Getting Started- Van Recommendations?

[Satellite5812]

Hi all! I've been poking around the threads and finding lots of good info & different opinions about types of vans. Cargo vs. windows, which make/model is better for what, and ideas on different levels of conversion.

I'm looking for a starting point from which to build my travelling home. Top priority for me is reliability, as I'm not much of a mechanic & don't wish to bring a shop's worth of tools on the road. Second is stealth, as I plan on alternating between parking in towns & boondocking. Friends have suggested diesel, which I'm not opposed to, just less familiar with working on. Also, a big difficulty is going to be resisting the urge to paint the outside, as I'm artistically inclined.. yet I don't want to be a moving target either.

Thoughts? Input from veterans gladly welcome!

 

[rvwandering]

Not much of a mechanic here either so I can't recommend any specific vans.

 We alternate between cities and boondocking and unless you need to spend weeks at a time in a city for a job or some other reason being stealthy is really unnecessary. Go with comfort first - windows for good ventilation and a nice view when you're boondocking, roof vents for more ventilation, and solar panels for almost free power. What you lose in stealth will be made up in convenience. There are plenty of places to park in towns where no one will take a second look at your van.

 I think it would even be okay to paint it just keep the colors light because it makes in big difference in the inside temperature when you can't find a shady parking spot in the summer.

 Good luck with your search!

 

[SternWake]

Your available Van budget would go a long way toward getting you more helpful some answers.

I bought a high top people mover Dodge conversion van in 2001, and slowly built it to my needs. It has been gutted twice. One to rip out the space wasting frou frou conversion company interior, and the second time to build a new electrical cabinet to house a fridge and a platform bed with maximum storage underneath. I really disliked the jackknife 3 section fold out bed for sleeping, but I used it for 6 years before making my current platform and 5 inch thick medium firm 400$ plus mattress.

I feel the bed is the most important feature for successfully transitioning to this lifestyle. If I do not sleep well, I do not function well.

Mine is used as a worktruck, as well as an office, bedroom, lounge, and kitchen. I keep 3 surfboards strapped to the ceiling, two of them are well over 9 feet long. I used minimal interior insulation as i was unwilling to lose interior space to it, and my expected climates are mild.

My electrical system would put most manufactured RV's to shame in terms of flexibility and reliability, but i don't carry much total battery capacity, but I do have the ability to easily replace what I use by three different charging sources, so the lesser battery capacity is not an issue, and saves weight. 198 watts of solar is more than enough in summer at 32'N in the coastal SW, but not quite enough in winter if laptop usage is heavy.

I have basically rebuilt the whole vehicle over the last 14 years The only original wearable parts are the rear leaf springs, and they have airbags assisting them otherwise they too would have been replaced.

You will get a lot of opinions, some will be very strongly worded as if they are facts and there is only one way to do it. Employ the scrolling feature of your mouse when you run across such 'facts'

 

[Theadyn]

Hi and Welcome!!

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

Friends have suggested diesel, which I'm not opposed to, just less familiar with working on.

All new vehicles come from the factory with a gas engine as part of the "base price".  A diesel engine is an option that you pay more for - a LOT more.  It can add 4 or 5 grand to the price of your new vehicle.

It retains much of this difference in a used vehicle.  You will end up paying a lot more for a truck with a diesel in it than you would for the same make, model, year, etc. truck with a gas engine.

For commercial companies, the diesel advantage was that a good diesel could go a half million miles or so, whereas a gas engine would be finished somewhere between 100,000 and 200,000 miles.

Unfortunately, several of the most modern diesels have design flaws that have led to expensive repairs and shortened lives. 

A diesel engine - because of it's much greater torque - can make a lot of sense for a vehicle that's going to pull a heavy trailer, especially in mountainous areas.

If you're not doing that, then the cons far outweigh the pros, IMO.

Regards
John

 

[akrvbob]

Cargo versus passenger can go either way, they each have pros and cons.

* For stealth the cargo wins because it is nearly as good in residential areas and is much better in commercial/industrial areas.
* Cargo van is much easier to insulate and build out just the way you want. Knowing where the ribs and wiring is a big plus.
* Passenger vans waste a lot of space with all that plastic crap everywhere. The newer they are the worse they are.
* HOWEVER--can you do without the windows??!! Many people can't.

The bigger and most important question is high-top or low top. Give that a lot of thought!!! I'd suggest a hightop.

My recommendation is a a newer (2002 or earlier) Chevy Express with a 5.3 engine. If that's out of your price range, a Dodge with a 318.

Whatever you buy, GET IT CHECKED OUT BY A MECHANIC FIRST!!!
Bob

 

[DannyB1954]

Here is my beef with diesel. Expensive. Anything goes wrong and you are in deep doo doo. I had a 6.9 diesel ford pick up. One of the cylinders cracked. It would cost more to repair than the vehicle was worth, ( I am talking thousands, not hundreds). Two of my friends have diesels, each of them have more money into engine repairs than their trucks are worth.
I look at Craigslist adds, and the diesel trucks that I can afford, are the ones with high miles and are prone to needing expensive repairs. Web search ford 6.0 diesel problems just as an example.

What I would like to find is a 94 to 96 ford e250 extended with the straight 4.9 six cylinder. I would put my own high top on it, but only cut the original roof in the middle part. This would give me a ton of storage in the front and rear for the light stuff.

 

[Baloo]

Welcome, I am not sure if I can make a good suggestion since my ambo is not stealth or small. However I am a veteran and that did lead to a few of my choices. I went with a commercial truck platform since they are designed to have regular maintenance conducted like military equipment. Also that was why I choose an older mid 90's diesel, it can run several different fuels. However I am very mechanically inclined and carry enough tools to keep it running. I like the whole idea of utilitarian living. Not really a minimalist, but I am working on that.
I would base my vehicle decision on two things; budget and can I fix it up if it is older (cheaper in most cases). The other option is too easy, since you can paint, come paint my truck and I will fix up what you get... Good luck mate!

 

[Satellite5812]

Thank you everyone for sharing your experience and advice! I went to take a look at this rig last night, and it's being double checked by a mechanic right now. If all goes well, I intend to buy it. Seller lived in it for a year, brought it over from the East coast. Seems like a sturdy steed, we'll see what the shop says....

http://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/cto/5164543246.html

 

[DannyB1954]

Thank you everyone for sharing your experience and advice! I went to take a look at this rig last night, and it's being double checked by a mechanic right now. If all goes well, I intend to buy it. Seller lived in it for a year, brought it over from the East coast. Seems like a sturdy steed, we'll see what the shop says....

http://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/cto/5164543246.html

Check the bottom of the body panels real good. Back East salt is commonly used on the roads in the winter. The vehicles tend to rot from the bottom up.

 

[highdesertranger]

well I have to disagree a little about diesels. since you are looking at fords, I will say this, the only good ford diesel is the 7.3 all others are junk. so don't base your diesel experience with one of their junk motors. actually if you get the right diesel they are a lot cheaper then gas engines. remember a diesel is the most efficient internal combustion engine ever invented, hands down. it's not even close. the trick with diesel(like everything else imho), is to keep it simple. highdesertranger

 

[DannyB1954]

My buddy had the 7.3. There is a fuel pump under the intake manifold, when it goes bad, good luck changing it. One bolt is impossible to get to, the intake has to come off. There is also a high dollar fuel water separator on top of the intake that rots out and spills diesel on top of the engine. My buddy also had a manual transmission. The clutch burnt out, and when the flywheel got hot, it went bad. They call it a dual mass flywheel. It has springs and clutch plates inside of it that are not replaceable. You have to buy a new one. Get it from Ford for 1500.00, or online for only 800. That is just for the flywheel.
Some people have great luck with diesels. If you are not one of them it will cost you dearly. Like Clint Eastwood said, do you feel lucky? Well, do ya?

 

[DannyB1954]

One other thing that I often wondered. Why don't the manufacturers give you a 300K warranty on a diesel? I think they would go broke. You get 100k, just like a gas engine.

 

[highdesertranger]

you have to be smarter than the engine. dual mass flywheel= no good, get a regular one. you think it might have been time to change that fuel water separator? that is a serviceable part, it's supposed to be changed at regular intervals. no bolt is impossible to get to you must be smarter than the bolt. they should give a longer warranty on diesels because the engines are supposed to last 2-4 times longer. it's a shame nobody told Ford that. highdesertranger

 

[DannyB1954]

Unless you know all the ins and outs about each manufacturers diesel, how are you going to choose? Every manufacturer has had some problems during at least some of the years. Either with the injectors, lift pumps, front timing chain cover locator pins, head bolts or whatever. If the maintenance after 100K was reasonable, maybe they would offer a longer warranty on diesels as a selling point. They know how expensive it can be, that is why they don't. The manufacturers are not willing to drop $5k into warranty work on a vehicle that might be 10 years old. A gas engine goes South after 250k miles, you can put a new or rebuilt in for $3k. That might buy you a lift and injector pump on a diesel. Something major happens, well that is going to cost a bit more.

I think my point comes to if you can afford to buy something new enough to be in warranty, diesels are fantastic. After that they are a gamble. As the miles go up, the steaks get bigger. If you need the maximum amount of towing capacity, a diesel might be the best choice, but vans usually do not do a lot of heavy towing. The torque from a medium sized gas engine is usually sufficient. You can argue a diesel can go 500k miles, but then there are those that didn't make it to 200k. Look at the classifieds. There should be a whole lot more of them for sale with 300k on the odometer. My guess is most didn't make it that far.

You take someone trying to scrape up $3k so they can buy a van, where are they going to get $8k for a diesel that goes bad? If they do put the money into the vehicle, how much is that vehicle worth, Maybe $6k? One generally doesn't get back their repair money because a Diesel vehicle with a dead engine is really only worth scrap metal prices. Nobody wants to invest what it costs to replace the engine.

I do own a vehicle with a diesel. It is a 30' Kings highway 1970 something that someone put a Detroit Diesel 6V53 and an Allison 6 speed transmission into. They also put a 3 speed driveline gearbox in. It runs great, but if anything went wrong, I would not spent big bucks to get it repaired. I paid $7.5k for it, and lived in it for three years before I retired. I figure I got my moneys worth out of it.

 

[ramblingvanman]

One other thing that I often wondered. Why don't the manufacturers give you a 300K warranty on a diesel? I think they would go broke. You get 100k, just like a gas engine.

Planned obsolescence.

 

[akrvbob]

I think we have covered the OPs diesel question really well. Thank you all very much!!!

What about cargo verses passenger van?

What about his question about wanting to paint the van artistically? Good idea or bad?
Bob

 

[Almost There]

I think we have covered the OPs diesel question really well. Thank you all very much!!!

What about cargo verses passenger van?

What about his question about wanting to paint the van artistically? Good idea or bad?
Bob

I've had both cargo and passenger vans in various sizes, ages and makes over the years. Disclaimer - I've never tried to stealth camp in an urban area so YMMV.

In the one cargo van with no windows at all in the rear I added a pair of RV style windows for ventilation and esthetics.

With the window/passenger vans I always ended up blocking off at least 1 or more of the windows so that I had floor to ceiling storage.

It's 6 of one and a 1/2 dozen of the other as far as I'm concerned. When I went shopping for a van the most important things were condition, price and mileage. Body style was down at the bottom of the list somewhere below color.

As to painting the van artistically like all the show vans were done back in the 70's and 80's - well it certainly makes the van stand out from the crowd - if that's what you want. Just make sure that any artwork is not going to be deemed pornographic in nature. We had one guy in western NY go to court to fight charges because of the artwork on his van. He won but the cost of legal fees wasn't worth it IMO.

If you want, maybe pinstriping is the way to go - artistic, individual but not so blatant as to attract crowds in the w/m parking lot.

 

[Satellite5812]

Thank you so much everyone for your input! I've taken to heart the part about the importance of a high top for headroom, and prioritized reliability & low miles, and I've decided on the van from the ad I posted earlier. I took it to a mechanic first, and he said it was a good find & declared it a solid rig. Not great on MPG, but still cheaper than rent. I'm excited about it! Meet my new home:

 

[old grey dog]

Congratulations Satellite, that is a good looking machine.