Heavy duty battery for minivan???

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LeeRevell said:
In the years I have owned my minivan, I have tried all levels, from "silver" to "platinum", different warrenty year lengths, different manufacturers.  I don't believe it makes any difference.  A starting battery is a starting battery, period.
Switching to a Marine battery may give some advantage, but you will still risk killing it with a fridge.
My take.....  use the correct battery for the intended use.
But we each make our own choiceT
Thanks for that info. After reading the responses I cancelled the "heavy duty" First Interstate, 4 yr warranty, starter battery, cost out the door 303 bucks.
Too much going on with relatives here for the holidays. I'll have time to watch the Minivan engine setup with inverter and batteries to hold the charge. Then I can watch the CRVL Solenoid video to see HOW folks are running these fridges without running down the battery.
Want to make sure my starter battery is in good shape at all times. The Runaway Trailer guy with the fancy Jeep had a 65 qt fridge and Bob said in that CRVL video he owns the same one. Somebody's figured out how to run the fridge/freezers on board and keep the vehicles charged.
I put in a call to my other mechanic who does more full spectrum work. He may know someone who can install the starter battery and system to provide the juice to power up my gadgets. Meanwhile I'll watch the videos so I can better understand the install. And I have NO IDEA how much the battery, inverter and batteries, and install should cost altogether.
Any feedback on cost would be appreciated. Thanks for all your help!!
 
People with Dual battery set ups are intending to have longer lasting batteries, and have no risk of not being able to start the engine.

Your 6 week venture and fridge use will be hard on the engine battery, but I am not sure wiring up a dedicated secondary battery is in your best interest$, since this is only for a 6 week period.

it would be easier and cheaper to just view the engine battery as disposable, and carry a large jumper pack.

The Jumper pack ensures you can always start the engine even if the abused starting battery cannot do the job on its own. Even replacing the engine battery with a new one during that 6 weeks, would be cheaper and easier than having a mechanic/sparky rig up a well functioning dual battery system with adequate thicknesses of copper to do the job.

Rigging up a secondary battery, just for this 6 week venture, is not something I would pursue. Now if someone were intending on moving into their Van indefinitely then i would definitely recommend the secondary battery and some solar, but for a 6 week venture, sacrifice the engine battery, carry a jumper pack, and make sure the cooling vents on the 12vDC compressor fridge are not obstructed.

Also cut some reflectix to friction fit in the windows on the sunny side of the vehicle to keep interior temperatures from rising too much and causing the fridge to have to work harder, run longer, and consume more battery.

Using a Jumper pack is VERY easy to do, and they can also be recharged while driving.

Not knowing what the battery compartment looks like in your Van, I've no idea how easy it would be to stuff a larger battery inside of it, but if I were to pay a mechanic to modify something relating to the battery, i would modify the battery tray to accept a group 29 or group 31 marine battery which is 13inches long, 7 inches wide and 9.5 inches tall and has 100 to 130 Amp hours of capacity. Next size down is a group 27 at 12 inches long, and next size down is a group 24 at about 10 inches long.
 
Also, an inverter is not a requirement for the electric loads you mention.

This is the DC to DC car adapter I use for my laptop. Just plug your laptop make and model into the search bar and add car adapter and make sure it shows the ciggy plug.

https://www.amazon.com/Laptop-Car-C...keywords=dell+e5500+latitude+car+adapter+pwr+


My laptop powered by that car adapter can consume upto 90 watts but averages 35 ish watts when laptop battery is fully charged.

When I use the inverter to power the same laptop on the original power brick provided with it, the consumption averages closer to 50 watts, making the DC to DC car adapter significantly more efficient.

You also do NOT require an inverter for recharging phones or other USB devices.

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias=aps&field-keywords=usb+car+adpater

So my recommendations for your intended usage:,
buy the 12vDC compressor fridge.
http://www.westyventures.com/parts.html#cart_restore

Replace your current failed engine battery with the biggest marine battery which can be made to fit.

Buy a jumper pack and learn how to properly use it.
Buy the laptop car adapter, make sure Ciggy plug is seated full depth in receptacle always when in use.
BUy the USB car adapter.


With 3 devices requireing Ciggy plug 12v receptacles, you might need more of them.

One option is having your mechanic run a heavy duty one with better wiring right to engine battery so it is always live with the engine off. Some of the ones provided will only be live with key in ignition engine running, or to accessory, which presents more loads to battery.

https://www.amazon.com/Ginsco-Cigar...2921&sr=8-3&keywords=12v+power+port+blue+seas

https://www.amazon.com/Blue-Sea-Sys...id=1483042967&sr=8-6&keywords=ATC+inline+fuse

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01MQH4TBQ?psc=1

A laptop with depleted battery can consume more wattage than the 12v compressor fridge. So a beefier Ciggy plug receptacle and a shorter thicker copper circuit back to battery is wise, but possibly unnecessary.
Go travel and enjoy.
 
SternWake said:
People with Dual battery set ups are intending to have longer lasting batteries, and have no risk of not being able to start the engine.

Your 6 week venture and fridge use will be hard on the engine battery, but I am not sure wiring up a dedicated secondary battery is in your best interest$, since this is only for a 6 week period.

it would be easier and cheaper to just view the engine battery as disposable, and carry a large jumper pack.

The Jumper pack ensures you can always start the engine even if the abused starting battery cannot do the job on its own.  Even replacing the engine battery with a new one during that 6 weeks, would be cheaper and easier than having a mechanic/sparky rig up a well functioning dual battery system with adequate thicknesses of copper to do the job.

Rigging up a secondary battery, just for this 6 week venture, is not something I would pursue.  Now if someone were intending on moving into their Van indefinitely then i would definitely recommend the secondary battery  and some solar, but for a 6 week venture, sacrifice the engine battery, carry a jumper pack, and make sure the cooling vents on the 12vDC compressor fridge are not obstructed.

Also cut some reflectix to friction fit in the windows on the sunny side of the vehicle to keep interior temperatures from rising too much and causing the fridge to have to work harder, run longer, and consume more battery.

Using a Jumper pack is VERY easy to do, and they can also be recharged while driving.

Not knowing what the battery compartment looks like in your Van, I've no idea how easy it would be to stuff a larger battery inside of it, but if I were to pay a mechanic to modify something relating to the battery, i would modify the battery tray to accept a group 29 or group 31 marine battery which is 13inches long, 7 inches wide and 9.5 inches tall and has 100 to 130 Amp hours of capacity.  Next size down is a group 27 at 12 inches long, and next size down is a group 24 at about 10 inches long.
 
SternWake said:
People with Dual battery set ups are intending to have longer lasting batteries, and have no risk of not being able to start the engine.

Your 6 week venture and fridge use will be hard on the engine battery, but I am not sure wiring up a dedicated secondary battery is in your best interest$, since this is only for a 6 week period.

it would be easier and cheaper to just view the engine battery as disposable, and carry a large jumper pack.

The Jumper pack ensures you can always start the engine even if the abused starting battery cannot do the job on its own.  Even replacing the engine battery with a new one during that 6 weeks, would be cheaper and easier than having a mechanic/sparky rig up a well functioning dual battery system with adequate thicknesses of copper to do the job.

Rigging up a secondary battery, just for this 6 week venture, is not something I would pursue.  Now if someone were intending on moving into their Van indefinitely then i would definitely recommend the secondary battery  and some solar, but for a 6 week venture, sacrifice the engine battery, carry a jumper pack, and make sure the cooling vents on the 12vDC compressor fridge are not obstructed.

Also cut some reflectix to friction fit in the windows on the sunny side of the vehicle to keep interior temperatures from rising too much and causing the fridge to have to work harder, run longer, and consume more battery.

Using a Jumper pack is VERY easy to do, and they can also be recharged while driving.

Not knowing what the battery compartment looks like in your Van, I've no idea how easy it would be to stuff a larger battery inside of it, but if I were to pay a mechanic to modify something relating to the battery, i would modify the battery tray to accept a group 29 or group 31 marine battery which is 13inches long, 7 inches wide and 9.5 inches tall and has 100 to 130 Amp hours of capacity.  Next size down is a group 27 at 12 inches long, and next size down is a group 24 at about 10 inches long.
Thanks for all the info you provided. I'm sleepy after a day in the national forest. Will read this thoroughly when I have more time. My reference to 6 weeks was regarding how long I parked my minivan without driving it. I was so busy I did not have time  drive it (it's parked elsewhere) and the battery ran down in the cold weather. It has many computerized functions and that apparently added to the battery drain.

I've got plenty of driving experience and am pretty familiar with the mountain west. How long I will van dwell is an open door, but I'd like to be ready for months on the road with all systems working if I can get help locally. I did plan to go to RTR 2017 but my kids decided to come for an extended visit, and after they leave I have to assist my Mom with an unexpected surgery. Much as I wanted to join you all in Q, Family comes first. I sure do appreciate this forum and the way each and every one of you helped me out with info about the battery situation. So many great folks on this forum. Hugs to all! :heart: I am grateful.
 
Sorry about the 6 week thing, I misread the intent, disregard the previous recommendation, unless you cannot find someone local, then just get the jumper pack and go find the person who can.

Way more reliable is a secondary battery as a house battery, and later you can add solar when you possibly get tired of  house battery replacement every few months, a solar panel which might fit between your minivan's roof rack Would pay for itself in extended battery life.

For a Minivan, and your stated usage, I would recommend an group 31 AGM  properly secured somewhere in the back as a house battery.

These 4, are in my opinion,  best group 31 AGMs:
125 Amp hours:
http://www.impactbattery.com/lifeli...battery.html?gclid=CLDxmoamm9ECFQ1ufgodSj8BAg

This one has 20AH less capacity:
https://www.amazon.com/Lifeline-Mar...580&sr=1-1-catcorr&keywords=lifeline+gpl-31xt

https://www.amazon.com/NorthStar-Ul...080301&sr=8-1&keywords=northstar+group+31+agm

https://www.amazon.com/Odyssey-31-P...83080330&sr=8-1&keywords=odyssey+group+31+agm

Mid range quality:
https://www.amazon.com/VMAXMB137-Ba...8&qid=1483080017&sr=8-5&keywords=group+31+agm

This is one of the most budget oriented 12v AGM's. Know someone with a Sams club card?


http://www.samsclub.com/sams/durace...32&selectedTab=allProducts&_requestid=5483729

That battery is a Deka Intimidator AGM. If treated properly, it is only rated at 1/3 (total the cycles to 50% charged) of the Lifeline, BUt if both were to be treated poorly( chronically undercharged), it will likely  last 3/4th the total amount of cycles of the Lifeline.

It is likely about the same quality as this:

https://www.amazon.com/110Ah-Batter...=1483080391&sr=8-1&keywords=UPG++group+31+agm



One should put the battery in a battery box like this, and make sure it is properly secured to floor or seat anchors:

https://www.amazon.com/Camco-55373-...F8&qid=1483079433&sr=1-3&keywords=Battery+Box

https://www.amazon.com/NOCO-HM318BK...rd_wg=rStaZ&psc=1&refRID=VRC46XVPN5GW51XKCHW5


https://www.amazon.com/Newport-Vess...F8&qid=1483080715&sr=8-4&keywords=battery+box

https://www.amazon.com/UPG-40790-Bl...rd_wg=v23LI&psc=1&refRID=GNK42CGPJY003413FP0B

Those 2 or3 accept group 24 and 27, not group 31 batteries. buyer beware.

I would also recommend  the AGM  be fed  with no thinner than 6awg cable from the alternator, through one of the many 'isolating' devices available to protect engine battery from house battery loads.

Hook this harness to alternator (+) and mounting bolt(-)

https://www.amazon.com/Keeper-KTA14...sim_263_1?ie=UTF8&refRID=147ND97WNXYBJX94R5M6

With this connector  on this trailer harness above, you can easily disconnect the whole house battery box from the vehicle's alternator.  You 'could' connect to drive, and disconnect when parked. But there is the human error factor to deal with.

If you wanted the higher$$ AGM batteries, those 'should, ideally' get fatter cable as they have no amperage limits when recharging, but, the les$er AGM's should likely not be allowed to suck on 4awg or thicker cables from alternator at ~10 feet one way distance.  Top quality 4awg or thicker custom cables cables can be acquired here :

http://www.genuinedealz.com/custom-cables


Below, is an Automatic voltage sensing relay.  As soon as it sees charging voltages from alternator, it closes the circuit and charges house battery.  Soon as voltage falls below a certain limit, after engine is turned off, it automatically separates.

http://www.allbatterysalesandservice.com/browse.cfm/4,2705.html

https://www.amazon.com/Bussmann-RB-...=1483081276&sr=1-4&keywords=battery+separator

There are literally dozens of different products and methods for protecting engine battery from house loads and charge while driving. The linked product above requires no tapping of a live 12v ignition circuit which allows the use of a cheaper continuous duty solenoid.

These isolating devices need not be in engine compartment on firewall, or next to alternator, they can be next to house battery, perhaps even mounted on the plastic battery box itself, with a fuse inbetween house battery and solenoid which then goes to the alternator directly.  IF the wire goes instead to engine battery which is the more common method, but causes slower recharging), then another fuse is required next to that battery.
  One of those basic battery boxes above can be customized with USB outlet, 12v  outlets and voltmeter.

YOu could have a mechanic properly mount the battery box in back,  properly run the fused  cables through floor to alternator (+) and mounting bolt(-), and wire up the voltmeter, 12v power port, and USB outlet, and have a pretty reliable system, as long as you drove each day, or generally keeping the house battery above 12.1 volts.

If you ever get to plug into the grid a regular smart charger of 20 amps or higher, would go a long way in extending battery life, as it simply takes so long to get a battery recharged to 100% full, especially one which has not gotten there for a long time.

Which plug in charger I would recommend depends on which battery you get, but any plug in charge is better than no plug in charger.

Later on, if one gets tired of having to drive, or perhaps just Idle when parked, to keep the battery from going much below 12.1v, Solar can easily be incorporated, and take up the slack.  

Any solar is better than no solar, but more is better.  Size panel(s) to roof racks.  Shoot for 2 watts per 1Ah of battery capacity, but the fridge alone will need no less than 60 watts in good sunny shade free weather to break mostly even.
 
Given your timeline and kids, for now your goal is get your Starter replaced with something that can handle deep cycling.

If you want a simpler cost-effective House setup when you deal with that later, the two "banks" should be compatible wrt charging setups. Basically this means you need to choose (now for your Starter replacement) between the newer fancy-expensive AGM type or traditional unsealed "flooded".

Advantage of the latter besides cost savings, is the precision being able to measure the state of charge by sampling the fluid, AGMs don't let you do that, so tweaking your charging routine for battery longevity is more of a guessing game.

If you don't want to bother with all that, AGM is simpler, low maintenance, more flexible placement, but will cost you more.

If you decide to go AGM, an Optima Yellowtop "hybrid starting/deep-cycle" is an easy choice for your Starter, fits in the existing stock battery holder in your engine compartment, available at big-box retail - true marine-style deep-cycles big $$$ aren't, but that's not what you're buying now anyway.

If you decide flooded, then just get the highest-rated so-called deep-cycle or "marine" that fits from local big-box.

Things get a lot more involved (and expensive) for the House bank later, but you don't have to stress so much over your Starter for now, just choose AGM vs unsealed overall for later charging cycle compatibility with the House bank.
 
In my opinion, Optima batteries are a waste. While they developed a good reputation when they were made in the USA, they moved production to mexico and quality suffered.

Even before the maximum profit outsourcing,
The 6 pack design limits their capacity. Compared to a rectangular AGM, they have 25 to 33% less electrical storage capacity.

Spiral cells are great, when there are high physical stresses on the battery case itself, or in extremely high vibration environments, but in other applications, like a starting battery which will be discharged to some degree, or as a house battery, they are a waste of space.


Say you had two gas tank options, You could easily fit a 40 gallon tank, but they offer, at about the same price, a 30 gallon tank, that takes up the same amount of space, but appears as if it is 6 5 gallon buckets strapped together.

The smaller gas tank comes with a placard with some extra special marketing like resistance to high vibrations and puncture resistance when rock crawling, and a claim that it will fellate the owner after use.

Believing marketing hype in this day and age is like a glory hole with an 'Insert genitals here' sticker.
One may envision a supermodel on the other side, but reality is far different
 
Well that's a very unpleasant analogy!

I agree that (if the choice is AGM) Optima is not optimal, if there are XS, Odyssey or even Diehard pseudo deep cycle AGM easily available that fit the stock box at a reasonable price for the AH, then that would be better.

I just think that's not likely, and they wanted to hit the road today, right?

Obviously I'd be happy for anyone to post other recommendations.

For example, if going flooded, do 2x 6v in a Costco/Sam's Club golf cart battery ever fit in the stock space?
 
That would be a huge battery tray in an engine compartment to fit 2 gc-2 batteries. i think a pair of GC-2s would test at about 700 to 800 CCA, so more than enough for most engines.

Diehard AGM platinums used to be relabelled Odyssey, but now they only have the diehard gold AGM which is a Deka intimidator, which is a bare bones AGM with little benefit in CCA over a regular flooded starting battery.

Here is a group 31 starting battery at 950CCA

http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/d....oap?ck=Search_N0369_-1_-1&pt=N0369&ppt=C0327

Here the Deka intimidator group 31 is rated at 925 CCA
http://www.remybattery.com/intimidator-9a31-battery.html

So for a purely engine starting duty, CCA figure wise,, the Flooded battery above beats the AGM of the same group size, for about 60% of the price of the AGM.

If deeply cycled, all factors being equal, then the Deka would likely outlast the starting battery, perhaps by a good margin, perhaps not.




The Deka Intimidator is likely the most relabelled/rebranded AGM battery sold in North America. Autoparts stores, Costco, Sam's club, Sears, they all relabel/rebrand and retail the Deka/Eastpenn Intimidator AGM battery.

And it is a OK AGM battery for the price, and it is made in America, but it cannot compare to An Odyssey or Northstar or a Lifeline AGM battery in cranking performance, or deep cycle performance when properly recharged. If it is to be used solely as an engine starting battery and rarely if ever deeply cycled, it will perform well. if it is cycled to 50% state of charge each cycle, and promptly and fully recharged perfectly, they claim it is good for only 350 cycles, where as Odyssey says 800 cycles, Northstar says 900 cycles, and Lifeline says 1100 cycles.

I would consider the Deka intimidator AGM battery to be a good starting battery and a poor deep cycle battery, and a marginal dual purpose battery, unless deeper cycling were infrequent.

XS batteries, I am not familiar with, I though they were marketed to the loud car stereo crowd. I Wonder who makes them and how they stack up to the TPPL AGM batteries of Odyssey and Northstar

The matching battery types for engine and house is largely overhyped too. The vehicles voltage regulator is in control, either battery will accept what it wants at the system voltage allowed by the vehicles voltage regulator, which is almost always too timid, and so far from ideal, that two different batteries sucking what they want at that voltage through the wiring involved, makes little difference.

I alternator charged an AGM and flooded battery in parallel for years, and got 500+ deep cycles from the flooded, and now am using the same AGM battery for both house and Engine duties, and it is performing very well at ~450 deep cycles.

During alternator charging, AGM engine and flooded house, or visa versa is OK, but these two types should NOT be left to discharge in parallel as the AGM will be worked much harder as it has less resistance and a higher resting voltage. When the engine is running, system voltage is higher than either battery's resting voltage, so one battery cannot feed the other.

So as long as the isolation method chosen separates the batteries on engine shut down, there is no problem in having a flooded battery for starting and an AGM four house duty, or visa versa. The only real time where having both batteries be the same would be better, in this application, is if the isolating device fails and keeps both house and engine batteries in parallel the whole time and the driver/owner is unaware this has occurred.

Even then it would take some time for Unideal to reveal itself, and that time might not be any/much shorter than if both batteries were the same and discharging together in parallel.

It is really hard to beat a pair of gc-2 6v golf cart batteries as deep cycle batteries. Their price and performance, is pretty much impossible to beat. I recommended AGM for this minivan simply for the lack of gassing when charging, and not having to worry about spilling, or properly venting of flooded batteries. I also assumed its location to be within the passenger compartment.

But the offgassing issues always have people saying they have no issues with it, and others who can't stand the stink of a charging battery, and we will beat our chests yelling our opinions from the roofs of our vans in order to get someone to agree to what is a personal preference and has no right answer applicable to all.

And besides, my opinions are facts, and inarguable ;)
 
Ideally flooded banks get occasional controlled overcharge or equalizing charge.

Some AGM and all gel batteries should never be subjected to that, and of course LiFePo4 have radically different needs.

True AGM are actually the same basic chemistry as flooded auto starters, and many have a similar spec for the charging cycle, so you can just get lucky.

And of course many people don't mind replacing their batteries more frequently so they don't have to delve into these details.
 
John61CT said:
Ideally flooded banks get occasional controlled overcharge or equalizing charge.

Some AGM and all gel batteries should never be subjected to that

Well, that is true, but  I would replace 'some' with 'Most'.

Scroll to page 20 and read 'conditioning'

http://lifelinebatteries.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/manual.pdf

If another brand of AGM battery were showing an unexpected premature loss of capacity, I would perform a 'conditioning'/ forced overcharge, but I would monitor the process carefully and control voltage precisely while monitoring amperage and battery temperature.
  
 I would expect some gassing to occur, and gassing of an AGM is not instant death as some seem to think.

It is long lasting regularly gassing that can dry them out and kill them, but they are mostly far more tolerant of overcharging than we are led to believe.  It is long term storage at too high a float voltage that usually does them in, or too high a voltage with a large amperage charge source that pushes them past 14.7v at a high amperage rate.  They need to be held at 14.7v while amps taper to near zero before ever being pushed higher, at 77F.

Actual Gel batteries are a pretty rare Dog to find, although when recharged properly, they are the most tolerant battery of deep cycles and the longest lived, but they have that pesky precise recharge requirement, or voids form in electrolyte instantly reducing capacity and performance, permanently

Some people call any sealed battery a gel cell, but this terminology is incorrect as a flooded starting battery can be sealed, and are marketed as 'maintenance free'.

Batteries with actual gelled electrolyte are now rare, but Absorbed Glass Matt batteries are not, and maintenance free flooded starting batteries make for horrid batteries when cycled below 95% state of charge.  Flooded maintenance free batteries do exhibit strange behavior when recharging.  If they are accidentally deeply cycled, they should have an absorption voltage of 15v at 77f, and that needs to be held until amps required to hold that voltage taper to near Zero.  Without that they will likely not last much longer.  Meaning the alternator will never do it, and most plug in chargers cannot and will not either.

Generally I recommend avoiding maintenance free starting batteries even for engine starting.   They are marketed to those humans who when asked when the last time they changed their engine oil, respond: 
"changed it to what?"
 
SternWake said:
Generally I recommend avoiding maintenance free starting batteries even for engine starting.   They are marketed to those humans who when asked when the last time they changed their engine oil, respond: 
"changed it to what?"

So then what do you recommend for a starting battery? Not many people have your setup.



Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
 
I'd recommend any starting battery not labelled as 'maintenance free', meaning it has obviously removable caps to check electrolyte.

AGM batteries are also 'maintenance free' but are overkill for a starting battery never deeply cycled.

Maintenance free flooded batteries use a more calcium in the lead plates which minimizes water loss and this the need for watering. However this also makes them extremely poor performers when inadvertently, or intentionally deeply cycled.

If the driver intends to cycle their starting battery, At least get a Marine battery, and the biggest one which will fit. And this info will not be listed in parts books so the consumer has to do a little measuring and application of logic and physics when upsizing the battery to a larger one.
 
What are your thoughts on a group 65 starting battery from Walmart? It has the removable caps, 850 CCA. (Group 65 as that's what is currently installed in my van.) What others would you suggest that I consider for a battery used just as a starting battery? I think most are manufactured by JCI and I'm not sure there's a big difference between them. Thanks.
 
Group 65 is a weird apple being shorter and wider and squatter. They also tend to have higher CCA figures than a battery of the same weight but different dimensions. I'll guess due to wider shorter plates. Somebody more knowledgeable than me said the group 65 plate/acid ratio was a weird mix that did not translate well to a dual purpose flooded battery.

Do you have about 2 more inches of height available? If so you can likely squeeze in a group 29/31 for a good amount more capacity.

My van I think, was supposed to get a group 24, I regularly put a group 27 in there, and barely squeezed a group 31 in there without modification. When the group 31 was too compromised to continue deeply cycling daily, i removed it and began modifications so i could Install a trojan T-1275 there which is 2 inches taller and a bit longer and wider. In that time frame I started cycling my other battery, the Northstar AGM. that was June of 2015, and I have been cycling only that battery and using it for engine starting too.

Never finished modifying battery tray to accept a T-1275. I kind of got hung up on relocating the windshield washer reservoir when i discovered the Northstar could easily start my engine when depleted 65Ah from its 90 AH total capacity, and then greedily and safely suck up everything my alternator could make and i seriously questioned the need for a dedicated house battery when thenorthstar AGm proved to be so capable.

A Trojan tech 'advisor' screamed and whined when I said my proposed T-1275 battery would regularly see 60 to 80 amps alternator charging current and simply quoted the 10 to 13% 'recommendation'. End of that discussion.
My group 31 dual purpose USbattery at 20 AH less capacity and 20 less pounds, saw that much current regularly and lasted 500 cycles. Still going in shallow duty usage too. Got less reliant on battery manufacturer 'recommendations' from that point.

In choosing a starting battery, one might be tempted to seek the highest CCA available, when comparing two batteries of the same group size. however as long as the CCA was over the specified minimum by the vehicle manufacturer, Given two batteries of the same group size, I would choose the battery with lower CCA as the plates are likely thicker and more durable and less likely to short a cell.

But really the warranty in a starting battery, and ease of using it should be a prime motivator in an engine starting battery, that is not deeply cycled. A marine battery, deeply cycled, well that is a bit touchy as user error can so easily destroy one in the warranty period and it is no fault of the battery or the retailer. At elast a dedicated engine battery has less chance of being destroyed through intentional deep cycling.

Mainsail is of the opinion that many Marine batteries plate composition are no different than a Starting battery, the difference is that marine batteries usually have both automotive posts and threaded studs for cable connections. Hard to say without weighing and dissection

http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/deep_cycle_battery

Johnson controls has a pretty firm control over the flooded starting battery market. Hard to know if they really build them differeently for interstate than they do for Wal mart. i suspect only the case color is different, but only an insider would know for sure, and they likely have to sign NDA's on threat of multiple 5 fingered prostate exams.

East Penn/Deka make a better starting battery in my opinion. I think Oreilleys and napa brand batteries are made by Deka, but it is likely different in different regions of the country.

I have a kind of negative opinion of Johnson Controls, and am not sure why.

Check date codes, A reduced price on a 6 month old battery, is not a deal.
 
Back when I was selling auto parts a battery of a certain size - say Group 24 - was available with 36, 48, 60, and 72 month warranties.  Not only the price went up on each step, but also the Cold Cranking Amps - the number of amps a fully charged battery could deliver at 0 degrees f.

I used to have people come in in the fall and say something like, "Give me the cheapest battery you've got, I'm going to trade it in in the spring."  I would always warn them that if they needed to go out at 20 below and the car HAD to start because they HAD to get to work, the cheap battery wasn't going to cut it, and they needed the most CCAs they could buy.  The battery guarantee was that the battery would take and hold a charge, NOT that it would start your car.

I guess my point here is that if you're a snowbird who's going to spend her winters in AZ or FL, the battery's CCA is fairly meaningless to you.  Our tribal members still stuck in the Dakota's for the winter DO need to pay attention to the CCA when they buy a new starter battery.

By the way, it used to be that Marine batteries didn't list a CCA, they listed an MCA - Marine Cranking Amps, which were the number of amps available at 32 degrees f.

I sold this stuff throughout the 70s and 80s, things might have changed since then, I suppose
 
dateline=\ said:
:huh: :huh: :huh: :huh:     To  ANYBODY

I AM SO CONFUSED      well crap on a cracker  I just lost all but the 1st 4 words of this reply!!

Should I use a marine battery as a starting battery on the Safari van?

There is a 2nd battery tray under the hood, could a 2nd marine battery be wired to the alternator to recharge?  could this then be the "house"  battery to run maybe a fan, light, and small frig while traveling down the road or boondocking?

Please Oh Please let me have this right........mostly......just a little bitty bit...please.....Oh Hell go ahead and burst my bubble!!   ;) 

Jewellann
 
You could use a Marine battery as your starting battery.  There would be no reason to do this UNLESS you were trying to also use it as your house battery.  And there is one disadvantage.  Usually, Marine batteries are only waranteed for 12 or 24 months instead of the much longer periods regular started batteries often are.

Yes, if you have a second battery tray under your hood, you could put a Marine battery there, have it set up to be charged by the alternator, and use IT as your house battery.
 
:D  Optimistic P Thanx,  I think the starter battery is pretty new.  I'll have to take a look at it.  Having lived in SD I always buy the best cranking battery I can, also really really good heavy duty wiper blades.   The blades on there now are so thin they look like lines made with a black magic marker!  Well this is the deep south & not much use for things like snow/ice wiper blades and oil warmers to plug in at nite.  Now about this "dedicated so-long-noid thingy"???

Happy New Year 
     Jewellann   :)
 

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