Minivan musings

[user 37446]

Hi all,

For those of you who wonder why I am flopping around between my Prius, a minivan, a midivan (Astro) and a full sized passenger van, its because, well, I keep flopping...  :-/

I still work, another year of driving at least 20 miles a day, plus weekend trips out to camp. So far I have been using my Prius but I just cannot see full-timing in it. I know a few do but I'm just not there.

Mileage and urban stealth are important. I will likely remain an urban dweller for the time to come, so its got to be able to park in both neighborhoods as well as at a work site and not draw unreasonable attention, so no step vans, box vans or class B's. It has to be street legal and licensed as a passenger vehicle, not commercial, so no 1 ton cargo vans. 

I drive appx 12K a year, the difference in gas between a full sized window van with a V8 which averages city/highway at 15 mpg, and a true 6 cylinder minivan which combined averages say 25 would be about 400 gallons (there's idling in there as well). At an expected average of $2.50 a gallon that's a $1,000 annually in fuel savings. Tires are cheaper too.  
The "midi-van" Astor's get not much better mileage than the E150's so I probably wouldn't go that route.

I cannot see myself so minimal (yet) to have everything I own in either type of van so there would be storage somewhere, thus no difference in cost either way.

My biggest hang up on a true minivan is ventilation. I've watched many minivan YouTube videos and no one talks about that. It's unreasonable to plop a F fan in the roof, I'm not cutting holes in the floor, so am feeling a bit stuck. Do most minivans side windows (back) pop out an inch or so?  I'm looking at 1999 - 2004, any brand will do. I note that a few, very few, have a power sunroof, which would ventilate but wipe out putting a bendable 100w solar panel between the luggage rack bars. I need that solar so as to run an 18L sized compressor fridge.

I get the whole room/comfort vs mileage tradeoff, after all, I have been traveling/camping in the Prius, so a minivan would feel large in comparison.  :shy:

Any help?  I know most of you don't have minivans, for good reason, but its the ventilation question that's paramount. Weather conditions vary but I endure summers in the 90'-100's and nights not cooling down as well as deserts do.

Thanks for any assistance. I hesitate to go full sized due to gas mileage but maybe $1K a year isn't too much of a price to pay, however how do you ventilate a full sized passenger van with the ceiling air conditioning ducts? 
:huh:

 

[John61CT]

My biggest hang up on a true minivan is ventilation.
...
It's unreasonable to plop a F fan in the roof, I'm not cutting holes in the floor, so am feeling a bit stuck.

Why not? You seem to be backing yourself into an impossible situation, paralysis by analysis.

Stealth is way overrated, it's your behaviour that may cause issues more than the vehicle, but in the end anyone who cares enough to pay attention will know you're in there.

So big deal, you're mobile, move along and park elsewhere.

For now at least, the cops aren't hunting us down, using centralized vandweller databases.

 

[Trebor English]

I have a 1999 Ford Windstar minivan.  I used a jig saw with a fine tooth metal blade to cut the hole in the roof for the MaxxAir fan.  It may be unreasonable but I find that it works well.  I have plastic rain guards on the front windows and leave them down an inch.  Some full size vans have two roof fans, an innie and an outie, but my roof isn't big enough for two plus solar.  With the MaxxAir fan all the way in the back the rear windows need to be closed to have airflow all the way from the front to the back.  The rear AC ductwork was not in the way and it sill works.

My solar panel is a regular 100 watt aluminum frame panel.  It is attached to the luggage rack a couple of inches above the roof.  

I don't usually park in neighborhoods.  Light industrial areas and big stores are plentiful and work ok.  Stealth isn't isn't a problem.  Ventilation and stealth may not be friends.  A good sized fan inside the back door hidden by the license plate might be invisible but it puts the sound down low.  Exhaust through the floor might be the only stealthy way.

Weather is a problem.  My mother in law is 94 and I visit every day or two so I don't go far.  East central Florida at the coast is regularly 70 to 80 overnight low and upper 80s lower 90s afternoon high.  The humidity is high.

For me the minivan size is just right, not too big, not too small, Goldilocks size.  I have room for everything I need and it is small enough to combat hoarding and collecting stuff.

 

[user 37446]

Appreciate the reply. I won't be cutting the roof due to not being sure if I would keep the minivan, i.e. If it's a fail, I will pull out the modular/temp contents and move up to a full size something. I will keep the seats stored until I decide if it is going to work. 

I will start going to used car lots and looking at minivan brands to see if their windows pop open, that might take care of the problem, until it rains that is...

As far as analysis, while I am in the rental condo I am researching as much as I can. Rent/utilities is almost $850 a month, stuck till the lease is up so just looking at options.

 

[Trebor English]

Appreciate the reply. I won't be cutting the roof due to not being sure if I would keep the minivan, i.e. If it's a fail, I will pull out the modular/temp contents and move up to a full size something.

My plan when I get rid of the van is to let the fan go with it.  It will be a $200 lesson not to do that next time.  If you cut the back door where the license plate hides the hole that shouldn't affect the resale value.  The driver side rear most window is pretty much useless for rear viewing.  You can take out and keep the glass and put in a piece of metal with a hole cut for a fan.

The same apply for a full size van.  If you decide you have to have a high top and need to sell the regular van all the issues are the same.  Keeping all the contents easily moved to another vehicle is what I have done too.

 

[John61CT]

Consider renting for a camping weekend to get a feel for the space.

 

[jonyjoe303]

For ventilation you will have to cut holes, unless you plan to leave the windows open. 
To stay cool with minimal power use, you will have to make major modifications. My astrovan I only paid 700 dollars for it, so it was not a big deal cutting holes in it.

I can tell you what works and what doesnt, roof vent didnt work for me, but I did install 3 of them because I thought I wasn't putting enough of them. Small fan didnt work either, even the endless breeze fantastic fan didnt keep me cool. 

What did work was a swampcooler, but that only took the edge off the heat, but what really worked was the foam insulation. I removed the oem headliner, and put 1" thick rtech foam (from home depot) all over the roof, on the rear windows, I also built a dividing wall between the driver area and rear of he van. 

The swampcooler needs outside air to work, I had to cut some holes on the rear of the van to feed the swampcooler.
 

On a hot day parked in the sun, all my windows closed, vent closed, all my ventilation comes from the top vent in the picture ( the bottom round vent I have capped off), it goes through a swampcooler. The front of the van can be 140 degrees, in the back it might be 98 degrees, but next to the swampcooler its in the 80's. It's comfortable. If I added more insulation, it would be even cooler. Foam insulation does work.

 

[user 37446]

Appreciate your replies and suggestions. I also could wait out my lease and my work contract, (ends May 26, 2018) then I'd be free of the urban parking requirement. It just means another year of same ol' same ol'...

 

[BigT]

It has to be street legal and licensed as a passenger vehicle, not commercial, so no 1 ton cargo vans. 

I hate to tell you this, but my tiny little Transit Connect has commercial plates.   :s

As for the fan.  I just bought the free-standing "Endless Breeze" Fantastic Fan for my TC.  
I'm either going to fab a mount for it to sit in one of the sliding, screened RV windows in my sliding doors, or simply close it in one of the front door windows.  
Then just open another window for cross-ventilation.

My front window coverings are made of indoor/outdoor carpet, so they block the light but allow air to flow through them.

 

[user 37446]

I hate to tell you this, but my tiny little Transit Connect has commercial plates.   :s

As for the fan.  I just bought the free-standing "Endless Breeze" Fantastic Fan for my TC.  
I'm either going to fab a mount for it to sit in one of the sliding, screened RV windows in my sliding doors, or simply close it in one of the front door windows.  
Then just open another window for cross-ventilation.

My front window coverings are made of indoor/outdoor carpet, so they block the light but allow air to flow through them.

I thought that you were out of, or wanting out of the Connect, or did I just imagine that from some old post?

Novel idea, indoor/outdoor window covering... never would have guessed that one.  

I didn't want a commercial vehicle plate due to higher insurance costs, my company doesnt insure commercial trucks so I'd have to switch. After 40 years, I'd feel strange...  :-/

 

[caretaker]

Man, $850 a month,,,,,my heart goes out to you,,you could get a heck of a rig for that. But you got plenty of time, save as much as you can now, and then about two months out you will be ready to do it.

 

[John61CT]

Man, $850 a month, my heart goes out to you, you could get a heck of a rig for that.

I was thinking how super-cheap that is, round NYC metro you're lucky to get a small BR in a decent share-house for that. If you want a safe neighborhood that is.

With kids, decent school, own place, 3K is pretty much minimum.

 

[caretaker]

J, i don't see how people do it.

 

[user 37446]

J, i don't see how people do it.

850 is pretty inexpensive for cities on either coast. Mid-country its about average, Deep South its above average cost, Colorado is double.

For me its simply time. The more I read here, the more I'd like to be done, but time marches on...it will happen!  :shy:

 

[BigT]

I thought that you were out of, or wanting out of the Connect, or did I just imagine that from some old post?

Novel idea, indoor/outdoor window covering... never would have guessed that one.  

I didn't want a commercial vehicle plate due to higher insurance costs

I tore a rotator cuff in my right shoulder over the Memorial Day weekend, so a new van will have to wait 'till I recover from the surgery.  
That could be a year!  :s

I used the carpet because I had a bunch left over after I carpeted my van floor and used it to cover the bed.. 

As for insurance costs...  Having commercial plates didn't effect my AAA policy, and only added about $10 to my annual registration fee.

 

[frater secessus]

As for insurance costs...  Having commercial plates didn't effect my AAA policy, and only added about $10 to my annual registration fee.

Do you have to stop for roadside inspections, or is that a GVWR thing?

 

[BigT]

Do you have to stop for roadside inspections, or is that a GVWR thing?

No roadside inspections, but I get the van searched periodically when I enter Moffett Federal Airfield in Mountain View, Ca.

 

[user 37446]

Are you still happy with the older style Connect?  Do you feel it is big enough for what you want or are you thinking of a full size van? Any thoughts about what you'd look for?

I'm still debating this whole minivan vs full sized thing... obviously. 

 

[BigT]

Are you still happy with the older style Connect?  Do you feel it is big enough for what you want or are you thinking of a full size van? Any thoughts about what you'd look for?

I'm still debating this whole minivan vs full sized thing... obviously. 

I'm not living in it, so it's fine.  If I wanted to live in it, full or part time, I'd definitely want a full-sized van I could stand up in.  

I've got lower back issues, and now this pesky and soon to be agonizing, rotator cuff injury, and I just can't see having to crawl around the inside of the van.  
In fact I'm pretty sure it would kill me if I tried (post surgery).

 

[One Awesome Inch]

I live in a 2010 Connect with maxxair fan for ventilation. Floor to ceiling is about the same height as a standard cargo van but I get 22mpg city. If i decide to change vans I will buy a cheapo $30 fan put it in and take the maxxair with me.

Check out my Yt channel for lots of details. Same user name.