Bel-Air or Tradesman over cab shells

[Lafnbug]

Anyone here have experience with either of these builders?

Bel-Air, makers of the wood and aluminum camper shells:
http://belairshells.com/wood-n-alum

Tradesman, all aluminum utility and camper shells:
http://tradesmantrucktops.com/custom_cabover/

I am very close to attempting my own cabover camper shell build for a Toyota Tacoma, but not sure it is the best long-term idea as weight is a MAJOR concern for me. I don't know the costs of the Tradesman's, but the all-aluminum construction is very tempting! I am curious:

1. What is the weight difference, assuming identical toppers? I assume the aluminum will be lighter, but is it enough to offset the costs?
2. Strength is also a concern, and the aluminum seems to have a great advantage here as well, with it's welded frame versus the glued and stapled wood (I'm guessing) of the Bel-Air. I won't be doing a ton of off-roading, but I don't want to cringe every time I approach some washboard or rough patch.
3. I'm wondering how insulation and shelves could be attached in the aluminum version.

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

I'll be following this thread with a great deal of interest.

I'm currently planning to get an ARE Deluxe Commercial Unit for my SuperDuty.

http://www.4are.com/product/dcu/

I've specced out a 36" high one with screened, sliding windows on both sides (no tool doors) and full length double doors on the back (no tailgate).  I've been quoted $2200 for it.

Understand, this won't be to live in full time, I plan to tow a trailer for that.  This will be for the occasional overnight side trips into the back country.

I'm thinking of gluing polyiso insulation between the aluminum ribs, and skinning the inside with 1/8" plywood - figure to drill into the ribs and use self tapping sheet metal screws, or possibly very high strength double sided tape.  Still researching that . . .

Regards
John

 

[myke]

I am interested in all three as well; belair, tradesman, and ARE dcu. That high tradesman on the tacoma looks awesome. I would love to know weight and price.

 

[Lafnbug]

Okay, I will try to call both makers to get some info when I get a chance. Myke happened to post a pic of exactly what I had in mind, and John is close with his 36" tall ARE. So far, this can be a pretty close apple-to-apple comparison. John, did they have a weight for your cap?

Other than weight and price, what other questions would y'all have? The Tradesman lists about 3 pages of options, so be realistic!

For me, I want a minimum of windows, not sure I want any on the sides. Maybe 2 small sliders or crank-outs. I want shelves/counters full height and length on both sides for the most part, will sleep in the middle. This seems to be the best use of space, and I can incorporate a seating area easily. I have searched this pretty thoroughly, but am open to suggestions!

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

John, did they have a weight for your cap?

I didn't think to ask.  I see they list weights on their website for their fiberglass models, but not for the DCUs.  I'm guessing that it will probably weigh less than a fiberglass one.  Since I'm throwing it on a 3/4 ton truck, I'm really not all that concerned with the weight.

Regards
John

 

[myke]

Okay, I will try to call both makers to get some info when I get a chance. Myke happened to post a pic of exactly what I had in mind, and John is close with his 36" tall ARE. So far, this can be a pretty close apple-to-apple comparison. John, did they have a weight for your cap?

Other than weight and price, what other questions would y'all have? The Tradesman lists about 3 pages of options, so be realistic!

For me, I want a minimum of windows, not sure I want any on the sides. Maybe 2 small sliders or crank-outs. I want shelves/counters full height and length on both sides for the most part, will sleep in the middle. This seems to be the best use of space, and I can incorporate a seating area easily. I have searched this pretty thoroughly, but am open to suggestions!

Cool!

Well I guess I would like to know the exact height of that shell; and what is the interior like, does it come bare, or with some sort of liner/insulation.

I think I like this one more than ARE dcu because it seems to be more aerodynamic above the cab. The ARE is just flat there. Plus that part over the cab would make for good storage...

 

[akrvbob]

I've been in the throes of indecision about all this because I want to travel more in the summer and not get eaten up by the cost of gas and the pollution they spew.

My current thinking is to sell my cargo trailer and replace it with a 4x4 Tacoma or a Ranger with either a 36 or 48 inch tall shell, probably from Bel Air because they are pretty close.

I'd tow the Tacoma with my current 1 ton van and live in the van and drive the Tacoma as my daily driver. In the summer the van would go into storage and I'd live and travel all summer in the Tacoma.

BUT, my primary goal is better MPG and I'm not sure I'd get enough. What kind of MPG would a 2001 Tacoma or Ranger get with a tall shell, does anyone know?

 

[Lafnbug]

My 2009 Tacoma standard cab, 4x4 (4cyl, 5spd manual) gets 20-21 with a medium height fiberglass cap, at normal highway speeds (65-70 for me).

If I slowed down, I could probably squeeze another mile or two per gallon. I figure the taller cap will probably lose 1-2 mpg, full load capacity another 1-2mpg, So I'm figuring (21-4); about 17-18 with the cap shown above. Not great, but a lot better than the 12-13 I currently get with the Express van!

I am hoping that the truck shown will approach 20mpg if driven at 55mph...

 

[highdesertranger]

I started a thread in "discussions that don't fit in other areas" about Bel Air shells. I am going to go there to do a Q and A with them if you have any questions post them up on that thread and I will ask them. highdesertanger

 

[Zeke]

I'm also interested in all of these manufacturers. Lately I've been leaning towards a Snugtop, but I'm still several months away from making a decision and I'd like to learn more about both aluminum on wood and aluminum on aluminum. I have an 8' bed and would like to hear some pricing for a shell with a cabover section. The options aren't all that important, I get that "extras cost extra".

Can the cabover section be used to sleep in? If not, what's the weight limit?

What about attaching shelves, cargo nets, whatever to the inside of the shell? If there's a carpeted liner, is the aluminum frame exposed?

And the overall strength / quality of construction, with respect to how it's going to hold up after having been taken down some rough roads is a concern for me as well.

 

[masterplumber]

I have a ARE DCU on my Ram 2500. I also had one on my previous F350. I love them for working out of. I've also insulated and paneled my current one so it makes a pretty decent camper too. But they definitely don't hold up well to twisting forest roads. They flex too much and it cracks the aluminum right next to the welds. And I'm not talking about rough four wheeling, just the normal driving up rutted forest roads that we all do.
My current topper is 6'' higher than the cab. I haven't measured the actual inside height, but it's pretty close to the same as a van - I can walk inside bent over. That also makes the side doors taller - tall enough that I can put a 5 gallon bucket through them upright.
At one time I had an ARE fiberglass unit - the one with a raised roof and a window in the raised section. It held up extremely well, even to some sever off roading. It wasn't quite as tall as my current topper, but for camping it was plenty comfortable. I'm not sure if I'd like it for full time living - not being able to stand up inside. And the extra storage in the cab over area would sure be nice.

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

I have a ARE DCU on my Ram 2500. I also had one on my previous F350. I love them for working out of. I've also insulated and paneled my current one so it makes a pretty decent camper too. But they definitely don't hold up well to twisting forest roads. They flex too much and it cracks the aluminum right next to the welds. And I'm not talking about rough four wheeling, just the normal driving up rutted forest roads that we all do.

That . . . is disturbing.  But thanks for the first hand report.

I'm planning to have mine built WITHOUT the side doors, as I have 0 need for them.  Wonder how that will change the strength equation . . .

Regards
John

 

[highdesertranger]

FYI the above post shows a serious flaw with welding aluminum. when you weld aluminum, over time it stress fractures at the end of the weld. that is why airplanes are bolted and riveted together, not welded. highdesertranger

 

[idn88]

I would stay away from anything "assembled" - either wood or aluminum - for anything that goes off-road. I haven't had a fiberglass top in a while, but did years ago and it held up well. The people on expedition-portal seem to like ARE. They will eventually crack, which can be fixed (most times) however it takes a lot. I think the assembled ones would likely fall apart at the seems quickly, vs a solid piece of composite fiberglass that will have some flex in it, and no joints to fail. My 2 cents.

If you want something higher build some pony walls (Bob had this in one of his posts about 6 months ago)?

Here are a number of good examples. Warning - you have to be logged in to see the pics. I have no affiliation with this site - besides frequenting it as well. http://www.expeditionportal.com/for...ur-Truck-Shell-Top-Modifications-and-Add-Ons-!

 

[ZoNiE]

1965 called... It want's its wood paneling back.

Seriously, I think every major metro area has a builder like this. We have one here. They usually make a nice product and work with you to get you what you need.

Ours is called Mountaineer. Not sure if they are still around, a micro burst trashed their building a while back.

 

[ZoNiE]

Well, don't get the 4 liter in the ranger. I got about 13 MPG with my 4 liter sport trac... I get 14 with my V8 sport trac...:dodgy:

 

[idn88]

Yep, small trucks aren't going to be really frugal on fuel - even 4 cylinder ones. There still pretty heavy and shaped like a brick compared to small cars. Of course 20 on the highway is better than 12.

 

[Lafnbug]

Well, I emailed Tradesman over 20 questions last week, and I have not heard back from them.  I emailed 2 different people there, and received 0 replies, so I guess all my questions are answered about custom, aluminum, overcab Tradesman shells! Looks like they don't need the business, so I am eagerly awaiting HighDesertRanger's query results from Bel-Air shells!

I read a great deal about the aluminum VS wood & aluminum full size camper inserts for pickups, and it seems like both have their problems (besides the incessant flame wars on the forums):

1. Aluminum welds don't like to twist or flex repeatedly, as they will work-harden and crack fairly quickly in off-road conditions. Having worked in the metalworking industry, I can attest to that fact.
2. Any shell constructed with wood, regardless if it has aluminum or wood framing, has to be looked after. Leaks are inevitable, wood will rot, and preventative maintenance is recommended. Hey, you can't ignore the effect of the elements on your home, no matter what construction is used!
3. As far as weight is concerned, I can't discern a straight answer. It sounds like the method of construction will affect the overall weight more that the materials used. Some have claimed their wood framed camper to be lighter than more modern aluminum framed versions.

So, does anyone make an overcab fiberglass shell? My searches have been unsuccessful.

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

So, does anyone make an overcab fiberglass shell? My searches have been unsuccessful.

Take a look at TelcoBilly's build thread here.  He used a DuraShell.

http://www.fleetwest.net/products/durashell/options.html

Regards
John

 

[Telcobilly]

I've heard that people who go to Baja with camper shells have to reinforce the bed sides.  I prefer a slide in like mine because the weight is on the bed floor,  no weight at all on the bed sides.  I'm seeing about 17 mpg with my utility shell,  contents,   4.0 V6 and 4X4 on my 2008 Tacoma.