I'm sure everyone asks what to purchase!

[Eccentric Tin Can Man]

Greeting, 

I'm new and very frustrated on what to purchase.  I've looked at so many things...  My wish list in order of importance for a stealth van is...

1. Decent gas milage.
2. A panel cargo van with few windows.
3. Something that does not cost an arm and a leg to repair when it breaks down.  I know repairs are bound to happen.  A rig that is easily worked on with easily accessible parts at a fairly economical rate would be great!
4. Defiantly something that does not have huge milage on it already. 
5. I'm 5'8 tall and would prefer to stand upright or at least not to have to crouch over to much.
6.  I'd love something long enough to accommodate a full sized bed and a small kitchen work area to do simple cooking in.
7. Something halfway dependable...

Wish list for after purchace...
I don't really need a shower.  I can do that at the gym.
I'd need some kind of hidden spot for a crude toilet.
I'd love eventually to get solar.
It would be fun to trick it out with pine to have a cabin feel inside.
Wondering is it legal or safe to put one of those really tiny miniature wood stoves into it?
A Mr Buddy heater is in order.
Defiantly want a Fantastic Fan!

Arrrrrrrrrr.... Please Help! ?

Thanks for taking the time in reading my long list.  I really appreciate any of your seasoned expert knowledge on this.

 

[OutdoorFT]

So a sprinter van is something you do not want

What is your budget?

 

[rvwandering]

Welcome to the CRVL forums Tin Can Man! Can you give us some details about where you'll be spending most of your time - city, country, east, west, north, south? Will you be traveling a lot? Is stealth necessary? There are many factors in choosing the right home. We all have different wants and needs and, as you'll see when you get to know us better, we all have different ideas of what is perfect. But we're here help you as best we can to find what is right for you!

To help you learn the ins and outs of these forums, this "Tips & Tricks" post lists some helpful information to get you started. We look forward to hearing more from you.

 

[Eccentric Tin Can Man]

I have a trade in that I can get $7000 on and a little savings. I'm thinking $23,000 or less.

 

[OutdoorFT]

He did mention stealth in firstpost.

For $23k should get a very good van. Chevy Express or Ford E1/2/350 depending how big you want might be best options.

 

[Eccentric Tin Can Man]

I was looking at that same van today. Do you think the gas milage would be ok on it? Also how old is too old to purchace this rig? I'm not looming to waist money on a 2017, but I know if you purchase something to old the gas milage might not be as good anymore are more repairs of cource with an older high milage rig.

 

[OutdoorFT]

The people here have vehicles of all ages. Really depends on how it was cared for. Your thoughts on mpg may be different than mine...I think 13mpg is good. What is good for you? When talking about vans or trucks, I dont really pay attention to that aspect. Its not going to be a very high number.

As for age, that is also personal. I prefer no later than late 90s models. Thats preference though.

 

[bullfrog]

Everyone wants to get the perfect vehicle with everything just right for them on the first try. It doesn't happen often although you are at the right place to see if what worked for others will work for you. I believe it has been said many times get the newest vehicle you can afford with enough money left over in an emergency fund to more than cover most common repairs that are usually needed for that make and year of van, especially if you are unable to do the work yourself, after having someone who can look it over you trust. A bare Chevy cargo van mechanicals seem to be the lowest money wise to repair and replace if looking at older vans although deals can be found with almost every make, just make sure you or your trusted mechanic has the knowledge required to fix any problems that come up. You will have to find out what works for you by trying what has worked for others you think will work for you. Figure out how much space is in the van you might purchase and mock up the way you would build it. Pretend and think what it would be like. Use totes or crates or pillows to get a feel for the space. If it isn't big enough don't buy a van buy something bigger. Come to the winter RTR. People are more than helpful and happy to let you get an idea of what it is like for them to live in their builds, maybe by experiencing living a week of simple living in small spaces will give you a better idea of what will or won't work for you. Most of us started out with ideas and changed them many times to fit us as we change. Start out simple and get things as you need or want them or spend lots start with everything and give away what you don't use. Either way works!

 

[Eccentric Tin Can Man]

Great advice!  I'm just so blind with it all.  It is very never wracking for me.  I just knew it would be good to talk with all of you with your solid experience!  Thanks A Million for the terrific advice!

 

[DannyB1954]

You have conflicting requirements. Stealth is kind of over rated, and is difficult to achieve in anything that you can stand up in. I would say your choices are a step or box van parked near an industrial area. Many communities have ordinances against commercial vehicles being parked on streets. Some also have height restrictions for overnight street parking, Anything with a stove pipe sticking out of it is going to bring attention. A high top van would probably be the next choice. They don't quite blend in with either residential or industrial themes. Not many of them around, so people pay attention to them. Anything that looks like a work truck will invite thieves that like to steal tools.


For stealth I would say minivan, regular van, pickup with shell.

 

[eDJ_]

These aluminum delivery trucks come in all sizes and engine/transmission configurations.   A smaller one may be what would satisfy your needs as stated.  Especially with the ease of engine maintenance.  More and more these have tilt front ends to access the engine compartment.   An inline 6 cylinder engine may be all you would need in such a light weight rig.

These can be modified easily,  insulated, paneled, windows added if wanted, and the parts would be available
for the body,  and drive train parts would standard to trucks.  These would be built heavy duty and capable of
operating to high mileage. 

There are some creative modifications I've seen such as this one high top.

You may watch the Government Auctions,  (Post Office vehicles may have right side steering, which I would advise against,  but other Govt vehicles may have left side steering)  A lot of Bakeries (large commercial Bread Bakeries) fleet these.  You may find a mechanic who works at one to speak with and learn of what may be for sale.  Some of these are used for delivering pastry or other specialty items.  I see a lot of Locksmith's operating these which they have purchased used.  

If you were to install a small wood burner,  I'd suggest venting it through the wall just below the roof.....and not cutting a hole in your roof.  That seems to always be the beginning of leaks.   Solar could fit up there quite well.

I used to drive an ex Post office rig similar to the bottom photo only without any modifications in my Corporate work days.  One of the divisions I worked at had one for the motor pool and we used it for emergencies situations.  It was built by "International",  had a 6 cyl engine with auto trans.  It would run like a scared cat too.  But that right side steering could be a killer if you aren't used to it or checked out in it so you know what to watch out for.   I guess,  if you wanted to spend the money,  you could have the right side steering switched to left side steering and you may have a decent rig.   Again, these are built more in the line of Trucks.  You may have to buy a 3/4 or 1 Ton Van to have the same durability.

If I didn't already have an extended high top E 350 Ford,  I'd be inclined to consider a smaller Bread Truck type of vehicle.  It would give me room to stow a grocery getter bike like this too.

 

[hepcat]

Greeting, 

 My wish list in order of importance for a stealth van is...

1. Decent gas milage.

3. Something that does not cost an arm and a leg to repair when it breaks down.  I know repairs are bound to happen.  A rig that is easily worked on with easily accessible parts at a fairly economical rate would be great!

I was looking at that same van today.  Do you think the gas milage would be ok on it?  Also how old is too old to purchace this rig?  

You seem to be overly concerned with gas mileage and cost of repairs and "stealth." "Stealth" exists only to the extent that you can find a place to park that people choose not to take notice. Anyone who is looking for people habitating in a vehicle is going to know what you're doing anyway.

A van is NOT going to get "good' gas mileage  I have a '95 e-250 Coachmen B-van to travel comfortably in.  My wife has a Prius that she commutes in.  They're mutually exclusive reasons for buying.  Figure on 10mpg for any van you buy.  If you get more than that, you'll be pleasantly surprised.  A few vans may get less than that; a Ford e350 with a 460 V8 for example.

The REAL expense in owning a vehicle (particularly a newer vehicle) is depreciation, plus the cost of money if you're buying and financing.  Those two costs on a newer vehicle far eclipse the difference in cost of fuel from an 8mpg van to a 15mpg van over a year's use.   If you really want to compare one van to another, look at the total cost of ownership per mile for each over the period you plan to keep it.  That includes comparing not only fuel costs, but projected maintenance expenses, depreciation, insurance costs, and the cost of financing.  Total those costs and then divide them by the mileage you project that you'll drive the van and you'll have a pretty clear picture of what each will actually cost you.  

For example, my '95 e-250 Coachmen B-van costs me something around $0.25/mile, total cost of ownership.  My '16 Jeep Wrangler JKU, on the other hand, costs me something around $2/mile total cost of ownership, and would be even higher if the Wrangler didn't hold its value so well in comparison to other vehicles.   I've not calculated the total cost of ownership for our '10 Prius, but it is fairly high as we bought it new at $32k and today it's blue-book value is about $7k with 170k miles on it...  so we lost $25,000 to depreciation on the car in seven years. Fortunately on the Prius the only maintenance it's needed is tires, oil changes, and one battery recondition so far;  BUT the longer we drive it (we're looking for 400k miles out of it) that total cost of ownership per mile will continue to drop.

If you want, once you have the total cost numbers, you can quantify those annually or monthly as well which will help in budgeting.

So, do your math, and don't be taken in by the sales pitch for "gas mileage."  It's important, but not nearly as important as other costs in owning a vehicle.

 

[gargoyle]

Standing up option will limit your choices.
Sprinter vans are tall. Normally $$.
Even a standard van with high top can be short.
Higher the roof, the less mpg and harder to fit places, typically.
Woodstoves are ok in a van, Use common sense and good safety practices. They are messy and laborious. Stowing wood and constant refueling/stoking can be a pain. Temperature regulation is hard, its usually too hot for such a small space.  Common practice is to open a window..which lets in cold air. A smokestack spewing smoke will draw attention. Certain areas of the US have burn bans and the rules may not allow you to use the stove. Go with a MR Buddy for convenience. Woodstove for romance.

Stroll thru a few car lots and crawl around inside the vans to get a sense of what size van will meet most of your needs.
Look at the conversion vans done here on this forum, and YouTube for ideas on beds, kitchens, toilets etc.

If there is van with 40mpg, never breaks down or is super cheap to repair, spacious and parks easy, let me/us know.?

 

[DannyB1954]

Cost per mile is a consideration, but I think it applies more to a vehicle that you use for commuting. As an example, if you buy a very nice class C and only drive it 25 miles every 14 days, your cost per mile will be outrageous, but you will have been living pretty comfortable in between drives. So you have to weigh comfort against miles per gallon or even total costs. The more you drive the more important the gas mileage. Many find small vans like the old Chevy Astro to be a good compromise. GMC sold it as the Safari I believe. It might get you high teens if you drive conservatively. A minivan might get you low to mid 20's. As your fuel mileage goes up, your comfort level when not driving goes down.

One other thing about wood stoves is in most places it is now a violation of law to transport any wood that you have gathered. Inside the wood there can be bugs or diseases that get moved with your vehicle to a new area. So if you want to carry wood, it will have to be the store bought variety as in presto logs. Once at camp, you could burn for free using local material.