Electric heater help

[rderito]

Hi, can someone figure this out for me.. I purchased a e-heat envi wall mounted electric heater for my insulated cargo van. will the heater be able to run all night on two 100 amp/hr batteries?  the heater is 432 Watts and 4.2 amps. I checked it with a meter.
I know it depends on how well my van is insulated but lets say it runs intermittent all night 1/2 hr on and next 1/2hr off ..
we use one in our bedroom with the main house heat set at 50° all night in the new england winter and its warm enough but I have to turn it on about 2 hours before going to bed and close the door.

 

[highdesertranger]

we need more info. are those numbers you posted taken at 120v or 12v. if the numbers come from 120v then no you will not be able to run it all night off of your batteries.

remember it is very inefficient to heat anything off of electricity. you don't notice it in a sticks and bricks because electricity is so cheap and seemly endless. but on the road you are your own power company and electricity is no longer cheap and endless.

highdesertranger

 

[mjbeam]

432 watts divided by 12v = 36 amps. 200ah (assuming your 2 100ah batteries are 12v) divided by 36 amps is 5.55 hours.

If you are really lucky you might be able to run that heater for 1-2 hours.

 

[rderito]

Yes I would use an inverter, I guess it will not work.
I was trying to think of a (dry ) heat source instead of installing one of those diesel air heaters,
Any other ideas ?

 

[mjbeam]

I currently use a heater buddy to heat my van but there are issues with it. First, it puts out too much heat so I have to either increase ventilation to remove the excess heat, or keep turning it on and off to regulate the temperature.

I have these 2 very small electric heaters that I bought on Amazon:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07JKNKBXH/ref=oh_aui_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07B26KKH7/ref=oh_aui_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

...and this thermostat:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07D121Q9Q/ref=oh_aui_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I'm going to try and create a small insulated area and see if I can use one of these small heaters to keep that area warm enough, without killing my 200ah battery bank. Even with these, I may need to increase battery capacity to 400ah.

 

[bullfrog]

Everybody struggles with heat and agrees you need to be able to survive with out it as nothing is fool proof. Many do with little or none as expense and moisture become huge problems if large amounts of heat are required. This is why many go to extremes insulating or reducing the amount of space they need to heat and many follow the seasons simply because they are unable to afford or solve the problem. Unless you are plugged in the grid large amounts of electric heat is impractical. Wood heat is becoming popular again with small stoves but then space and maintenance becomes an issue and if you use an electric fan some solar will be required to run that as well. A vented to outside air propane, diesel or gasoline heater helps solve the moisture problem but again most use electric fans or pumps that will require some if not a lot of solar. Solar only works well in sunny weather and if in cold climates you will have to suppliment with a generator or grid power every few days. Most end up following the seasons with some insulation and solar, Buddy or Wave (can be bought in less BTU outputs than the Buddy) propane heater, 12 volt fan, some vents and lots of covers it seems.

 

[tx2sturgis]

Electric heat itself is 99-100% efficient but the production, storage, and supply of portable electric power to run the electic heat is where the low efficiencies are found. Solar panels are about 17-20% efficient, lead acid batteries are around 85% efficient when new, and inverters are around 90% efficient in some cases. Losses in your wiring, cabling, and fuses futher reduce efficiencies by a small amount.

A typical 12v 100 ah battery is, in theory, a 1200 (more or less) watt hour battery. Two of them are 2400 watt hours, but keeping the maximum depletion in the 50% range, we are back to about 1200 watt hours.

An electric heater that consumes 430 watts, powered with 120v OR 12v (it does not matter the supply voltage, watts are watts) will pull that battery bank down to that 50% level in about 2-3 hours. At 50% duty cycle, you MIGHT get 4 to 6 hours....maybe. Your batteries will be working hard, and over time, will loose capacity, and need to be replaced more often.

Then you also have to replace the electric power you used every day, so now you need a large solar array or a generator, and that is where the inefficiencies are.

It can get expensive in a hurry.

You can make it work, sorta, on cool but very sunny days, and lower lattitudes, if you cut way back on electricity use, install a LOT of solar, and a large and heavy lead-acid battery bank, or an expensive LiFePo4 battery bank. 

But it's a WHOLE lot cheaper, lighter, and easier, not to mention practical and convienient, to use propane, diesel, kerosene, or some other fuel for heating.

 

[RogerD]

If you are worried about moisture (mold) from using a heater that's not dry heat.

Check out this mold prevention spray.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Endurance-BioBarrier-32-oz-Mold-Prevention-Spray-EZC-0032/205386028

6 month guarantee: high traffic surfaces such as bathrooms, kitchens, carpets, floors, fabric, upholstery, more
2 year guarantee: indoor/outdoor surfaces such as drywall, stucco, wood, metal, plastic, concrete, brick, roofing, siding, boats, RVs, more
25 year guarantee: enclosed areas such as attics, crawl spaces, wall cavities, insulation, more

 

[rderito]

That's an interesting product.
and I like the diesel heaters but I thought you would smell the exaust from it seeping into the van from underneath.
Bob recommends one of those Olympian wave heaters in one of his videos.
maby that's the way to go.

 

[tx2sturgis]

That's an interesting product.
and I like the diesel heaters but I thought you would smell the exaust from it seeping into the van from underneath.
Bob recommends one of those Olympian wave heaters in one of his videos.
maby that's the way to go.

Bunk heaters as we call them in the transportation industry, commonly called 'parking heaters' in Europe and online, work well, and if vented and installed properly, you wont smell any fumes inside. 

But they are faily complex to install, and name brand units are expensive. Chinese knock-offs are cheap, but, long-term reliablity and safety is not yet proven (to me, anyway).

Catalytic heaters work very well, are simple, reliable, easy to maintain, efficient, and fairly inexpensive. They do need to have air movement for interior ventilation and fresh air, for oxygen, and they emit water vapor which can build up on the windows and un-insulated metal surfaces of a vehicle. You need to have a CO detector in the living space when using one.

Every solution has it's pros and cons.

 

[XERTYX]

I used a Coleman bear cat I believe catalytic heater when I had my boat. It was used from online and worked well but the little green bottles wont cut the mustard. I would wake up cold after 5 hours or so. A bulk tank is needed. It wasnt terribly expensive to run and I was on a shoestring and a prayer budget at the time. One word of caution. Do make sure you have a CO detector. I didnt and (thankfully) woke up one night feeling like I had a weight on my chest and the air of the sealed cabin felt heavy and i felt like i couldn't breath although i was breathing. I immediately sprang open the top hatch and heaved my upper body thru to fresh air. I could breath again. And my sickness began to disappear within a few minutes. Severely unventilated areas are a dangerous place to run any propane device. Even a freezer IMO.

 

[jimindenver]

if you are thinking electric heat, then think personal heat, not space heat. You can remain very comfortable with a heated blanket, throw, mattress pad or as I once had a 12 volt heated seat pad. Once it got going it would keep me really warm. I miss my 135 watt mat that I kept under my desk. You wouldn't think that it would heat anything but it you sure would feel it if you were sitting above it and stepped off. The best part was your feet were not just warm, they would get hot and sooooo relaxed.

 

[maki2]

That's an interesting product.
and I like the diesel heaters but I thought you would smell the exaust from it seeping into the van from underneath.
Bob recommends one of those Olympian wave heaters in one of his videos.
maby that's the way to go.

When it is cold outside just don't have the fresh air intake really close to the heater exhaust. Actually there is very little smell to it because they barely sip fuel, I can heat my travel trailer all month long during the winter time for about $25.00 worth of fuel. They do not use anywhere close to the quantity of fuel that a motor in a running vehicle uses. Plus you can run some of them on bio fuel which will make you hungry for fish and chips

 

[Gr8ful]

I found this on high $$ boat owners that compared the no name chinese vs chinese made Eberspächer heaters. Watch the many you tubes.

While doing research on the 5kw air diesel heater I found a boating forum that is on facebook which I'm not on but they have formed a sub forum of 2700 members just to study these heaters, here are some comments. Thay did a poll where 10 to 1 approved & liked the chinese ones. I plan on a exhaust water heat exchanger to warm the coolant in the diesel engine. I have coolant to the rear for heat anyway so it should be easy.

Default Re: Chinese (5kw )air heater
Mine is still working perfectly . The eBay Chinese heater Facebook group started a poll a few days ago which showed a ratio of 10:1 in favor of satisfied users of the heater.
In the group there are pics of installations, test setups , and solutions to problems.
The truth of the matter is that at the price that they Chinese heaters are selling, I will not complain over a few niggles with it taking into account that a spare fan for my Eberspächer D4 plus can buy a couple of Chinese ones.
Ocqueteau 8.15,200hpNanni.
Buster Sun R,25 hp outboard

Default Re: Chinese (5kw )air heater
Excellent. gives folks chance to weigh up the actual pros and cons from users .
As per usual our colonial cousins appear to have got wise to these budget heaters many years before us.
As regards quality and reliability , suspect many boaters have aboard their vessel invertors/ voltage droppers/ split diode devices/ chargers and a multitude of dubious electronic items that the importer has held their nose when worrying about safety compliance certificates.
It would help if a decent photocopier was used and the signature did not resemble M. Mouse.
As for the magic letters CE on the paperwork.

 

[Weight]

I had enough of the unvented heaters. I have installed a propane vented heater. Suburban. There are other brands that look like easier to install, but the price was right on mine. I am a very happy camper. I set the thermostat and stay warm all night, getting up in a warm van at dawn break. Coffee and toast, watch the sun come up sparkling on the icey limbs of the pines.

 

[XERTYX]

I had enough of the unvented heaters. I have installed a propane vented heater. Suburban. There are other brands that look like easier to install, but the price was right on mine. I am a very happy camper. I set the thermostat and stay warm all night, getting up in a warm van at dawn break. Coffee and toast, watch the sun come up sparkling on the icey limbs of the pines.

Sounds divine. My eventuality will be a wood burning stove but I havent worked out the logistics for a travel trailer install. I'll likely get the one Bob recommends. Olympian I think wave heater for now. 

My permanent home would be a converted vintage RV tiny home on a large piece of land in the sticks and a converted popup camper to tow with me when i get itchy feet. The tiny home could have the wood heater and the popup the olympian. No wasted money. Just swap out the equipment when i reach the next step.

 

[JD GUMBEE]

I'll likely get the one Bob recommends.

Even though some get stars in their eyes, Bob is not God.

When the video was made, (as far as I know) the cheaper diesel heaters were not known to Bob. These bunk heaters used to cost 900-1200 dollars. (Check the video date.) Now they are available all over the place for 175 or so.

Not only is the diesel heater safer, it is a LOT easier to deal with, a lot less rain inside your vehicle and can be installed in a lot more places without dominating cabin space...and no burn danger if you rub against the vent.

and I like the diesel heaters but I thought you would smell the exaust from it seeping into the van from underneath.

Not if it is installed correctly. The pipe only needs be peeking out from the bottom an inch or two and convection takes over from there.
Millions of trucks use these with no trouble.
They work great.

 

[XERTYX]

Even though some get stars in their eyes, Bob is not God.

Oh I have no disillusions that he is all knowledgeable. But he makes a lot of sense on a lot of points. He makes me scratch my head sometimes but often times when I've sat and thunk it over I find logic in his point of view.

Anyone that's passionate as well as logical gets my strict attention. I figured it was a good suggestion. Based on my experiences with platinum catalyst tent heaters I wanted to find a better option. I've seen no negative feedback nor virtually anything negative about these heaters. Seems an upgrade from the Coleman heater I still have. Seems safer too. A safe bet by my reckoning.