Finding Insurance.....

[Awesome Street]

Hey everyone!
So I'm still in the research phase of this project I'm taking on and one especially frustrating aspect that I'm having trouble with is insurance...
I've been calling around to all the major insurance companies and most of them seem to be dead-ends, none of them are willing to insure a custom camper unless it comes from a reputable manufacturer.

I've decided that since this is something I will be living out of for a long time, I probably will go ahead and develop a nicer build with paneling, cabinetry, a solar electric system, etc. I'm looking around at some used Sprinter vans with an extended wheel base and it looks like I could probably find a decent used one for about 15-20k (although I'm half expecting someone on the forum to read this and respond with something to the effect of, "20K!? That's really cheap for a Sprinter van, if you find one for that price it's probably a piece of junk! You're likely looking at at least 30k for a decent one!"), and according to my estimates in Excel, the interior work I want to do will run me another 7-10k. I estimate this will probably take a year to complete.

For now, I simply want to find out how much insurance will cost and that's been a huge hassle. Can anyone here point me to a company that insures custom campers?

Thanks!

 

[Almost There]

What you can do in the way of insurance depends entirely on the jurisdiction in which the vehicle is titled. You're right, most insurance companies will not cover a DIY conversion.

Some places you can have the vehicle declared to be an RV but then can't get insurance on it. Other places you can. And this goes for not only the US but Canada as well.

I went through insurance hell in Ontario with my DIY conversion. I ended up with insurance from a company that specialized in antique and rare (hard to insure) vehicles. It was for stated value and I had to put the value on it myself.

Here in BC I was not only able to have the title changed to RV but then put insurance on it. Again, because it is custom done, I had to figure out what value insurance to place on it.

You might want to talk to Escapees for a source of insurance but again, it will depend on where you intend to title the vehicle what insurance company you will be able to find to cover it.

The other problem is finding someone to cover it if you're a full-timer. My personal contents aren't covered under the auto insurance, only the vehicle. I'm expected to carry house insurance to cover my personal possessions, fortunately I own a home that I rent to my son so I have house insurance anyways.

 

[Awesome Street]

Well let's first find out about the options I have on the table. I live in Washington State. I'm sorry if this is a lazy question, but I'm honestly not sure where to begin to look in order to find out if/how I can have my vehicle declared an RV, and then if I can have it insured. Can I trouble you to point me in the right direction?

I will be full-timing, but the only real challenge I face here is that I won't have an actual physical address. One thing I could potentially do is take out a renter's insurance policy and list the address of a family member as my place of residence. Do you think this could work?

Thanks!

 

[Almost There]

Everyone has to have a physical address of some sort!

It's needed for income tax, banking, insurance, charge cards etc. etc. etc. ad nauseum. Just because we're on the road full-time doesn't mean that we don't have to have 'place of residence' - somehow 'no fixed address' just doesn't cut it....

Some use a friends or relatives, others have real property that they own but never actually live on. Some choose a state like SD where they can stay for one night in an RV park (or just pay for the one night) and then use that to establish residency. Others choose to register title in Texas where they can use Escapees services. Some, if they have an RV titled in their name, choose Florida where places like St. Brendan's Isle in Green Cove Springs is legally able to provide an address.

If you want to remain a WA resident, then yes, using a friend or relatives' address will work.

Check with the DMV/DOL for the absolute rulings but here's a thread I found on Skoolies web site about WA rules.

http://www.skoolie.net/forums/f18/title-to-rv-in-washington-state-18743.html

IIWM, I'd get my ducks lined up BEFORE buying anything. Finding out that the cost of insurance is higher than you're willing to go or damn near impossible to get might make a difference in your choice of vehicle.

OH, and do some investigation before you decide you want a Sprinter - the problems associated with them can far outweigh any benefits from their larger interior. You might want to think in terms of a regular cargo van with a high top put on it for you.

 

[QinReno]

Hello Street. There are many many many threads on this forum about establishing residency some place or another. Look at those.

In regards insuring a DIY converted van as an RV, I just insured mine as a regular van. I told the insurance company I would be using it mainly for camping, and "not" for commercial or daily use, and I didn't care about insuring any sort of conversion. The van itself is worth a huge amount more than anything I'll ever put inside it. They were happy to take my money.

 

[John61CT]

Don't call the insurance companies if you are wanting anything unusual.

Find an agent, ideally with experience in RVs.

 

[RoamerRV428]

Don't call the insurance companies if you are wanting anything unusual.

Find an agent, ideally with experience in RVs.

This.  


OP, I would walk into a real ins. agency and explain exactly what I am insuring and let them take it from there.  They will get some type of policy written for you I would think

 

[Awesome Street]

Okay... Here's where I'm at as of right now...
1) I want to do a Sprinter van conversion, and I'd like it to be a nicer build.
2) My budget for the conversion as of right now is 30k.
2) I want to find full coverage for the vehicle.

While I appreciate all of your suggestions, I'm not finding them to be of adequate help. I think it would be best that I get in touch with someone who has taken on a project similar to what I'm looking to do and exchange PM's with them or chat with them over Skype or something... Can anyone here connect me with a person who has done this?

 

[John61CT]

This is a very difficult and complex topic, do not expect anyone but an agent **in your state** to help you with anything but general suggestions.

Many people just get regular comprehensive on the van as a van, and keep receipts to get "contents" coverage through a rider on a homeowners or renters policy, those appliances just being "cargo" at the time.

Usually an "agreed value" policy on the whole buildout is not available for DIY conversions, but only done by established companies like RoadTrek etc.

You cannot IMO realistically expect your labor on a DIY build to be covered.

If all your other policies (home, other cars, etc) can also be packaged by your new savvy agent, that often helps.

What is available even from the same underwriting companies **totally varies** from state to state.

Some people find it best to move their legal domicile to a state that makes what insurance they want possible.

You will find much better-informed people on your situation here,
https://goo.gl/pzCo8j
Check out how that site-specific search works, and add your current residence state

"Washington-state OR WA"

to see if any recommendations to a specific savvy agent are made.

Or post a new thread in that forum, giving all relevant details, and perhaps with a tone that does not imply you think you're entitled to get what you're looking for, or that you expect it to be easy, it is **not**.

Hope this helps and best of luck, please pay it forward.

 

[Almost There]

There are a lot of us with what we consider to be 'a nicer build' (mine included  - link in signature).

My vehicle is now titled as an RV and insured for what it would cost me to replace every last screw and bit of it (except personal possessions) at today's costs. Since I outfitted a lot of it while I was stateside I had the additional problem of sourcing everything in Canada when I was assessing a value to place on it.

The problem with giving you exact information is that each state/province has different rules for what can be titled as an RV. Add that to the problem that insurance companies are free to write their own rules as to what they will insure (and they do!).

There is a thread around here somewhere that details the insurance hell I went through in another jurisdiction.

If you want I'll be happy to tell you in detail what I had to do but since you're in a different jurisdiction, some or all of it might not be valid information.

 

[John61CT]

Here's past threads for this forum, none Washington-specific afaict

https://goo.gl/UVmPbE

 

[rm.w/aview]

Registering & insuring it as a van may elude the RV parking bans, as well as some road restrictions should local LEO stop you.

 

[HalfShadows]

AS, I am in the process of doing a conversion in Wa. State. I went to the DOL when i titled my vehicle. I inquired about conversion to an RV to have it titled as such. The person informed me to keep every receipt for the conversion. Once fulfilling the requirements for an RV, which is outlined on their website, I would have to purchase a $10.00 fee for an inspection with the State Highway Patrol. The State Highway Patrol will inspect the vehicle to make sure that meets all requirements. If it fails their standards then you have to correct the discrepancy/discrepancies and set up a new inspection. They will also weigh your vehicle to insure that it does not exceed GVWR. So the inspection will take place at a weigh station. Once all the criteria is met with the state they will re-title your vehicle to RV. Keep all documentation to present to an insurance agency. I heard but haven't checked, Geico is more open to insuring the value of converted vehicle.

 

[John61CT]

Many insurance companies, if you try to deal with them directly, ignore what the vehicle is registered as.

They look up the VIN, and if a cargo van, that's what they will use, can't get rear passengers covered.

This is a particular problem for VINs showing "incomplete", cutaway models that get converted to utility/shuttle/box vans.

You need an experienced agent to go to bat for you, sometimes even if you just want liability cover.

Most importantly, note what your insurance company or even your agent **says** is meaningless, you **must** read all the fine print, only the written contract can help you if you actually want to get a payout when something happens.

It is not inaccurate to say the whole business is a racket, chock full of scamming cheaters when it comes time to pay out.

 

[John61CT]

Recent post from Skoolies

http://www.skoolie.net/forums/f18/progressive-insurance-24565.html

 

[rm.w/aview]

For now, I simply want to find out how much insurance will cost and that's been a huge hassle. Can anyone here point me to a company that insures custom campers?

Thanks!

Progressive Ins., Foremost Ins., and perhaps get some info here http://www.rv-dreams.com/rv-insurance-coverages.html

 

[mayble]

If you really want to register and insure as an RV, one alternative would be to buy an RV and gut it, then rebuild it to your liking; you may find a deal on a good vehicle with some interior damage, smoke/pet odors, etc. Reuse what you can.
My van is just a cargo van as far as my auto insurance company is concerned. My renter's insurance covers all my "camping gear" and everything else inside, and also provides general liability insurance (dog bite, personal injury, etc) that isn't covered by auto insurance. I chose the value of the policy based on all my additions to the van - stove, frig, etc, as well as the rest of my possessions. Which really didn't add up to much, once I had to put a number on it. Cheap insurance is yet another benefit of minimalism.

 

[John61CT]

Yes that is the standard easiest way to go.

What is **much** more difficult is trying to get comprehensive on a DIY build at an agreed upon replacement value.

Especially if the owner thinks they should get repaid for the labor time part.

Those where an agent has been able to get anything like that I've heard of,

the owner had **fully** documented their very professional build process, both text and photos, kept all receipts etc.

That may help, but no guarantee anything like that is available in a given state.

The experienced agent willing to go to bat for you is the key.

 

[vanlifeadventures21]

We got our insurance through Costco. We explained the whole situation to them and they were able to come up with a plan for our build. We had a fridge and solar but no plumbing or toilet.

We found it was actually cheaper to keep a costco membership just for the insurance than to insure through someone else so you could give them a call and see what they say.