Lend me your "ear" and I will tell you a most curious tale... of trying to buy a van.

[One Awesome Inch]

What follows is the true situation I find myself in trying to buy a van that I really want.
B = buyer (me) S = Seller
B Hi
Wondering if you still have that grey Dodge Ram van for sale. Please let me know asap. I'd like to come look at it.

S Hey sorry for the delay, I've been in Ontario

B Are you back now? Im serious about buying this van. Two questions 1. Is there any rust? 2. Is it registered in BC?

S Yes however I live in lower mainland (vancouver), before we go any further my van is an Ontario van and there is minor rust starting

B So the van is in the lower mainland (vancouver)currently? Do you have a local number i can call you at? ( I only have an Ontario number for him and have not talked to him on the phone once)

S Yes and I'm currently moving a business, however the van is at xx xxxx Rd east Nanaimo (on Vancouver Island... a two hour ferry trip away) if you want to take a look, I've had too many looky loos to keep making trips too the Island so if you like what you see then I will arrange to come out and sign the van over

B Ok I'm going over this Saturday. Will you be able to meet me at the van at 12:00 pm this Sunday (January) the 10th?

S Unfortunately unless you agree to liking the van and buying it there is no way I can afford 100$ each way on a ferry

B So what do you suggest? I've been looking for a van like this for a while and will there is a very strong chance I will buy it.

S Id prefer if you went to look at the rust starting on the van as it is a 99 from Ontario, most people expect a brand new van. Not saying that you feel that way however it is far from brand new

B My current van is a 1999 ford e150 so I'm familiar with older vans. As long as the engine is strong and the rust is minor I will buy it. My plan is to go there on Saturday check out the van and then meet you Sunday at noon to pay you and do the paperwork.

S Okay let me know on Saturday, I can see if I can arrange my friend to come start it up for you, he works a lot though but I will try to have him there

B Ok. I am going to call you about 6:05 tonight (to minimize long distance charges). I called icbc (Insurance Corporation of British Colubia) about registering the van in bc and there are some things we need to discuss.

S Unfortunately I am working late tonight, and the van is as is

B Understood. Icbc says the van needs to be inspected before it can be transferred and insured in bc. The cost for the inspection at Canadian Tire is $110. I am willing to split that cost with you. Is the van currently insured? In Ontario I assume.

S Sorry the van is as is, meaning I will be no part of the inspections or anything

B I understand your hesitation. However the bc government will not allow any paperwork to be processed, including transfer of ownership, until it has been inspected. So nobody can buy the van until that has been done. If the van wasn't out of province icbc would not insist on an inspection.  Please call an autoplan broker / icbc to verify that this is true. I want to make this sale happen.

[No response] (my current line of thinking at this point is that if I can get the guy out there and at the insurance place with me ready to pay him, he will follow through when the insurance place says that ICBC insists that the van be inspected before it can be registered in BC. Since he is already there( a 2 or 3 hour trip from home) he would likely go along with the inspection. But it was not to be...)

B Hi

Okay, after sleeping on this my suggestion is to meet at the van on Sunday ( I will still look it over first on Saturday) and bring it down to the autoplan insurance place to get it transferred etc. Once it is transferred and you are paid you can depart. I will get the van inspected and registered and will pay for those to be done. So no matter what ICBC requires I will pay for it. If you want I can give you a deposit beforehand to show that I am sincere. I have been looking for a high top van like this for sometime, that is why I am willing to go the extra mile for this. If you would like to call me my number is 604 xxx xxxx. Thank you.

S Okay and to transfer the vehicle all I have to do is give you the signed ownership and bill of sale, I'm going to try and make it out for Saturday as you sound sincere and serious.
3500$ is the price though, if I can't get this I'll drive it back to Ontario and sell it for 4500$

B $3500 is fine. However I won't be able to get to Nanaimo until Saturday night and I would like to give the van a final look over in daylight so doing the transaction on Sunday is what I would prefer. Finally, the paperwork has to be done at an autoplan insurance location. Otherwise they may deny me putting the van in my name and if you are not present, I am hooped as it would remain in your name, and therefore uninsurable by me.

S The van is currently in my fathers name however I have a bill of sale signed by him and the ownership signed by him, other then that my father lives in Ontario and will not be able to be present during the sale

B I'm at a mall right now and I just went to talk about this with an autoplan agent. He said what the other agent said. I cannot register the vehicle in bc without an inspection and I cannot insure the vehicle without it being registered. In order to drive the vehicle to be inspected it has to be insured. Is the van currently insured? if not your father will have to fax you a "Letter of Authorization for Temporary Operation Permit" which you can get at any autoplan agent. As I said I will pay for the $110 inspection. It's not likely another buyer will offer to pay that. I recommend that you call autoplan and they can explain it probably better than me. I am willing to pay your full asking price, pay for the inspection and go through all this hassle of the ferry and it's costs. However if icbc  won't let me register the van because it has not been inspected,  there is nothing I can do. I won't be able to buy the van (no matter how much I want to) and neither will anybody else. Please call autoplan and see what they say. Thank you.

S I understand your concern however the van passed inspection in Ontario 8 months ago and has since done me well. What you would have to do is get a temporary plate from your insurance company and then drive the van to whatever inspection centre you choose. The point of me selling the van as is, means i am in no part responsible for the van to pass bc inspection and want no part of that process. If you would like the van i will give you the signed ownership and the bill of sale, then remove the plates and the van is yours.

************************

I really want this van as I've been searching hard for 2 or 3 months and this van is exactly what I want but either this seller is not too intelligent or it seems like he is pulling some kind of scam. Am I missing something?

 

[ahh_me2]

From what I read, it seems fine. I'm in Alberta, and while I know ICBC is different, here when I buy a vehicle, I can get insurance,temporary of course, but if the vehicle is older than 12 years, then it needs an inspection done within the 30 days.
A side note to that is that an out of province vehicle requires a "special" inspection, meaning more money of course.

Are you sure they don't give you a "grace" period to get it inspected?
And what about having it towed to an inspection facility?
As long as it passes, you could get the insurance and drive it away!

 

[TMG51]

His position as a seller is reasonable. Can't run around trying to accommodate people.

As far as the inspection, I'd look it over well and if it seemed solid I would buy it and drive it away illegally and then get the inspection. If you're saying he can't actually sell it to you before the inspection is done due to your location and difference in law, then, well, refer to the first paragraph for why a seller shouldn't care.

 

[BC Guy]

I would walk away. You have been doing your best to make it work and the seller wants you to take his word that the van is good. I also find it strange that the van is on the island when he is on the mainland. It smells like sucker bait to me.

 

[One Awesome Inch]

From what I read, it seems fine. I'm in Alberta, and while I know ICBC is different, here when I buy a vehicle, I can get insurance,temporary of course, but if the vehicle is older than 12 years, then it needs an inspection done within the 30 days.
A side note to that is that an out of province vehicle requires a "special" inspection, meaning more money of course.

Are you sure they don't give you a "grace" period to get it inspected?
And what about having it towed to an inspection facility?
As long as it passes, you could get the insurance and drive it away!

Getting it towed is something I have not thought of. Thanks. In BC the owner has 30 days to switch the insurance over to BC otherwise his insurance from out of province is invalid. There is no grace period as in order to be insured it has to be registered in BC. It cannot be registered until it is inspected.

 

[One Awesome Inch]

His position as a seller is reasonable. Can't run around trying to accommodate people.

As far as the inspection, I'd look it over well and if it seemed solid I would buy it and drive it away illegally and then get the inspection. If you're saying he can't actually sell it to you before the inspection is done due to your location and difference in law, then, well, refer to the first paragraph for why a seller shouldn't care. 

Gee it sure is good to get other points of view. I was getting very frustrated with all these texts back and forth when it would be much more efficient to talk to him over the phone.

The insurance agent did say that 99% of inspections pass... unless the wheel is falling off or something.

 

[One Awesome Inch]

I would walk away.  You have been doing your best to make it work and the seller wants you to take his word that the van is good.  I also find it strange that the van is on the island when he is on the mainland.  It smells like sucker bait to me.

That is a good point. I hand over $3500 and he walks away. Van fails inspection and I cannot get it registered therefore cant insure it to get it on the ferry and home... where I could get the problems addressed.

 

[Spirituallifetime]

I would walk on this one. It could turn into a $3500 paper weight that you can't do anything with! Believe me I've owned at least one of those. If the paper work isn't done right you have to go back to the original owner if they can be found, if not then you have a van you can't register!

 

[One Awesome Inch]

If I go thru with it I will insist that he come with me to the insurance place to make the transfer into my name to verify that the transfer process goes smoothly. Especially since the vehicle isnt even in his name, but his fathers'. Until such time I wont hand him the money.

 

[Spirituallifetime]

If I go thru with it I will insist that he come with me to the insurance place to make the transfer into my name to verify that the transfer process goes smoothly. Especially since the vehicle isnt even in his name, but his fathers'. Until such time I wont hand him the money.

I did that once when I was in the same situation buying a 5th wheel trailer. It worked out fine so I paid him the money for it. Usually I won't have anything to do with a vehicle if it is not in the sellers name, it belonged to his father who had passed away.

 

[Seadog729]

If I were selling a vehicle for $3500, I would do what I could to help the buyer. Having said that, I have fallen in love with a few vans that have died on me and wished that I hadn't rushed into making their purchase. It will cost more than $1000 to drive it back to Ontario (as he said he could sell it in Ontario for $4500). He will have difficulty selling the van as an out province vehicle, unless it is in very fine condition. Can you find an obituary for the father by any chance?

 

[Gary68]

from my position-i have no inspection and live outside d.e.q so the d.m.v. just wants my money but i will only buy a vehicle from the person on the title and they must show me photo i.d. to prove it or i walk

 

[wayne49]

S The van is currently in my fathers name however I have a bill of sale signed by him and the ownership signed by him, other then that my father lives in Ontario and will not be able to be present during the sale

There are a few red flags here.

Be very careful here. Many buyers will not take a third party title.
The Seller should have his father transfer the title to the Seller.
Otherwise, he should have a notarized document of authorization to sell the vehicle for his father.
Van is on an island a costly ferry ride away.He is making it a very difficult transaction all the way.

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

I don't see anything in this thread about having a mechanic look it over for you.  It does look like it would be somewhere between difficult - to - impossible to have that done under the current circumstances.  And I have to wonder if that's the sellers intention?  I wouldn't walk away from this, I'd run!

Regards
John

 

[TMG51]

Lots of conspiracy style theories as to why the seller isn't going out of his way here. Lazyness is way more common than nefariousness. I would trust what the vehicle is in person and nothing else. If you don't want to go to the island to do that, then, don't go to the island.

I sold a Jeep a few years back. Had several people interested in it but one buyer in particular was seemingly very excited about it and communicating with me regularly assuring me he would buy it if I met him halfway (he was a few hours from me). He was texting me constantly with all the details he foresaw and even telling me what I had to do for the sale. He wanted to make sure I was bringing the title, bringing two vehicles so I could drive back after he bought it, etc etc. He repeatedly asked me if I was bringing all these things.

The day came, I met him. He was just a tire kicker (he actually did kick the tires) and said, "I think I'll pass." I would have liked to have driven the Jeep up his ass at that point but instead I turned around without saying a word and drove off. I was out my time, my second driver's time, the cost of gas two ways for two vehicles, as well as any of my willingness to hear a buyer's wants and needs again. When selling a vehicle: You come to it, you buy it as is, end of story.

 

[flying kurbmaster]

regardless if this is your dream model, with a perfect engine and interior, it doesn't matter that you have been looking all your life for this, your perfect vehicle, Run, don't walk from this transaction, put it out of your mind get into a twelve step program...... This is a van that is 16 years old from Ontario, it is shot, it is rusty all over, even if the body looks good the frame the exhaust system the brakes the linkages, everything under that van is rusty, or caked in rust so working on it will be a problem. You have the luxury to live in the lower mainland where cars last a long time, they don't salt the roads, why would you even consider a van from Ontario... they salt their roads every day in winter almost, if they don't salt them, there is a constant salt residue that is splashed on vehicles everytime it rains, unless that van was never winter driven which would have been mentioned and even then you live in the only place in Canada that makes total sense to buy a vehicle of that vintage.keep looking forget about this one it is not a good deal, it is filled with problems, all the lights are flashing the siren is sounding , stop obsessing move on, meditate, let it go...hmmmmmmmm I am grumpy just thinking about you thinking about buying this vehicle.... that money is burning a hole in your pocket....your next high top van is just around the corner it will come to you easily.... patience...

 

[One Awesome Inch]

I hear ya bro!

There is a new wrinkle. He now says it wont pass inspection because it has a 3 inch crack in the windshield.

I told him I will take a look at the van if he brings it over to the mainland. He might do that. He is going to have one heck of a time selling this van.

 

[ascii_man]

When selling a vehicle: You come to it, you buy it as is, end of story.

I understand not wanting to expend a lot of resources to help the buyer, but this "seller" refuses to even do the minimum amount of cooperation to meet legal requirements.  Big difference.

But it's probably not a scam, just someone unwilling to expend the resources to do the deal but also unwilling to be honest with himself about it.  He "wants to sell" in the same way he "wants washboard abs" but not enough to decline a 3rd helping of ice cream.

And yeah, 16 years in Ontario is probably pretty rusty if it has been driven daily as a work van.

 

[jimindenver]

My opinion is pass.

He could send a picture or describe the rust "just starting" if it were really that little. It would be nice if he told you some of the other things that make the van "not new" like the cracked windshield.

 

[One Awesome Inch]

Just saw the van. The seller brought it over to the mainland. I arrived 20 min early and it was running. Not a good sign. Seller said "minor rust". Uh, nope. The frame had rust holes the size of baseballs... at which point I walked.