Durango Colorado up in arms against boondockers

[AreWeLostYet]

Articles in Durango Herald (Colorado) about Forest Service trying to close off areas used for "Non-recreational, Long-term camping".


There are lots more articles along similar lines in this newspaper. That kind of local sentiment along with Trump's drive to sell-off, privatize, close down, lock-out public's access to anything *public*, we may be seeing fewer places to live on public lands. The sentiment of locals, of course, is to some degree driven by boondockers who behave badly - leaving heaps of trash, starting fires when/where prohibited, collecting large amounts of wood without a permit etc.

Mod edit, link removed see below for link.

 

[LathrenJames]

I spent 2 weeks camping on BLM land outside of Buena Vista, last Summer. I paddle and so I'd leave early, then drive far distances to put-ins or to hike or visit towns like Leadville and I'd return near dark. My camp was spotless and I followed all LNT principles. Still, every day a ranger would leave a notice. The day before I left we met up there at the same time. His reaction was that he assumed I was avoiding him. I had to laugh because that was not even in my head. He explained the dilemma to me and he was right. None of the BLM toilets have a trash can but that didnt matter to some who would just pile their trash up in the corners or toss trash down into the pit toilets. People do take advantage and this is costing everyone the freedom we all want. I wonder if posting LNT principles would help encourage people to be more responsible. Perhaps Subaru could start sending their LNT teams out to dispersed camping areas. Perhaps a team could be invited to Bob Well's 2019 RTR. Couldn't hurt..

 

[bullfrog]

More people means more problems. Avoid the people and avoid the problems.

 

[MrNoodly]

Well, Durango has also become increasingly gentrified.

 

[LathrenJames]

More people means more problems.  Avoid the people and avoid the problems.

True.

 

[AreWeLostYet]

More people means more problems.  Avoid the people and avoid the problems.

The boondockers near Durango probably thought they were avoiding people. But the only places there are not people these days are places almost no one would want to camp/boondock.

And, Bob recommends picking a spot near enough to a city large enough to have WalMart etc. stores and a cell signal. So we have a conflict brewing.

 

[AreWeLostYet]

I spent 2 weeks camping on BLM land outside of Buena Vista, last Summer. I paddle and so I'd leave early, then drive far distances to put-ins or to hike or visit towns like Leadville and I'd return near dark. My camp was spotless and I followed all LNT principles. Still, every day a ranger would leave a notice. The day before I left we met up there at the same time. His reaction was that he assumed I was avoiding him. I had to laugh because that was not even in my head. He explained the dilemma to me and he was right. None of the BLM toilets have a trash can but that didnt matter to some who would just pile their trash up in the corners or toss trash down into the pit toilets. People do take advantage and this is costing everyone the freedom we all want. I wonder if posting LNT principles would help encourage people to be more responsible. Perhaps Subaru could start sending their LNT teams out to dispersed camping areas. Perhaps a team could be invited to Bob Well's 2019 RTR. Couldn't hurt..

A-holes who just want a place to do drugs and not have to do much of anything more will always be that way. No educational effort can get through to them. Bob has acknowledged this when he talks about RTR - having to deal with the few who make things difficult for the many.
If only Bob could be at every boondocking spot himself (like the Santa Clause he's been told he resembles) to regulate the behavior of everyone staying on public lands. Sadly, the opposite is true. Federal agencies like USFS, NPS, BLM are cutting budgets and laying off personnel. So they are falling back on locking gates.

 

[LathrenJames]

There's also the problem of young people who pretty much live in the park at Salida for incidence. Locals, though fairly tolerant, pretty much do lump "it" all together. The availability of drugs has not helped. We have friends who have lived in Salida for many years but they are selling because of it "all". We were never accosted by any of the youth but they are very present and do ask for money. Many have dogs who also live in the park and under the walkways and this is a source of contention, as well. Then you have boondockers around and near town and it can begin to seem a bit overmuch to the locals. Our friend literally said to us that "Colorado isn't Colorado, anymore." I imagine that is a fairly common judgement which will only grow. Playing nice is all each of us can do. And being supportive of one another.  :heart:

 

[AreWeLostYet]

There's also the problem of young people who pretty much live in the park at Salida for incidence. Locals, though fairly tolerant, pretty much do lump "it" all together. The availability of drugs has not helped. We have friends who have lived in Salida for many years but they are selling because of it "all". We were never accosted by any of the youth but they are very present and do ask for money. Many have dogs who also live in the park and under the walkways and this is a source of contention, as well. Then you have boondockers around and near town and it can begin to seem a bit overmuch to the locals. Our friend literally said to us that "Colorado isn't Colorado, anymore." I imagine that is a fairly common judgement which will only grow. Playing nice is all each of us can do. And being supportive of one another.  :heart:

Johnny Cash had a song, *Water Isn't Water Anymore." I think if he were alive and writing he might come out with *America isn't America Anymore*.

I have personal experience with millennial who got caught up in the *Green Rush* to Colorado thinking every drug would be legalized following the cannabis businesses sprouting up in Denver and elsewhere. Someone didn't educate them in the American corporatocracy. Big business took over the cannabusiness and wouldn't hire anyone with drug arrests so all these kids ended up stranded around Colorado's mountains waiting for their ship to come in or something. No education for the real world. Parents discarded them. Being swept from place to place along with the rest of the homeless. A generation wasted due to incompetent leaders and educators and corporate greed. So there they are with their dogs and their Doc Martins and all the weed in the world to smoke and not much else. And when you're stoned, the future is the next toke.

 

[highdesertranger]

link to article in the Durango Herald about closing camping areas,

https://durangoherald.com/articles/106173

highdesertranger

 

[LathrenJames]

[Johnny Cash](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johnny_Cash) had a song, *Water Isn't Water Anymore." I think if he were alive and writing he might come out with *America isn't America Anymore*.

I have personal experience with millennial who got caught up in the *Green Rush* to Colorado thinking every drug would be legalized following the cannabis businesses sprouting up in Denver and elsewhere. Someone didn't educate them in the American corporatocracy. Big business took over the cannabusiness and wouldn't hire anyone with drug arrests so all these kids ended up stranded around Colorado's mountains waiting for their ship to come in or something. No education for the real world. Parents discarded them. Being swept from place to place along with the rest of the homeless. A generation wasted due to incompetent leaders and educators and corporate greed. So there they are with their dogs and their Doc Martins and all the weed in the world to smoke and not much else. And when you're stoned, the future is the next toke.

Exactly! And well-said, unfortunately... Some of the youth we spoke with were very nice but they truly held the belief that if they had more money in their pockets than they could spend that day, they were fine. Terrible dilemma and hard to get out of.

 

[lenny flank]

Alas, it's always a handful of shitheads who ruin things for everyone else.

I camp almost exclusively in urban areas, mostly Walmarts, and sadly the same handful of shitheads can be found there--dumping their shit (literally) in the parking lot, panhandling all the customers, dropping needles in the parking lot, and being a general PITA .....

All they do is cause unending trouble for the rest of us.

 

[John61CT]

Watch out when the next big downturn comes and the numbers quadruple.

 

[LathrenJames]

We had to learn the hard way. We saw an older man in a wheelchair outside of WalMart, asking for money. He was clearly intoxicated. His hospital pants were soiled badly. His leg had been amputated at the knee and he was a heavy person. Of course we felt sorry for him- gave him money; went into the Goodwill next door and found new clothes that would fit him and gave him a sleeping bag because he pointed out where he'd been staying behind a dumpster (conveniently located behind a liquor store).

This guy was articulate and charming even drunk. He was super friendly. We felt okay with what efforts we'd made for him. 

The next day, as we were leaving we saw him getting into his beautiful RV. One of the big ones. We asked some locals about him. We were told we could learn more about the man and his "business" on his FB Page! Uh, he's doing quite well.

Lesson learned... :s

 

[DannyB1954]

People through this forum and videos are being encouraged to get a vehicle and go live on public land. The public lands were not set aside to be permanent residences. As more people do this, there will be more regulations and limitations. The authorities won't see one person camped, they will see a village forming. I foresee in the future rules that say you can camp on public land X amount of days a year. Some places already have reduced the stay time from two weeks to one. Look at Ehrenberg. As an area becomes popular, more problems arise and authorities have to deal with it.

 

[Blanch]

I have my secret spots and I do not put them on the internet. It just takes a few problems and some areas get shut down. I was at Lake Shastina in the free camping area just this time last year. It was lakeside camping and absolutely beautiful. Then some folks trashed the place and the local regulators made it Day use only.




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[tripper]

It is important to always have your campsite look neat and tidy, look like a vacationer and not a gypsy camp. The first impression is very important to not being hassled by a LEO or called in as a public nuisance by locals.

I really don't see citizens up in arms about boon dockers, they are up in arms about homeless people trashing their community, but if your campsite looks like a homeless camp they will lump you in with the homeless.

 

[Doubleone]

I have seen BLM alternately close desert OHV areas for a year or more to allow the environment to recover from heavy OHV use. This practice I tend to agree with because it seems to be a good land management practice. Funny how the article labels the problem as non-recreational camping... Seriously?? What exactly is the distinction between recreational and non-recreational camping? I'm retired, and I want to enjoy camping full time... So, if I go to a resort area for more than 15 days or bounce around campgrounds does that mean my purpose is no longer recreational? I always find it best to work with human behavior rather than against it... Perhaps some dumpster services and portapotties would be cheaper than enforcement... If the issue is denuding the landscape, perhaps some signs closing the area for a certain time for environmental regeneration, and identifying an alternate or preferred location to camp.

 

[LoupGarou]

Sounds like there’s two distinct groups now. Those who are Non-Recreational Long Term Campers and those who are Recreational Long Term Campers.

The former being Squatters and the latter being Boondockers.

 

[John61CT]

Will always be grey areas, not a B&W line.