My Van Has a Mind of it's Own! - Help!!

[James AKA Lynx]

Check for low, manual, idle adjustment. It may be to low. I did that once or twice or .....<br><br>James AKA Lynx

 

[Ziggy Moon]

@ <strong>highdesertranger</strong> - Although I don't know how long it will take me to determine the actual cause.... when and if I ever do, I will definitely post it on this thread - along with all other checks/changes/fixes that I've done during the elimination process. <br><br>All of the great responses offering help/advice is gonna keep me busy for a few weekends..... but it's all good. <img src="/images/boards/smilies/smile.gif" class="emoticon bbc_img">

 

[ontheroadagain]

try google for "dodge ram stalling crank sensor"

 

[Ziggy Moon]

I'll check that out, OnTheRoadAgain! Thank You!

 

[Ziggy Moon]

Yesterday, while surfing through auto forums (specifically dodge related) in search for more possible reasons for my stall problems, I ran across the following;<br><div><br><br><em><span style="color: #0000ff;">"</span><span style="color: #0000ff;">There may be lots of reasons a car stalls [...], but one that most people wouldn't think of is low automatic transmission fluid</span><span style="color: #0000ff;"> levels.</span></em><span style="color: #0000ff;"><em>"</em><br><br><span style="color: #000000;"><br>For the life of me, I can't figure out why this would be (I don't claim to be an expert mechanic, just mechanically inclined.)<br><br> However, it was just a week or so ago that I topped-up the fluids, and yes, the transmission fluid was low, and since then - I haven't had a stall occurrence (as far as I remember) ............. but of course I just found this info yesterday, and in the past few days I've been working on some of the things advised in this thread by others.<br><br>So now, unless I get a stall, I may never know if my low transmission fluid was the actual cause - at least not until it becomes low again. But, if it never occurs again, that'll be just fine!&nbsp;</span> <br></span><br><br><br></div>

 

[wrcsixeight]

I think a major clue to the vehicles behavior is its refusal to start for a while after stalling. &nbsp;This eliminates 99% of the common tune up items. &nbsp;Something is overheating and freaking out, like the fuel pump or something in the PCM, or some combination of events is happening like the cranks sensor(for spark timing), or the hall effect sensor in the distributor(fuel injector timing), their wiring or perhaps the sensor itself once it reaches a certain temperature just decides to not return a portion of 5 volts back to the PCM. &nbsp;Next time it stalls the key dance trick to check codes will either be very helpful, or reveal nothing. &nbsp;Codes are sometimes stored without the check engine light illuminating, and sometimes they clear themselves once the engine restarts and operates normally for a while, so doing the key dance often is wise when troubleshooting.<br><br>Make sure to use ATF+4 and nothing else in these dodge transmissions. &nbsp;The dipstick might say dexron2, but do not believe it. &nbsp;That dipstick it responsible for more toasted Dodge transmissions then those who climb hills in overdrive. &nbsp;Transmissions do not use/ burn fluid, they leak it, so knowing there is a leak, one should be on top of keeping the levels correct, and that is done with the engine idling, in neutral, on level ground with a dodge.<br><br>The crank sensor is where the bell housing meets the engine. &nbsp;I don't think they are all that expensive, but making sure the wiring appears OK and its bolts are not allowing movement is a wise idea before throwing parts at it.

 

[James AKA Lynx]

The ingition switch in the steering column may be going bad. Also it could be a broken wire or bad connection. Check for spark first. Use a timing light.<br><br>James AKA Lynx

 

[Ziggy Moon]

<span id="post_message_1278060974">I think a major clue to the vehicles behavior is its refusal to start for a while after stalling.</span>

<br><br><br>Yes, good point, wrcsixeight - and those sensors (crank and cam shaft), along with other things, is what I changed on that Jeep that gave me such a hard time troubleshooting... and in the end, it turned out to be the computer.<br><br>Crap, ATF "<span style="text-decoration: underline;"><strong>+4"</strong></span>..... uh, I used ATF (is all my manual stated)... is this OK? Didn't have to ad much at all... did I do something wrong again? Doh!<br><br><em>I'm still putt putting away on the simple things advised by many first, the things that cost nothing to very little until my next stall.</em><br><br>Thanks!!<br><br>

 

[Ziggy Moon]

@ <strong>Lynx</strong> - Not thinking it's the ignition switch, all seems fine with that... I've went thru and eyeballed and re-taped the seemingly ton of wires running all over the place... <br><br>The next thing on my list, since the van is needing a tune-up, is to visually inspect plugs, wires, cap, rotor, etc.. but of course while I'm doing this, it would probably just make more sense to have new parts ready - and just do the dang tune-up.. <img src="/images/boards/smilies/biggrin.gif" class="emoticon bbc_img"> ..... but money is really tight at the moment - hence my working on the simple to very cheap things first.<br><br>Thanks for all your input, Lynx! &nbsp;

 

[Ziggy Moon]

<strong>Two Week Post-Op Follow-up!</strong><br><br>Results: <em>Zero Stall Occurrence Since Preforming the Following;</em><br><br><ul><li>Cleaned Battery Cables &amp; Terminals (<em>corrosion found</em>)</li><li>Removed, Cleaned, Reinstalled IAC Valve (<em>heavy build-up found</em>)</li><li>Inspected All Electrical Wiring, Top-to-Bottom (<em>no bare wire found</em>)</li><li>Topped Motor and Transmission Oils (both slightly low)</li><li>Cleaned Throttled Body</li><li>Changed Air Filter</li><li>Added Fuel Additives (to clean fuel injectors and displace possible water in tank)</li></ul><br>I've been putting more miles on the van in the past two weeks of doing the above (trying to see if it will stall)...... She's running good so far!<br><br><strong>Thanks Guys!</strong> Will Post Future Follow-up.

 

[James AKA Lynx]

Great!<br><br>You may want to add to your list cleaning the fuel tank. That requires taking it out and dumping the contents. A 4+ hr job.<br><br>Don't buy the aluminum Distributor cap. They will fail in 8000 miles. <br><br>James AKA Lynx

 

[highdesertranger]

james do you mean the aluminum contacts distributor caps those are junk.&nbsp; never buy for those for&nbsp;anything always get top of the line parts.&nbsp; highdesertranger

 

[James AKA Lynx]

They will last 6000-8000 miles. The top line parts will last MUCH longer. No need for the extra work.<br><br>James AKA Lynx

 

[Ziggy Moon]

Well today I jumped in the van - low and behold, another problem. My ignition switch went bad. This could have been related to my stall problems, I think someone mention it as a possibility, but I didn't think much of it because the switch never seemed to not turn and work properly. As a matter of fact, until today it gave me no clue that anything at all was wrong with it..... so, I opened up the steering column and got to work right away.<br><br>The part below is what I figured was bad, so I bought it..... brought it home, put everything together.... NOPE! Didn't worK! pulled it back apart and finally spotted the real problem.<br><br><img rel="lightbox" src="http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd390/hddotson/Lock02.jpg" class="bbc_img"><br><br><br>This part below, the actual key switch, had broken right at the bottom... I just didn't see it beforehand<br><br><img rel="lightbox" src="http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd390/hddotson/Lock01.jpg" class="bbc_img"><br><br>So, the price for this part is $70.... I don't want to pay this! <br><br>My thought is that I can get some sort of toggle switch to star the van, bypassing the key switch all together..... but here's where I need help! <em><br><br><br></em>When it comes to wiring/electrical, I am DUMB - I need help with the type toggle switch to get... I have been successful in determining the correct wires to start the van, I started it by crossing four wires off the column. I just don't know what type switch to look or ask for......... can anyone help?<br><br>.

 

[highdesertranger]

well ziggy if you are not comfortable with the electrical I wouldn't start trying to micky mouse your ignition system.&nbsp; can't you just reinstall the switch leave the key lock that failed off and use a screwdriver to turn the switch?&nbsp; highdesertranger

 

[highdesertranger]

oh and btw it is not a very good idea to start moving wires around willy nilly to try to find the right ones.&nbsp; before you find the right ones you might find the wrong ones.&nbsp; highdesertranger&nbsp;

 

[Ziggy Moon]

LOL ... No! That ain't gonna work highdesertranger. And, with more research I've found that the toggle idea won't work either (unless your an electrical engineer, I guess). <br><br>Here's the info I found;<br><br>

To modify a computer-controlled vehicle in this manner would require the key to unlock the steering wheel and an electrical nightmare to incorporate the security system, the computers, fuel injection, ignition and a multitude of other systems. The final result would be a thousand times more expensive than replacing the ignition switch

.<br><br>I don't know!!!! I electrocuted myself as a child and since then I've stayed away from all things electrical - hence the needed knowledge. I better just pay the man the $70 for the part needed - When it Rains, it Pours...... Dang-It All.

 

[Ziggy Moon]

<span id="post_message_1278237385">oh and btw it is not a very good idea to start moving wires around willy nilly to try to find the right ones.&nbsp; before you find the right ones you might find the wrong ones.</span>

<br><br>I thought about this, but geez, give me credit for trying (frigging Haynes Repair Manuals kinda suck these days <img src="/images/boards/smilies/tounge2.gif" class="emoticon bbc_img">)&nbsp; - hopefully I didn't cause more damage and all I'll be is $70 poorer later in the day.

 

[Seraphim]

Two thoughts here:

Had a similar problem in two different vehicles. The first, after a fuel pump was replaced in a car, and the installer used an inappropriate fuel pump. The car would eventually stall after a while, but restart again after several minutes. The fuel pump was not providing the proper pressure. While you haven't replaced your pump recently, I think a pump which is going bad might be the issue. The second car was fuel injected (haven't figured out if yours is, but most likely if it's an early 90s) and the throttle body sensor would go bad - sending improper info to the computer, resulting in stalling, but only when it rained or was humid. No water leak, but the sensor got thrown by damp conditions.

Of the two, I think the original suggestion about a fuel system problem is most likely. Probably the pump. No expert, here, though.

 

[Ziggy Moon]

@ Seraphim - The second seems to make sense. <br><br>Just so happens after changing out the ignition switch today (see above previous posts), I had my first stall in over two weeks. Now at first I was pissed because the van has really been crapping a lot of parts in the past year. And this stall crap has been an issue for maybe six+ months. I've been trying to slowly work through the great suggestions made to this thread, one of which suggested that it could possibly have something to do with the ignition... but seeing how it wasn't more than an hour after installing a new ignition (see above previous posts) and I get yet another stall, well it doesn't seem like that was the answer. Until today, I really thought I had fixed whatever was causing the van to stall.<br><br>Anyway, I did the usual 5-10 wait/crank and she went on about her business without another stall for the rest of the day.<br><br>Your info regarding your second car made me think....&nbsp; today was in fact a very humid day, and trying to think back on the other stalls... well it seems that it was either humid or rainy when they occurred. BTW, my van is Fuel Injected. <br><br>This may be something I'll have to look into. But, if I change the throttle body sensor will it just continue to send bad info to computer, as you stated? If so, then how would I once and for all solve this problem - if the sensor is indeed the actual son of satan!?<br><br>*Are you referring to the throttle position sensor?<br><br>Thanks for the input, Seraphim.<br><br>