Ford vs. Chevy extended vans... rear overhang, significant difference?

[AntiGroundhogDay]

Most cargo vans have very similar ground clearance that is sufficient to get to ~most~ desireable backcountry places if you're careful.  But when considering extended cargo van Chevy/GMC vs. Ford, while the lengths are similar (~244in Chevy vs. 234in Ford), looking at Google images, it seems like the Ford has a MUCH greater overhang behind the rear tires:

Ford:
[font=Verdana, Geneva, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]http://tinyurl.com/y6usnccx[/font][/SIZE]

Chevy:
[font=Verdana, Geneva, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]http://tinyurl.com/ycg9s4rf[/font][/SIZE]

[font=Verdana, Geneva, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]1) Am I correct?  Never seen them in person.[/font]
[font=Verdana, Geneva, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]2) Is this that big of a deal when going through ditches/gullies?[/font]
3) The extended Chevy/GMC rear overhang looks similar to that of the regular length Chevy/GMC cargo van (the front and rear wheels just look farther apart).  With the same ground clearance, would you say the extended Chevy/GMC is just about as offroad capable as the regular length Chevy/GMC cargo van?

Thanks!

 

[tx2sturgis]

Ford made the extended van by adding length at the rear, behind the rear axle.

Chevy adds length in the middle, between the axles.

There are pros and cons to either design.

Generally speaking, the shorter wheelbases are a bit more nimble when off-pavement, but the longer wheelbase gives a better highway ride and is slightly better for pulling trailers.

The longer rear overhang on the extended Ford means a shallow departure angle, and the possibility of getting 'hung-up' when crossing a deep rut, but the longer wheelbase on the Chevy means a shallower break-over angle, and possibly more subject to underbelly damage when crossing a berm or drift.

Unless you are going to be pulling a long or heavy trailer, its pretty much a 'dead heat' and comes down to other deciding factors.

And of course, your brand preference and the deals you can find locally also figure in to the mix.

 

[highdesertranger]

yep pluses and minus's to both designs.

with the short wheel base(Ford) and the long overhang you end up with a very poor departure angle. so you will get hung up on your rear bumper.

with the long wheel base(GM) you have a much greater chance of getting "high centered", ie.. hung up in between the wheels.

just like Texas said if you are going to tow anything the GM design wins hands down.

highdesertranger

 

[AntiGroundhogDay]

Did not think about the break over angle... damnit, why can't anything about picking a van be a no-brainer?!

So pick your poison... you guys have been out in the wild, I have not. If you were not planning to tow, what wheelbase would be more valuable for you guys (disregarding brand preference or reliability) and cause less problems when trying to get out into the wild?

 

[highdesertranger]

the best choice would be a short wheel base and a short van. after that I would rather have the long wheel base with a short overhang behind the rear axle. highdesertranger

 

[mr_elijah_gardner]

I think I would just choose the van that I liked the best. Keeping in mind your off roading is not going to be very extreme in a big heavy 2wd van. Common sense and recovery gear should get you most anywhere you want to get to.

Might be helpful to mention what kind of terrain you expect to be driving in. Desert is different than trail through the woods, or a swamp type area. Desert is a lot more open and trails wouldn't be so bad with a long wheelbase. In the woods you might need to short wheelbase to make it up around the curve. Swamp no idea. Pontoons?

Personally I'd rather have the short overhang. I like the ride of a long wheelbase better.

Both have advantages and disadvantages. I think common sense driving will negate the differences.

 

[drysailor]

Most cargo vans have very similar ground clearance that is sufficient to get to ~most~ desireable backcountry places if you're careful.  But when considering extended cargo van Chevy/GMC vs. Ford, while the lengths are similar (~244in Chevy vs. 234in Ford), looking at Google images, it seems like the Ford has a MUCH greater overhang behind the rear tires:
[font=Verdana, Geneva, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]1) Am I correct?  Never seen them in person.[/font]
[font=Verdana, Geneva, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]2) Is this that big of a deal when going through ditches/gullies?[/font]
3) The extended Chevy/GMC rear overhang looks similar to that of the regular length Chevy/GMC cargo van (the front and rear wheels just look farther apart).  With the same ground clearance, would you say the extended Chevy/GMC is just about as offroad capable as the regular length Chevy/GMC cargo van?

Thanks!

1) - Correct. Ford simply adds 20" to the existing van body, no change in the drive train.
2) - On paper there might be some difference, but in actual use don't really think it's that significant. Also don't know about turning radius.
3) - Several years ago, there was a lot of chatter on the NHTSA website about instability in large vans. While they are all quite different from autos &
       pickups, apparently when the extended Fords are heavily loaded behind the axle, as with 3 adults in a seat or heavy tongue weight, there is a
       whole new level of instability to deal with. Just personally, I would not try to tow with one.
While I currently own a 2013 E350 standard length pass. and it's been flawless, if I were buying today it would be a Chev/GMC extended.

 

[Gideon33w]

Since the important differences in capability are covered already I'll just add that the two vans have very different suspension designs as well.
Especially the old ford beam suspension. This should play a roll in your decision making as well.
Need tough as nails? Ford with twin beam. Need better ride and user serviceability? Chevy independent.
You can add some more complexity when dealing with different rear end options and their pros/cons plus upgradability.

 

[Gideon33w]

I should also note the driving differences. A lot of rear overhang means the tail end swings around a lot when you're turning. Easy to bump something. The longer wheelbase options dont have that issue but the turning circle itself is different. If you're not used to it you might bump the tail on something in your short wheel base extended or run over a curb in your long wheel base extended. Beyond that, longer wheel base vehicles tend to be easier for people to get used to and are less twitchy on the highway in high winds.

Note: Most people don't take a lick of any of this into consideration before buying. You make do with what ya got.

 

[John61CT]

For these concerns wouldn't higher ground clearance help with the longer wheelbase issue?

Maybe also with the rear overhang angle, at least a bit?

The Nissan van give 4" more to start with stock, but I would thing safely "lifting" the 'murican chassis(es) would be a pretty standard operation, at least more so than the foreign makes.

Saw a lifted Sienna once, guy said he could take it everywhere, had a little beast of an off-road trailer with a topside tent platform. . .

 

[highdesertranger]

yes a taller(more ground clearance) vehicle helps. however I would never lift an independent suspension vehicle, you will be sorry. I would put a 1 inch body lift(no taller) on it and the tallest tires I could fit without rubbing also put some good shocks on it. highdesertranger

 

[mr_elijah_gardner]

Ground clearance is a good thing off road. With a van I'd probably be more worried about clearance than rear overhang. I really doubt your going to go up anything steep enough in a 2wd van for overhang to be an issue. 

Attached is a pic that reminded me of living in the high desert and people trying to cross a dry lake bed after a big rain. Unless you have one awesome van rig this could be you. Common sense rules over all

 

[Gideon33w]

yes a taller(more ground clearance) vehicle helps.  however I would never lift an independent suspension vehicle,  you will be sorry.  I would put a 1 inch body lift(no taller) on it and the tallest tires I could fit without rubbing also put some good shocks on it.    highdesertranger

No concerns lifting an independent suspension vehicle ... So long as it's done properly ...
Which about 1 in 20 people actually do or are willing to spend to do ... LMAO

 

[John61CT]

> rear overhang. I really doubt your going to go up anything steep enough in a 2wd van for overhang to be an issue. 

I scrape my tail on regular driveways all the time, don't need to go offroad for that.

Especially if you put on a hitch.

 

[John61CT]

> No concerns lifting an independent suspension vehicle ... So long as it's done properly ...

Any chance you could help define "properly" for our future reference?

And do you mean that costs like thousands?

 

[highdesertranger]

more like 10's of thousands, highdesertranger

 

[akrvbob]

I've had an extended wheelbase Chevy 3500 and you have all covered it really well. Some of my real-world experience:

1. The ride and handling is a million times better on the Chevy! Mine had the best ride I ever saw in a vehicle that size. I could fly down washboard roads and be totally comfortable. Had a friend with an extended Ford and she crawled down the same road. One day we went to town together and on the way back we were crawling again at 5 mph where I went 40. I said it would ride better if she went faster. She speeded up to 20 and we could both feel her rear end squirrelling around, it was totally unsafe.  We went the rest of the way at 5 mph. 
2. I never once had a problem with it getting high-centered or the rear end dragging. I always have a hitch haul on it, and never once hit it on anything. And I go looking for the very worst roads I think the van can handle.
3. I have zero evidence of this, but I'm convinced all the roll-overs on 15 passenger vans were caused by the long overhang in the back. People overloaded them at the rear and that lifted the front end making it too light, contributing to the rollovers. That's pure speculation but I'm not willing to risk it myself, I'd never buy a Ford or Dodge extended van.

Now, here is the bottom line: When I sold that extended van I did not buy another one, I bought another Chevy but it is a 2500 regular length. Why?

The turning radius on those things is truly terrible. A three cut turn-around on my current van would be a 4-5 cut on the extended. A 4-5 cut on the regular length may literally be impossible with the 3500 extended!!

I routinely take the 2500 regular length to places where I wouldn't consider taking the 3500 extended. No worries with ground clearance or ride, it is strictly the turning radius that kills it in the backcountry.

But man do I miss that fantastic ride!! You just can't get everything and backcountry ability is my top priority.

 

[AntiGroundhogDay]

Turning radius is definitely something to consider. Maybe a vehicle can get to a backcountry spot, but if the trail is narrow and you can't turn around, it may be a no-go as reversing out a few miles doesn't sound like much fun.

 

[95Astro]

Look for the chevy express 2500 work cargo van. It is slightly longer than the standard sized one. Notice the additional space between the rear tire and the barn doors.

 

[95Astro]

Bob,
You may just have changed my mind about buying the CE 2500 work cargo van.  But all that extra interior space and towing capacity! This is why i read these forums, to learn. Thanks for the insights.