Hello there! Not sure about getting into Van Life

[Ashrak]

Hello everyone!
I'm quite young, i just started working recently, and i'm afraid i'll have to do this meaningless life for the next 50 years, staying in one place, not being able to express myself creatively and working for others instead of myself.

I have an entrepreneurial mindset, I've always dreamed of making my own videogames and pursuing my own projects and i have quite a few skills already that could be easily offered online (Web Development and Marketing), i started to consider van life because it could be a way for me to work online as freelance while i'm traveling and exploring new places, so that i wouldn't fear to get stuck in a single job, in a single place, while my life slips away
and all the experiences i always dreamed to do would get sucked away from today's society standards -

working to pay for rent, without the possibility of pursuing my personal goals, that could make me happy in life.

On the other hand, i face fear of the unknown - i don't know if I'm making the right choices that will contribute to my future, i would love to make a family with my fiancé but it's still a long journey and she is a few years away from finishing her studies, i could simply choose to get a job abroad, rent a room in a shared house and make some money, but i fear that by doing this, by getting a full time job i will not fulfill my personal goals, because i'm good at doing a few things at a time and i'm not a multitasking kind of dude, if i choose this path, i will bury my personal objectives just as i did before during my studies.

I love camping, going out and exploring already but i've never tried anything similar to van life, i've only been on a few short roadtrips.

Would this lifestyle suit me best? will it give me inspiration and time to pursue my goals? will i be able to survive off ~800 euros per month (it's just an expectation of how much i will earn as freelance worker) ?
I would love to hear your opinions on this topic, and thank you for your time!

 

[Morgana]

Welcome and yes I think most people could identify with those dreams and concerns.

My only piece of advice is that, if you choose this route, you should get yourself established as a freelancer before you start vanlife.

Self-employment and vanlife are two separate projects, each of which is likely to require massive attention and commitment for quite some time before you get in a groove. (I'm sure it's do-able to fling yourself into both at once, but I wouldn't do that unless your survival depended on it.) Get strong in one, then tackle the other.

Don't assume it will be easy to get set up as a freelancer, no matter how online your skills are. Doing that right involves huge amounts of work, and succeeding involves huge amounts of luck.

Your life goals are (1) valid, (2) shared by many people, and (3) costly, and (4) pursuing them will involve many trade-offs (you won't get everything you want). It's going to come down to what you're willing to pay and how much you're willing to risk. I guarantee you that among other things it will involve substantial drudgery and not everything you do or see will inspire you. The thing that's "you" is the thing you're willing to put in the slog for.

Prioritize. Experiment. Fall on your face. Waste precious time. Get up and try again. Join the club. Good luck.

 

[maki2]

It is of course feasible but the time to develope a clientele for remote work or game development starts right now, today in fact, while you have other income to support you. It does not happen instantly after you are on the road. Waiting for your fiancé to be ready or until you have a Van means your the scheme can fail due to lack of an income source that you could have already created while waiting for the right time.

My son and his wife tried doing it when he got laid off from a very well paying programming job. They had quite a bit of equity profit from a house they were buying and bought a nice caravan and truck to tow it with. But that dream only lasted three years on the road as the income stream never developed enough clients to support them while living on the road. Then serious trouble began. His vehicle got totaled in a chain reaction accident. Then 2 years after taking a low paying job in Japan so they could explore the country they returned to the US only to find out the reason he had been catching so many colds was he had developed acute leukemia. He could not work for more than a year while treatments went on. Fortunately during that time friends gave them a room to live in and a car to borrow. All that is behind him and they are back to living in a modest apartment in a very small town with much lower rents than the city. But at least after the cancer was cured he had friends who were game developers who have now given him his paying dream job chance on a team writing RPG games. Now he and his wife are saving up money to buy a small piece of land in the country and putting a small house on it with a minimal mortgage they can pay off in just a few years. He is in his early 50s now. It does not mean they do not want to travel, they do but can’t afford to just now. But it means he learned the hard lessons, first develop remote work that is sufficient to financially support yourself when traveling. Also as soon as you can invest some money in a small safety net piece of land with a cabin to retreat to if needed.

In the meantime, work hard to fulfill your dreams by immediately beginning to create a reliable remote work income stream, do not put that off even one day longer. But also make some time to go camping as often as possible. You can have your dream but it takes effort and sweat to make it sustainable through good times and bad.

 

[Ashrak]

Welcome and yes I think most people could identify with those dreams and concerns.

My only piece of advice is that, if you choose this route, you should get yourself established as a freelancer before you start vanlife.

Self-employment and vanlife are two separate projects, each of which is likely to require massive attention and commitment for quite some time before you get in a groove. (I'm sure it's do-able to fling yourself into both at once, but I wouldn't do that unless your survival depended on it.) Get strong in one, then tackle the other.

Don't assume it will be easy to get set up as a freelancer, no matter how online your skills are. Doing that right involves huge amounts of work, and succeeding involves huge amounts of luck.

Your life goals are (1) valid, (2) shared by many people, and (3) costly, and (4) pursuing them will involve many trade-offs (you won't get everything you want). It's going to come down to what you're willing to pay and how much you're willing to risk. I guarantee you that among other things it will involve substantial drudgery and not everything you do or see will inspire you. The thing that's "you" is the thing you're willing to put in the slog for.

Prioritize. Experiment. Fall on your face. Waste precious time. Get up and try again. Join the club. Good luck.

Thank you for your wise advice, i'm already starting my freelance career while i'm still working in a part-time job, it's surely one of the first step that i want to take, after that i can start to think seriously about the rest

 

[bullfrog]

You have a good start but apparently haven’t figured out how to make a large enough income with your skills or gotten enough skills if you will need to live on 800 euros a month. I know a fellow in his early thirties in the computer/IT field that works for a large defense contractor remotely, as in only goes in to work once or twice a year. He owns several houses he AirBnbs to professionals like himself as he travels the world. Not married yet but enjoys visiting with his family and taking them and their siblings with him several weeks a year. He lives simply out of a backpack and stores a few toys with friends and family near areas they are to be used in. He will use his focus and 20 years of his life to retire around 40 years old. He stays in good physical and somewhat good mental health as he realizes he is risking his youth for future freedom. He is a good listener and observer and recognizes opportunity and many times is ready when opportunity presents itself. It makes me smile when I realize I took a much longer and harder path to find less freedom at over 70 years old than he has in his thirties but we all go our own ways. As they say “results may vary” and only you can decide what risks you will take. Good luck and make good well informed choices that you feel you can endure.

 

[eDJ_]

Welcome to the Van Living Forum Back in the Pandemic I started this thread for those who were wanting to work from their rig. It addressed Education & skills needed to perform a wide range of jobs and live in a way any Nomad could enjoy. (this went 7 pages)

I live on the Ohio River and considered cooking on a River Boat for 6 months on the water as a crew cook where I would be on the boat for 28 days at a time for 6 hitches a year. I'd have 100% medical, visual, and dental coverage. This would give me 6 months to enjoy my leisure or work a few more months a year as an "extra" in the event some other cook got sick or had a death in the family etc, Then travel in a Rig in the remaining time.

Look thru it and you may gain some ideas.

https://vanlivingforum.com/threads/education-skills-needed-to-work-online-from-your-rig.40960/

 

[Tony's Dream]

You don't say exactly how old you are, but if you are in your early 20's....you have an interesting outlook on life.

I think that many people here will tell you their stories of working their life away until they were able to enjoy their van life now. A cold reality is that financial security is a necessity in this world.....however you are able to achieve it. I have inlaws who have always worked paycheck to paycheck and spent any windfall profits that fell in their laps. Retirement was never on their minds and thought social security was going to be enough to cover their expenses. They never invested in retirement savings and now they are finding out what retirement will look like for them, and their outlook is grim.

In life we each have to decide what ours lives will look like. If your van life will enable you to make enough to cover your daily livng expenses and put away money for retirement........I say go for it.

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

Since you are young my council is to follow your dream.

BUT there are at least 3 things you need to have:

1. a way to support your dream until your dream is supporting you. (You need money to live).
2. you need measurable goals and a plan if you don't meet them.
3. you need to periodically assess your progress and be ready to move on if it doesn't look like your dream will become reality.

 

[RoamerRV428]

I can't give alot of advice here as I don't know truly your life situation as you wrote it all down but I SAY DO YOU. Something is gonna change you to find you if you allow it. Fear of unknown is for all of us but if we allow us to shine thru you find the right path hopefully without tons of regret or if I did this diff. hindsight. I truly hope you find what path life is leading you

 

[mpruet]

My career life was in software development. During the last 20 years of my working life, I was remote from most of my working team. While it is possible, it requires a lot of effort to make yourself known to the management team.

One very important thing to understand. You may have the necessary skills, but your employability is far more dependent on your productivity than on your skills. And that also goes to your idea of working as an independent developer. So I might ask - what have you produced? What have you developed that would convince me to risk hiring you to work on my project? Have you worked on any projects? What is your experience?

It’s one thing to have dreams, but an entirely different thing to convert those dreams into tangible income.

You’ll find that even with the game industry there is a tremendous pressure to not only develop new games, but to increase the revenue produced from existing games. And that means releasing new versions of existing games about every 2-4 weeks. That generally requires a team effort.

Also - be aware - in technology what you learn today will be obsolete next year. It’s really difficult to stay on top of technology. Who would have thought that relational databases would have lost favor to nosql engines? Who would have thought that Java would be losing its predominance? Who would have thought that COBOL would have lost its favor? It’s not that difficult to stay on top of implementation developments when working in a team shop, but quite difficult outside of that environment.

But in all honestly, this has nothing to do with being nomadic. It has to do with working inside a team vrs. working outside of a team.

 

[Morgana]

It’s not that difficult to stay on top of implementation developments when working in a team shop, but quite difficult outside of that environment.

Very true. It can help to join a professional organization(s) but nothing replaces the constant updating you get as in- house staff. One of the many reasons freelancing is tougher than it looks! But do-able for all that. Besides, nowadays staff jobs are getting rare as hen's teeth.

 

[Ashrak]

My career life was in software development. During the last 20 years of my working life, I was remote from most of my working team. While it is possible, it requires a lot of effort to make yourself known to the management team.

One very important thing to understand. You may have the necessary skills, but your employability is far more dependent on your productivity than on your skills. And that also goes to your idea of working as an independent developer. So I might ask - what have you produced? What have you developed that would convince me to risk hiring you to work on my project? Have you worked on any projects? What is your experience?

It’s one thing to have dreams, but an entirely different thing to convert those dreams into tangible income.

You’ll find that even with the game industry there is a tremendous pressure to not only develop new games, but to increase the revenue produced from existing games. And that means releasing new versions of existing games about every 2-4 weeks. That generally requires a team effort.

Also - be aware - in technology what you learn today will be obsolete next year. It’s really difficult to stay on top of technology. Who would have thought that relational databases would have lost favor to nosql engines? Who would have thought that Java would be losing its predominance? Who would have thought that COBOL would have lost its favor? It’s not that difficult to stay on top of implementation developments when working in a team shop, but quite difficult outside of that environment.

But in all honestly, this has nothing to do with being nomadic. It has to do with working inside a team vrs. working outside of a team.

Hello there mpruet and thank you for your reply, i'm making a portfolio right now, but i get what you mean, offering myself as a freelance means having lots of autodiscipline and I'm not very good at it yet

About games, i'm sure that it won't be my main focus for the next few years because it's really hard to get into the industry even with a good game, but i'll hopefully work on some as a hobby (and complete them - unlike i did before)

I'm also inside a team right now for a startup, but still at the beginning, i have a long way to go

 

[Morgana]

Have you read the Max Wirestone novels (starting with The Unfortunate Decisions of Dahlia Moss)?
The heroine is a game designer.* They are super well written IMO and very funny. A little light relaxation when you need some downtime from your challenging quest!

*I think -- at least, something in the game design world.

 

[mkoontz]

I don't know about Italy, but here in the US the schools fill the student's heads with all kinds of crap and doomsday scenarios. So first, realize that MOST of that stuff is crap and (mainly) forget it. That should lower your stress level some. Next, if your schooling is thru high school only (12th grade), realize that you are likely signing up for a life of poverty. That's OK for yourself, but no good for a family. Get more school (upper or vocational) while you're young and living freer. It's easiest. Then start a career. Do it.
You DON'T need to work a single job for the rest of your life. You don't need to work in a certain career for the rest of your life. If you are living with your eyes open, you'll get opportunities to "move" and it will be your decision (and responsibility). If it's wrong than you've learned something. Fear of decisions is a very bad habit. Be smart and make the best decisions you can.
Vanlife: Don't think of vanlife to escape life (until you're much older). When you're able to build a portable income (or retire) then you can start to figure budgets and make an intelligent plan. That plan MUST include "repair savings" or you'll be finished soon. I've seen many people sidelined with a $1500 needed repair. These are the people that never had a plan. They'll say they can't afford to have $5-10k in savings. Well, now you're on Welfare I guess.

 

[Ashrak]

Have you read the Max Wirestone novels (starting with The Unfortunate Decisions of Dahlia Moss)?
The heroine is a game designer.* They are super well written IMO and very funny. A little light relaxation when you need some downtime from your challenging quest!

*I think -- at least, something in the game design world.

I'll definetly read it, thanks for the suggestion!

 

[user 22017]

Next, if your schooling is thru high school only (12th grade), realize that you are likely signing up for a life of poverty. That's OK for yourself, but no good for a family. Get more school (upper or vocational) while you're young and living freer. It's easiest. Then start a career. Do it.

Some food for thought:

https://smartandrelentless.com/100-ultra-successful-people-who-did-not-get-a-college-degree/

 

[sithigh]

Hello everyone!
I'm quite young, i just started working recently, and i'm afraid i'll have to do this meaningless life for the next 50 years, staying in one place, not being able to express myself creatively and working for others instead of myself.

I have an entrepreneurial mindset, I've always dreamed of making my own videogames and pursuing my own projects and i have quite a few skills already that could be easily offered online (Web Development and Marketing), i started to consider van life because it could be a way for me to work online as freelance while i'm traveling and exploring new places, so that i wouldn't fear to get stuck in a single job, in a single place, while my life slips away
and all the experiences i always dreamed to do would get sucked away from today's society standards -

working to pay for rent, without the possibility of pursuing my personal goals, that could make me happy in life.

On the other hand, i face fear of the unknown - i don't know if I'm making the right choices that will contribute to my future, i would love to make a family with my fiancé but it's still a long journey and she is a few years away from finishing her studies, i could simply choose to get a job abroad, rent a room in a shared house and make some money, but i fear that by doing this, by getting a full time job i will not fulfill my personal goals, because i'm good at doing a few things at a time and i'm not a multitasking kind of dude, if i choose this path, i will bury my personal objectives just as i did before during my studies.

I love camping, going out and exploring already but i've never tried anything similar to van life, i've only been on a few short roadtrips.

Would this lifestyle suit me best? will it give me inspiration and time to pursue my goals? will i be able to survive off ~800 euros per month (it's just an expectation of how much i will earn as freelance worker) ?
I would love to hear your opinions on this topic, and thank you for your time!

You will never have your own way if you don't try to make it. I have "compromised" plenty and hope I'm still able to get going again.

 

[maki2]

My son had a similar career goal and eventually he got there and now works full time creating games. But that did not happen overnight. He did try living on the road for 3 years but could not sustain himself and his wife that way.

There may well be a few years of jobs that do not match your true dream before you achieve it.

A self employed, independent,
game writer is indeed a very tough nut of employment to crack. Those things are more often done in teams of people working together on a project. Getting hired onto such a team is also difficult unless you have become friends of the people on a team. Cultivate true friendships in the gaming community with people working in the industry. That is very important to your long term goal.

You are not locked into dead end jobs. That is negative thinking about them. Instead use those jobs as a stepping stone for funding your essential daily bread while you develop skills and connections in your desired profession. But be a very good, reliable, employee with a happy, kind, attitude and focus on team building and team leadership skills, the people skills side of working life. Those too are critical skills for every job you will ever have including being a game developer and an entrepreneur.

Feeling trapped and being trapped are not the same thing. You are not trapped, you are working towards a goal. Do not get trapped by your up and down emotions or expectations that everything SHOULD come quick and easy. But do have fun gaming and make lots of in person friends, not just social media connections. Live a balanced life.

It took my son a lot of years of working at programming jobs while also gaming and making strong friendship but he is now getting paid doing what he loves to do. He just wrote a licensed RPG game for the Movie Pacific Rim and is working on other games. Many of his team mates are gaming friends he also socialized with in person that he has known since he was your age. https://www.evilgeniusgames.com/team

 

[Gr8ful]

My 2 sons had full ride 4 year scholarships including housing & books to Michigan State but turned them down. My oldest is a lineman as he likes being outside & my youngest is in charge of the water/sewer & PWD of a good size tourest town. Both make well over $100k & my oldest developed a new way of doing a procedure & they have him teaching classes on it one week a month so IF you have they hustle you can be very successful without paying for college. They both have taken some collage classes but they were paid for by their employers & paid for taking them. I was making about that 14 years ago when I broke my back & didn't go to college. OTR truck drivers make $90+K. Both are important but I'll choose common sense & hustle over paying for higher education every time. The main thing is doing what you love to do so you have a happy life.
Scholarships
Scholarships
Scholarshipsscholarships

 

[Frood]

My 2 sons had full ride 4 year scholarships including housing & books to Michigan State but turned them down. My oldest is a lineman as he likes being outside & my youngest is in charge of the water/sewer & PWD of a good size tourest town. Both make well over $100k & my oldest developed a new way of doing a procedure & they have him teaching classes on it one week a month so IF you have they hustle you can be very successful without paying for college. They both have taken some collage classes but they were paid for by their employers & paid for taking them. I was making about that 14 years ago when I broke my back & didn't go to college. OTR truck drivers make $90+K. Both are important but I'll choose common sense & hustle over paying for higher education every time. The main thing is doing what you love to do so you have a happy life.
Scholarships
Scholarships
Scholarshipsscholarships

https://fittopass.espyr.com/truck-d...=Good income,average nearly $64,000 per year.