Money/job issue is my biggest obstacle to living the RV life

[GaiaGoddess]

Go to http://earlyretirementextreme.com/ and read the 'Early Retirement Extreme' book for free online.

I've just spent the last 2 hours on this website. Pretty interesting! The book isn't free though, you can only preview the first chapter for free. I did read a few articles and checked out the forum though.

I think there is a huge difference between Jacob's philosophy and the philosophy of people in this forum. I guess some might be living in RV's to save money, but I was under the impression most people who live in RV's also like to travel a lot. Jacob doesn't seem to believe in travelling, and doesn't even own a car. Travelling and going on road trips are 2 of my favorite things in life, I could never give those up. A huge part of why i want to live in an RV is so I can travel more often. Jacob recommends living close to things so you can just walk, to me that sounds like a prison-like nightmare, lol I live for being able to explore, drive, see new cities, crank my music with the windows down, have indepenence to be free! If I was limited to a few-block radius around my job and home, I would go crazy within one week, not to mention I would never see my family and friends because they live an hour away round trip.

I did get a few good ideas from that site though...mainly how to cook & buy food cheaper (I'm an organic food snob though so this one might be tough for me, lol). Also a lot of the suggestions I have already done, such as wearing clothing that is a decade old or more, only buying it when necessary and from used clothing stores. I even avoid grocery stores if I can, I buy a lot of my food at Trader Joe's and the like, it's mostly organic and all cheaper than grocery stores. The only downside is these stores are 2 hours away round trip from where i live. I guess that's the price i pay for living in a cheap town, it's in the middle of nowhere with very little options.

 

[Cammalu]

Gaia,
You can still go small and have a bathroom. The class B vans have them. Have you looked at them? You could trade the car in perhaps and use it as a daily driver and keep the job till you are ready to go.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[GaiaGoddess]

Gaia,
You can still go small and have a bathroom.  The class B vans have them.  Have you looked at them?   You could trade the car in perhaps and use it as a daily driver and keep the job till you are ready to go.  


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I have researched all types...Class B's are the least desirable for me. I don't like how everything is in one big room, I would feel too cramped in there. I have actually been considering 5th wheels the last few days, I would have to get rid of my Escape and buy a pickup, but 5th wheels are the only ones that have the layout I want (loft bedroom, side dinette) and they are easier to tow. The blue book value of my Escape is $7000 and I could get $5000 for my mobile home so with that money I could buy a 5th wheel and I could afford truck payments (in the place of my lot rent)...now if I could just figure out what to do for a job, lol

 

[kayell]

"I have researched all types...Class B's are the least desirable for me. I don't like how everything is in one big room, I would feel too cramped in there. I have actually been considering 5th wheels the last few days, I would have to get rid of my Escape and buy a pickup, but 5th wheels are the only ones that have the layout I want (loft bedroom, side dinette) ..."

Here is your problem. Your desires are bigger than your needs and your available income. If you keep thinking that you NEED this much stuff and space, or that your wants are necessities, you'll never be able to get out on the road. You've made it sound like you're downsizing and living cheap, but if you are stuck on wanting a 5th wheel (for one! person) to live this way, you're nowhere close to living inexpensively.

Remember, the beauty of living this way is that you live OUT of the van rather than in it. The great outdoors is your living room.

 

[ArtW]

This seems kinda contradictory...first you said you don't need a new car every 10 years but then you said I could have bought another one instead of fixing mine.


I did post all of my bills, in a previous post. I put averages, not exact amounts, because a lot of them vary, but the average is good enough.

Another USED car, that didn't need $3k worth of repair
I bought my Ranger for $1600 cash, other used cars can be had for similar
That's a lot less that $3k, the cars might not be as nice as a newer car, but they can be reliable
If you love your Escape, fine, it's your decision, but you are now telling us it's in such bad shape you will soon need another vehicle, anyway, that's not very good reliability

I recall you posting all the emergency expenses that drove you to this point that drove you to this point, but no rundown on regular bills vs income
in fact, scratch bills, expenses, all household expenses with $ amounts
I know different places have different costs of living, but generally it evens out, higher food cost but lower rent, higher rent but lower food cost
That's one reason I think you need to run your budget by someone local, they'll have a better grip on your local cost of living (you do have a written budget, don't you? if not, write one)
Anyone pulling down $300 a week isn't going to live high off the hog, I don't think you're buying the crown jewels or anything, hell, me, you, and Kayell are all at near poverty wages, if not at poverty wages, no one is splurging a lot, but it's amazing how different different folks definition of 'necessary' is
just as one example, when me and my ex split, she had as much income as me, and lived in HUD rent controlled housing, and had a car given to her, and couldn't make ends meet
the same year I bought a motorcycle cash, with a monthly rent 3x what she was paying (she went to mamas, then the HUD place, leaving me stuck in the lease)
the diference of course is our definition of necessary
But as ERLH said, we're 6 pages into 'try this' 'Nope, can't do it' and i just don't see any progress being made
If you can't spend less, you're gonna have to earn more, and I don't see a way for someone already working 60 a week to get another job

 

[Queen]

I'm going to try one last thing, then I'll be done with your threads.

You have 29 posts on this forum, 27 in this thread, with the other two in your intro thread. Take a break from rationalizing why nothing anyone suggests will work, step outside yourself, read other threads, learn more, become part of the community here, see how others have made the leap.

 

[GaiaGoddess]

"I have researched all types...Class B's are the least desirable for me. I don't like how everything is in one big room, I would feel too cramped in there. I have actually been considering 5th wheels the last few days, I would have to get rid of my Escape and buy a pickup, but 5th wheels are the only ones that have the layout I want (loft bedroom, side dinette) ..."

Here is your problem. Your desires are bigger than your needs and your available income. If you keep thinking that you NEED this much stuff and space, or that your wants are necessities, you'll never be able to get out on the road. You've made it sound like you're downsizing and living cheap, but if you are stuck on wanting a 5th wheel (for one! person) to live this way, you're nowhere close to living inexpensively.

Remember, the beauty of living this way is that you live OUT of the van rather than in it. The great outdoors is your living room.

My goal isn't necessarily to live cheap...it's to travel the country and be free of sitting in one place all the time. I don't want to be uncomfortable doing it, I want to be happy. I know the outdoors is where we will spend most of our time but that doesn't mean I don't need a dark quiet cozy bedroom to sleep in. I will be having people with me in my RV sometimes (my boyfriend, people I meet at festivals) so I need something more homey than a van.

 

[GaiaGoddess]

Another USED car, that didn't need $3k worth of repair
I bought my Ranger for $1600 cash, other used cars can be had for similar
That's a lot less that $3k, the cars might not be as nice as a newer car, but they can be reliable

I trust a car that has had one incident of repairs over a car I don't know that is worth less than my car. To me what you're saying sounds like if you are in a serious relationship with someone and they make you mad one day, and breaking up with them for someone you don't even know, lol

If you love your Escape, fine, it's your decision, but you are now telling us it's in such bad shape you will soon need another vehicle, anyway, that's not very good reliability

Oh I think this is where you got mixed up...it's not in bad shape at all, it runs perfect. It ran perfect for 3 years before the repairs and it runs perfect now, and it's been a year. It's a 2008, anything worth a few grand would be a lot older than this. It blue books at $7000. My miles are at 90,000 and it's 10 years old, that is all I meant when I said it will need replacing at some point. 

I recall you posting all the emergency expenses that drove you to this point that drove you to this point, but no rundown on regular bills vs income

My apologies...I posted it in a private message, not in the actual forum, I thought it was in here...so i'll repost it here:

[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]My income is about $1200 a month, occasionally more but it's always at least $1200. My bills are;[/font]
[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Lot rent- $285[/font]
[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Electric- on average about $80[/font]
[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Water/Sewer/Garbage- on average about $40[/font]
[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Internet- $60[/font]
[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Cellphone- it varies depending on how much data I use but it's always under $100[/font]
[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Gas- on average about $120[/font]
[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Food/necessities- on average around $500[/font]
[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Credit card minimum payment- $20 [/font]
[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Property taxes- $48/year, probably not enough to make a difference but I had to include it[/font]
[font=Verdana, Arial, sans-serif]Car maintenance- routine stuff is about $50 a few times a year, maybe comes out to $13 a month but not counting repairs which have been almost $4000 this last year[/font]

But as ERLH said, we're 6 pages into 'try this' 'Nope, can't do it' and i just don't see any progress being made

By progress you mean abandoning what I want and just going with what other people tell me to do? I still can't compromise that. I am hopeful there is a way I can make this happen, it just hasn't been any of the ways I know about so far.

 

[GaiaGoddess]

GG,

IF, as you have stated, you are working 60 hours a week at $12 per hour and are taking home less than $300 something is very wrong. By my math you should be grossing $840 a week so more than $540 is being taken out of your weekly pay. That is about 65%. You should have a meeting with someone in payroll. Federal should be less than 15% I would think plus SS and the rest.

As to overtime putting you in a higher tax bracket and causing you to bring home less money that is a widely held misconception. Only the amount OVER the higher bracket threshold is taxed at the higher rate, everything below that point is still taxed at the lower rate.
http://www.investopedia.com/ask/ans...ax-bracket-cause-me-have-lower-net-income.asp

Guy

It isn't exactly 60 every week, that's just what it is when we work the maximum amount. Sometimes we only work 40 but my paychecks say 38 because we leave early on Fridays and that adds up to less time too. The last check I got I grossed $421 and they took $100 out in taxes so my check was about $320.

 

[AngryVanMan]

The actual weekly take home pay for someone making $12/hour and working full time with no OT, with one personal exemption, 5.35% Minnesota State Tax, FICA and Federal:

Gross Pay 480.00
Federal Income Tax 42.04
Social Security Tax 29.76
Medicare Tax 6.96
State Income Tax MN 5.35% 25.68
City Income Tax 0.00
Deductions 0.00
Final Pay Check 375.56

That's gross pay of 24,960.00 per year. The monthly take home is (375.56 x 52) / 12 or about 1627.42. I'd figure out why, if you are getting paid overtime throughout the year and working up to 60 hours per week, you are bringing home 5,129.04 less per year than someone who works only full time for $12/hour at 40/hours week. That's a giant hole in your budget big enough to drive a fifth wheel through.

The next giant hole is your $500/month food/necessities spending.. Seriously you spend almost twice as much for one person than I spend for two people on the same budget item? I'd recommend breaking that spending down a little bit more accurately to see where all that money is leaking out.

If this is really all you spend, I don't see how you have even managed to accrue credit card debt, there is no budgetary excesses in the spending list you provided.

 

[IGBT]

By progress you mean abandoning what I want and just going with what other people tell me to do? I still can't compromise that. I am hopeful there is a way I can make this happen, it just hasn't been any of the ways I know about so far.

I want a lot of things I can't afford.  Sometimes you can't always get what you want but if you try sometimes, you get what you need.

 

[highdesertranger]

doesn't your 100 buck phone bill have internet. I would either get a cheap phone plan without internet and keep your other internet or keep your phone plan and get rid of your internet bill. why pay for the same thing twice? that will free up some money to get that credit card paid off. it's going to take you forever to pay off a 4k CC bill @ 20 bucks a month. highdesertranger

 

[rvpopeye]

Look how good that line worked out for Jagger.

 

[DannyB1954]

Have you looked into food banks? Where I live, there are at least 3 of them. A friend of mine survives quite well on the food they give him. He actually likes it because of the variety he gets. He gets things he normally would not buy, then gets to figure out how to cook it. Some of it really surprises him that he actually likes it.
If you can cut your food bill in half or more, that adds up every week. Your income may also qualify you for food stamps.

 

[GaiaGoddess]

The actual weekly take home pay for someone making $12/hour and working full time with no OT, with one personal exemption, 5.35% Minnesota State Tax, FICA and Federal:

Gross Pay 480.00
Federal Income Tax 42.04
Social Security Tax 29.76
Medicare Tax 6.96
State Income Tax MN 5.35% 25.68
City Income Tax 0.00
Deductions 0.00
Final Pay Check 375.56

That's gross pay of 24,960.00 per year.  The monthly take home is (375.56 x 52) / 12 or about 1627.42.  I'd figure out why, if you are getting paid overtime throughout the year and working up to 60 hours per week, you are bringing home 5,129.04 less per year than someone who works only full time for $12/hour at 40/hours week.  That's a giant hole in your budget big enough to drive a fifth wheel through.

 Let me find some pay stubs and tell you the exact numbers. Ok i just grabbed any random 4 and here's what the numbers are exactly;

Check 1; 40 regular hours at $12.45/hr= $498
               7.35 OT hours at  $18.68= $137
               TOTAL; $635 (i'm leaving cents out)
               Taxes;  Federal- $79
                           FICA- $39
                           Medicare- $9
                           Minnesota- $33
                NET PAY - $473

Check 2; 39 regular hours- $495
               Taxes; federal- $58
                          FICA- $30
                          Medicare- $7
                          Minnesota- $24
               NET PAY- $374

Check 3; 33 hours - $421
               Taxes- federal- $47
                          FICA- $26
                           Medicare- $6
                         Minnesota- $20
                NET PAY- $320

Check 4; 40 regular hours- $498
               5 OT hours- $106
               Total gross; $604
                Taxes- federal- $75
                           FICA- $37
                            medicare- $8
                           Minnesota- $31
                   NET PAY- $451

I can't find any stubs where I worked 60 hours exactly, because it fluctuates so much, and when I take days off, I don't get paid for them, so it erases the overtime I worked. Any extra money i have that doesn't go to bills has gone to paying off my credit card, that's how I got it down from $3000 to $2000. That's the crappy thing about it, I might have extra money left over some months but it goes to that, I don't even get to save it.

The next giant hole is your $500/month food/necessities spending..  Seriously you spend almost twice as much for one person than I spend for two people on the same budget item?  I'd recommend breaking that spending down a little bit more accurately to see where all that money is leaking out.

I have said before that I value my health a lot, which means I don't buy cheap unhealthy foods. I buy organic whenever I can, which costs more, and I eat a lot, I seem to be always hungry. Probably $100 of that $500 is household items, cleaners, dish soap, toothpaste, shampoo, garbage bags, soap, light bulbs, laundry detergent, that all adds up. I would copy my last grocery receipt for you but my garbage just went out last night but I bought stuff like ketchup, eggs (cage free), bread (sprouted grain), pasta, a meat loaf pan (didn't have one yet), chicken (hormone free grass fed), lemons, basil, applesauce, tuna, mayonnaise, I wish I could remember everything on it...my bill was around $100 and some of the stuff will be gone in a week but some I'll still use for months, so it isn't like I spend $100 a week on all new food, it overlaps, a lot of it I will still have for a few months so it sounds more expensive than it is. If I lost my job I would still be able to feed myself for a few months. I probably only eat $200 worth of food a month rather than $400. But I go every week anyway because you always run out of something and then you buy more while you're there.

If this is really all you spend, I don't see how you have even managed to accrue credit card debt, there is no budgetary excesses in the spending list you provided.

I didn't accrue this debt slowly because i charge a lot of things, it all happened in one day, when i had to pay $3000 to get my car fixed. Otherwise i rarely use it, or I put so little on it that I am able to pay it off every month.

 

[GaiaGoddess]

I want a lot of things I can't afford.  Sometimes you can't always get what you want but if you try sometimes, you get what you need.

I don't get most things I want, lol Sure I would like to have new clothes, cable tv, a new vehicle, an actual house or even an apartment, most of all I want to be able to take vacations. That is probably why I crave travel so much because I've only been on one vacation and that was about 10 years ago.

 

[GaiaGoddess]

doesn't your 100 buck phone bill have internet.  I would either get a cheap phone plan without internet and keep your other internet or keep your phone plan and get rid of your internet bill.  why pay for the same thing twice?  that will free up some money to get that credit card paid off.  it's going to take you forever to pay off a 4k CC bill @ 20 bucks a month.  highdesertranger

Yeah my phone bill includes a data plan but that doesn't help me when i'm on my computer. I use my data on my phone when I'm at work, driving (for GPS), or at my friends house (he doesn't have the internet there). I can't get rid of my home wifi because one time when that was out, I used my phone as a mobile hot spot to use my computer and my usage shot up like crazy and I ended up having to pay like $200 for that month! Someone in a PM told me about those wifi jetpacks or whatever they're called, I am in the process of researching those.

 

[GaiaGoddess]

Have you looked into food banks? Where I live, there are at least 3 of them. A friend of mine survives quite well on the food they give him. He actually likes it because of the variety he gets. He gets things he normally would not buy, then gets to figure out how to cook it. Some of it really surprises him  that he actually likes it.
If you can cut your food bill in half or more, that adds up every week. Your income may also qualify you for food stamps.

Yeah I have gone to food banks before. It's all non perishable foods, like canned and boxed stuff. No vegetables or fruit or anything that needs to be refrigerated. I don't have health insurance so i can't take chances eating junk food.

 

[GaiaGoddess]

Goddess

My brain is hurting. You started this thread by saying that you work 60 hours a week. Later you add that you are earning $12 an hour but that you are taking home just over $300 a week. Still later you state that the overtime is mandatory. I tried to advise you that an incredible percentage of your gross income was being deducted and to get to the bottom of it only to then be told that overtime was not every week and was given the example of 38 hours as if that was more common. You then gave the particulars of your most recent check as being $320 from a gross of $421. A gross of $421 would be pay for 35 hours at $12!

60 hours is what we work if we work all the overtime, it fluctuates. And sometimes I do work the overtime but don't get paid for it if I need to take a day off. I have needed to take days off without pay due to my dad passing away, snowstorms, being sick, so although most of the time I do work most of the overtime, it gets erased when I miss days.

There has been universal agreement that you're attention should be focused on reducing your debt however you continue to make it your lowest priority. Amazing how there is only enough for the $20 minimum payment on the cards but $500 for food (organic) and $160 for phone/internet.

How is it my lowest priority when all my extra money goes to it? And $500 isn't all organic food, I do buy some normal food, and I also include household items in that too. And if someone can find me a cheaper phone/internet deal, I'm all ears. I just want to stay with Verizon because it's the biggest and has the most coverage and for a single female driving around a lot mostly at night, I need to be covered everywhere I go. When I was working in North Dakota in the middle of nowhere, I was the only person whose phone service worked 100% of the time. If I am travelling the country in an RV I would especially want 100% guaranteed coverage, I don't take chances with my safety or my health, that is why I might spend a little extra for healthy food and good phone service.

 

[AngryVanMan]

Nearly everything about the American way of life is a huge luxury, and if you can't part with even a single shred of the luxuries you've become used to, your chances for making changes are slim. Almost everything on your list is irrationally justified unnecessary expenses and telling yourself you need those things is basically a lie. You want those things because you've become used to having them, it's hedonic adaptation plain and simple.

The things you need to maintain your existence on this planet vs. what you have are worlds apart. If I wiped your memory, filled your pantry with rice and beans, gave you a library card, and took your car and put a rusty bicycle in its place, you'd make do if I told you had to or you'll die on the streets. You'd have money pouring out of your ears with nothing to spend it on if you weren't offered the choice.

You live in a place where you have a special metal cart that you can sit inside and "drive" to places instead of walking. You only need to pour in a smelly liquid from old plants every once in awhile to make this cart go. Inside this special cart there is even controls to keep the air around you comfortable, and another device that fills the air with pleasant sounds of music or words from far away. You don't even need to take care of your own cart, you can pay for someone to fix the cart when it breaks. Most people don't know how their own cart works!

You live in a place where you can drive, not walk, to a warehouse filled with food piled high on shelves, well-lit and climate controlled. It's cheap and plentiful. There is even special food that is somehow better than the other food, so it costs more! SO MUCH FOOD. You don't have to pick it, or kill it, or anything, it's just sitting there. Most people don't know where the food comes from or how it got there!

You live in a place where you turn a knob and water comes pouring out of a spout. There's even knobs that let hot water come out. You didn't even need to build a fire. You didn't need a bucket to catch this water as special buckets with special drains are mounted right under the spouts. Why? Because the spouts are right where you live, not down by a river on in the village square. Mere feet from where you sleep there is water in spouts!! Most people don't know how to fix their own spouts and pay someone else to do it!

You live inside a rectangular shaped box in this place that has no wind or rain blowing in. There is a small magical device on the wall that you can use to keep the temperature of the air in your box set to where you find it comfortable. Along with water spouts, these boxes have a special bucket where your body waste goes, a place to wash yourself under the water spouts, and a special place (inside!) where you can wash and heat up the food (from the warehouse place!) Most people have no idea how any of the items in their box work!

You live in a place where you have a tiny device in your pocket that you can use to talk to nearly anyone, at any time, no matter where you are or how far away they are. This device helps you feel safe even as you live in one of the safest places during the safest period in all of human history. Most people are afraid to not have the device even though it's not even as good as a rock if you're in any real immediate danger!

You live in a place where instead of traveling to see the village elder, you can connect a magic box to a signal that no one can see, and from there you can hear stories from all over the WORLD on demand. You can even send your own stories using this signal. Talk to people using the signal. Some people like this signal SO MUCH they pay for more than one magic box to get the signal even though they can only really use one at a time. Most people... yeah most people have no fricking CLUE how this signal works.

Above all, people (real people, really!) have convinced themselves they need this magical stuff. Not only do they need it, but they need the best of it, the special food, the best signal devices (or two), the nice big carts that use a lot more of the smelly plant liquid. Sometimes they need to make the rectangle box and the carts both hotter or colder by doing nothing more than pressing a button. Even with the special metal carts that can carry many things (even buckets!) , they need the water spouts to be in the rectangle boxes. If you gave them a yak or a goat they would probably be sad. You see, they almost all have these wonderful pastures around their rectangle boxes, but instead of feeding animals, they chop the pastures very short with special machines that run on that smelly old plant juice. Yeah, most of 'em can't fix their own pasture chopper or even tell you why they are really chopping their pasture. They are a very weird and very fragile people.