Legal Threats to Medical Insurance?

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SLB_SA

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Yesterday a federal judge in Texas ruled that the Affordable Care Act is unconstitutional.  Here is one article on this ruling.  This article states "Around 130 million people in the United States have pre-existing conditions, and without the ACA, insurers would no longer be required to cover those conditions."  I don't care about the politics; both parties may have objections to the ruling. ("We expect this ruling will be appealed to the Supreme Court. Pending the appeal process, the law remains in place," White House Press Secretary Sarah Sanders said in a statement.)  This ruling may or may not stand but I wonder if it has wider consequences than simply the ACA and if it is possible to discuss medical insurance without involving politics or partisanship.  I am starting this thread on the assumption that the answer is "yes."

I should explain how I came to an interest in this topic.  My son has (temporary??) medical issues and has an ACA health plan; his medical bills were well over $100,000 (probably $200,000 but this is a guess) and health insurance is essential to him.  He is an illustration that going without health insurance is financially dangerous if one has any financial assets which could be put at risk; he was completely healthy until he suddenly became ill.  I'm not sure what we can say about the ACA because it is out of our hands; the courts and Congress will decide. Thus I will focus on something over which individuals do have some choice (and hopefully is not "political").

I am trying to decide between choosing a Medical Advantage plan and a Medicare supplement ("medigap") plan.  In both cases, a person has to pay Medicare Part B fees; for me, in 2019 these will be very high. Each Medicare Advantage program receives from the federal government about $10,000 per year for each person enrolled in its Medicare Advantage plan and I wonder if legal challenges to the ACA will impact Medicare Advantage programs; will this $10K per person per year subsidy be affected by legal rulings? 

A friend of mine has a Medicare Advantage plan; this plan has no monthly premiums and it is my current favorite.  What happens if Medicare Advantage disappears in a couple years because of lawsuits?  My second choice is a medigap policy with my current health insurance company; for less coverage (no vision or dental, no gym membership), I would pay almost $300 per month more.  After an initial period (one year?), switching to a medigap plan (or switching to a new medigap plan from an old one) requires you to meet their standards and you can be turned down.  On the other hand, a person can switch Medicare Advantage plans every year with no restrictions (other than availability in a person's location). 

1.  If there are any lawyers reading this thread who can comment on the eventual effects on Medicare Advantage if this ruling is upheld, these comments would be most welcome.  (I don't have much hope here but I can only ask.)
2.  If you had to make a choice between Medicare Advantage and medigap health insurance policies, which did you choose and why?

People here have been very helpful and I thank you in advance.  I do not consider health insurance as a "money matter" and so put it here; I understand that others might have made a different choice.
 
Unfortunately, no,...the entire premise of government imposed anything is inherently and totally political, as well as morally treacherous. Combine that with healthcare, and you're just begging for arguements.
 
Pleasant Travels said:
 just begging for arguements.


And of course got one.

But yes, given the stupidly hyper-partisan atmosphere in the US today, no political topic is capable of rational discussion. None. Not a one.
 
I wish I could afford a medi-gap or any other supplement. I can not. I have regular Medicare only. When you buy into a supplemental plan you are usually locking your services into a specific state and region. With regular Medicare I can get care in all 50 states and territories, nothing is out of network.

So, are you asking questions as a stationary person or as a nomad? The answer as to what is a good plan depends on that information.

I am a full time nomad, disabled and depending on Medicare for my care. I make about $500 too much per year to qualify for any sort of assistance, so I have to make Medicare alone work. I purchase most of my medications in Mexico, I get dental work done in Mexico. And sometimes I am forced to go without care. That is the reality of all of this. We pay more taxes for less care.




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Where in the forum on cheaprvliving.com can one discuss issues like the choice between ordinary Medicare, Medicare Advantage and medigap policies and how can this be done without the political baggage? Or are important, individual decisions like this of no interest to people who read this forum?
 
You are already discussing it without politics that I can see. Just keep to the facts ma(n/m)
 
B and C said:
You are already discussing it without politics that I can see.  Just keep to the facts ma(n/m)

You are correct.  I'm just frustrated that a polite, nonpartisan discussion is impossible for some people.  I hope others are not dissuaded from offering their comments.  10,000 Boomers Turn 65 Every Day.  That means about 300,000 people per month have to, at least, consider the question of medicare, medicare advantage or medigap.
 
I plan on using my Christian Healthcare Ministries gold plan for my supplement ins. when I get my medicare.
Absolutely no state boundaries or more. It will pay all my bills (subject to some exemptions/policies of course as indicated in the plan) but it will cover what Medicare does not pay. I won't be tied down and won't play the 'normal' game anymore out there. I want freedom AND I WANT coverage so my option will give that to us thankfully.

just throwing this out for anyone interested and needs plans and coverage that is nationwide with no limits in location etc.

I truly don't want to hash out the good, the bad and the ugly of what a ministry plan does, or doesn't do and all that jazz. We use it and have faith. Just throwing out an option. Please don't bash our way or our choices.

(but I also say everyone MUST decide what suits them and does not in life. This suits us perfectly)
 
I believe the Christian plans are NOT taking people with serious pre-existing conditions. Is that correct?




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this is directly from Christian Healthcare Ministries site:

Active vs. maintenance: We distinguish between pre-existing conditions in “active” treatment and “maintenance” treatment. Medical bills cannot be shared if, at the time you join CHM, the bills are for pre-existing conditions that are actively undergoing treatment other than with maintenance (routine) medications. After the incident is over and your doctor states that you are on a maintenance treatment regimen, bills for any new incident related to the pre-existing illness are eligible for sharing according to the information below.
Schedule: If these criteria are met, Gold level members can receive assistance with medical bills for pre-existing conditions according to the following schedule:
In the first year of participation, bills incurred for a pre-existing condition are eligible for sharing up to $15,000.
In the first two years of participation, bills incurred for a pre-existing condition are eligible for sharing up to $25,000 ($15,000 during the first year plus $10,000 during the second year).
In the first three years of participation, bills incurred for a pre-existing condition are eligible for sharing up to $50,000 ($15,000 during the first year plus $10,000 during the second year plus $25,000 during the third year).
After the third year of participation, the condition will no longer be considered pre-existing.


============NOW AGAIN, everyone must check and confirm with the company and ask very personal questions if needed by a rep just to be sure for themselves and their personal situation...….but that is some fast info I got from our website.
 
Interesting.
Thanks.

I would be concerned, for myself, as my disease is relapsing and remitting. But this may be a fantastic option for some folks.






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A couple of useful facts:

1. Medicare Supplement plans come in two forms: "regular" and "Advantage."

2. Of those, the "regular" Supplements (like Plans C, F, etc) can be used in any state. Most do not need a referral to see a specialist, and you can see any doctor who is signed up with your plan. Regular Supplement plans are "fee for service."

3. Medicare Advantage plans are Managed Care. You pick a provider, then you are stuck with them. The reason the program is cheap is that you have no choice in any part of it, once you choose your primary care practitioner. You will be served whatever the "care du jour" is, from diagnostic studies to the extremely curated prescription drug formulary. If it works for you, great. It wouldn't work for a nomad, though.

There. No politics at all.

The Dire Wolfess
 
ok I just deleted a bunch of posts. some for getting political, some for bickering, and some for quoting posts that got deleted. so there are your three reasons for getting deleted. highdesertranger
 
Moxadox said:
A couple of useful facts:

1. Medicare Supplement plans come in two forms: "regular" and "Advantage."

2. Of those, the "regular" Supplements (like Plans C, F, etc) can be used in any state. Most do not need a referral to see a specialist, and you can see any doctor who is signed up with your plan.  Regular Supplement plans are "fee for service."

3. Medicare Advantage plans are Managed Care.  You pick a provider, then you are stuck with them.  The reason the program is cheap is that you have no choice in any part of it, once you choose your primary care practitioner.  You will be served whatever the "care du jour" is, from diagnostic studies to the extremely curated prescription drug formulary.  If it works for you, great.  It wouldn't work for a nomad, though.

There.  No politics at all.

The Dire Wolfess

The Medicare Advantage plan I am considering is a PPO, not an HMO.  I suppose I would need a primary care physician (PCP) but I would not require the permission of my PCP to see a specialist, to the best of my knowledge.  (However I will verify this; thanks for the heads up!!)  I only take one drug; I have extremely minor asthma and could (and sometimes do) skip using my prescription inhaler for a week or more. This inhaler is not on the formulary of the MA plan I am considering but equivalent inhalers are on the formulary.  

In a video, Bob said he goes to Pahrump for his medical needs like his annual physical, etc.  I am not on the road but I am considering it; in this case, I would follow Bob's example.
 
To add to what Moxie said ... I currently have Humana Advantage at $80/month. This on top of the $135/month that comes right of my Social Security for basic Medicare coverage. I am equivocal about Advantage, and my personal doctor says he will be getting Supplemental when he starts. Of course, he's got money too.

1. Supplemental plans come in many varieties, from A..F, and more, with some companies. I believe the coverage with these plans is fairly standardized across companies. However, beyond the very basic plans, the Supplemental plans cost a "lot" more than Advantage plans. The latter can be had for $0 to around $80/month, but to get better Supplemental coverage will cost $200/month or more.

2. So nothing additional Medicare costs a basic $1620/year, and with Advantage, I am paying a total of $2580/year. With a better Supplemental plan, I would be paying at least $4000/year. And this on top of the money I paid into the Medicare system for the past 40+ years, of course.

3. As Moxie said, the big advantage of the Supplemental plans is that they are more acceptable no matter where you live, and more doctors and hospitals will take them. Eg, not all local doctors and clinics accept my Humana Advantage, and only 1 in 3 hospitals where I live accept it.

4. Plus the "big downside" of the Advantage plans is they pick and choose what they will cover, and this is especially true of drug coverage, so you could conceivably get stuck with large bills if you have some serious issues. They can just deny payment according to their own pre-set guidelines.

5. However, although Advantage plans usually assign a specific home-town doctor, some plans like Humana have doctors in the network all over the country, so you can conceivably get in-network medical help anywheres. Also, in an emergency, you "can" go out of the network. At least these points are true for Humana Advantage.

So, even though I have Advantage my feeling is that, if you can afford an extra $200/month or more on top of the $135/month directly withheld from SS, ie $4000+/year total, then a more comprehensive Supplemental plan is the way to go, especially for travelers.

Good thing we paid into Medicare all our lives, right!
 
I became Disabled in 2008 , Got sick May of 2007. My last surgery then was in December 2nd 2007 I got out of hospital on Feb. 22nd 2008. Applied for Disability and was approved on April 12 2008 . I was left with a lung that was full of holes, And a big hole in my left side that I packed with kerlix and dakins solution. The Doctors told them I would be dead in 5 months. There's a 2 year wait to get medicare once Disabled . I was lucky and packed that hole until September 2017. That's when they did test and the Chronic Coccidiomycossis (coccidiomycossis is valley fever) came back along with 4 bacterial diseases. They took the lung out and put on a wound vac , when I got out of the hospital I found out that the medicare advantage plan I had did not pay anything toward the hospital room untill after 10 days, they did not cover any home health , they didn't cover shit that i needed so I promptly canceled it. My lung was removed November 3rd 2017 , December 31st. I was inn the ER with infection and pneumonia in the one lung, in ICU 10 days with a machine helping me breath , got out February 14th . Another infection in June, In hospital 45 days that time. Medicade paid what medicare didn't for the hospital stays. right now as i type this I still have wound vac on but plan on having it off around the first of January to go to RTR. I think that Insurance is the biggest ripoff there is, You can't shop around for health Insurance like you can car Insurance, your only allowed to use certain ones in your state. I will never be able to pay what I owe certain companies for services because the so called gap Insurance didn't cover it and I owe to much. But Thankfully we still have something called Bankruptcy , LOL just kidding. I pay them a little each month and there happy to get it. So far they haven't affected my credit . so as far as my Doctors do what they say they will i'll be at RTR . God Bless and Merry Christmas.....
 
CNN has an interesting article titled "Here's what's at risk in the Texas Obamacare ruling" which discusses, among other things, the effect of this ruling on Medicare and Medicaid. This article is at
https://www.cnn.com/2018/12/15/politics/obamacare-texas-ruling/index.html
Here are a few lines from the article:
"The health reform law made many changes to Medicare. It slowed the growth of payment rates to hospitals and other providers, reduced payments to Medicare Advantage plans and improved benefits for enrollees."
"Even the Trump administration is using the landmark health reform law to try to lower prescription drug prices."
"But if it's upheld by higher courts, it could turn back the clock on the nation's health care system to before Obamacare became the law of the land in 2010, when the uninsured rate for non-elderly adults was 18.2%. It's now 10.3%."
"Also, the law allows children to remain on their parents' plans until they turn 26. This has proven to be one of the more popular Obamacare provisions and has helped lower the uninsured rate of this age group."
 
For people who live in poverty there are always issues with getting health care. A very good friend of mine, who had an Obama Care plan, was diagnosed with cancer. Her chemotherapy copay was $6,000. The two local hospitals and local doctors involved said her treatment couldn’t begin until she made her copayment. Her family did not have the money and her husband made just a bit too much for her to get assistance with Medicaid to pay the copay. It took several months, her husband taking a cut in hours at work, and proving their income had gone down to finally qualify for assistance. She needed treatment right away, and it took months to get assistance, and treatment. Guess who got treatment, perhaps too late? A young woman, not yet in her 50’s, with two kids still at home. She isn’t doing well.......

The more money you have, the better care you get. That isn’t going to change. I don’t care what a judge does, or who is on the Supreme Court. Healthcare in the United States is a shell game to remove money from the pockets of the middle class and to deny care to the poor.

In Mexico my asthma inhaler (Advair) is $38 with no insurance. Here they cost $300. Our system isn’t healthcare, it for profit thievery.



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@Blanch
My friend who has the Medicare Advantage plan I am considering gets $800-$1000 per month from social security and assistance which pays her $135.50 Part B costs but has to pay $1400+ for her mortgage. If this MA plan had premiums, she would not be on it. She has had utilities cut off (and I have immediately paid to restore them when I learn of this).

My point is that she is pretty close to "broke" and she still gets health insurance. You wrote "For people who live in poverty there are always issues with getting health care." Sometimes people who have inadequate cash flow can overcome these issues; they just have learn what steps to take and then take them. People in California can get assistance.

I have suggested that she might like to buy a cheap bus, make it a home and sell her house. Who knows; maybe she will attend the WRTR in 2020?
 
My state of residence is California and I get no assistance. As I stated I make about $500 a year too much to qualify for any help. I have Medicare as I am on SSDI. That is all I have and all I qualify for.




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