use a little radiator to release it later, also get hot showers.
From free energy.
Frater calls it opportunity usage?
But complex, heavy, pricey takes space, would only be worth it in some situations.
I would rather see some thermal buffering / storage like a well-insulated hot water tank, can then use a little radiator to release it later, also get hot showers.
From free energy.
Frater calls it opportunity usage?
But complex, heavy, pricey takes space, would only be worth it in some situations.
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