Are CDLs required for large busses?

[SLB_SA]

First of all, the choice of "buses" vs "busses" is discussed in Merriam-Webster which states "The plural of bus is buses. A variant plural, busses, is also given in the dictionary, but has become so rare that it seems like an error to many people.  Nevertheless, buses is problematic: it looks like fuses, but doesn’t rhyme with it."


My son and I have discussed buying and fixing up a bus in which to live and travel.  His hobby is astronomy and preparing observation platforms on top of a bus from which to observe "the heavens" while parked in Arizona, New Mexico or elsewhere is appealing.  Yesterday he told me that a larger bus requires the driver to have a commercial driver's license (CDL), a fact of which I was unaware.  I looked at FMCSA and found that a "Class C" CDL might be required even if the bus was classified as a non commercial vehicle; the language states "Any single vehicle, or combination of vehicles, that does not meet the definition of Class A or Class B, but is either designed to transport 16 or more passengers, including the driver,..."  The language seems to target the designed use of the vehicle rather than its commercial or non commercial registration.  On the other hand, this section concerns commercial motor vehicles and begins "Drivers have been required to have a commercial driver's license (CDL) in order to drive certain commercial motor vehicles (CMVs) since April 1, 1992. "

Could anyone using a larger bus as a part-time or full-time vandweller comment on the driver's license requirements for buses?

 

[B and C]

Take out all the seats and convert to a RV. Standard DL for a RV no matter size.

Good luck with the telescope up on top.

 

[Trebor English]

Part of CDL training and testing covers systems not found on a Toyota Corolla like air brakes.  Even though a CDL isn't requires, some knowledge is necessary.

 

[travelaround]

It probably depends on the classification of the bus you want, so check your state's laws on that, and check the classification of any bus you want to buy before you purchase it.

My daughter has a large class C and did not need a CDL in her state. DMV wanted to register it as a commercial vehicle and so my daughter quickly worked on the conversion to show it had cooking facilities, a bathroom, beds, etc. The DMV code was specific about what they wanted to see before they would register it as an RV.

 

[bullfrog]

In most states vehicles registered as an RV used for recreation and not comercial purposes requires only a regular driver's license. Lots of motorhomes begin as commercial vehicles. Some states are starting to consider restrictions for drivers of extremely large RV's but to my knowledge I do not know of any that have required them. If you would like to get a class B license most school disrticts will train you even to have a subsitute driver in some cases. Practice and formal training may save your life or at least prevent you from taking someone elses.

 

[Rabbit]

An astronomical telescope is a high-precision instrument. Would a bus be a stable-enough mounting, especially with someone moving around inside it? Or maybe even just a stiff wind blowing? I'm not sure, but have my doubts.

 

[tx2sturgis]

If you get it registered as an RV you will not need a CDL. Period.

What you MIGHT need in SOME states is a Class B non-CDL. Check the website or call the DMV where you live.

The laws are very complex in some states, BUT...as long as you are not hauling passengers for profit, you will not need a CDL IF you get it re-registered as an RV.

Different states have different definitions of an RV, but basically, it needs to have sleeping, cooking, AC power, toilet, and heating or cooling that is seperate from the engine. In some states, a cot, a microwave, a power strip, and port-potty plus a Mr Buddy will meet the legal requirements. But not all states are this lenient.

Then you need to get insurance on it as well. This can be simple or complex, again, depending on where you live and the insurance company you choose.

There are many youtube videos that cover that subject for several different states.

As far as the telescope on the bus, I'm thinking the movement from people up on the top will render the telescope too wobbly, unless you install stabilizer jacks at all four corners....which is doable.

 

[highdesertranger]

can we put definitions with these abbreviations. for instance CDL means California(CA) Drivers License in CA. a class C license in CA is your normal everyday license. Class A is a commercial heavy truck, class B commercial Medium truck and M is a Motorcycle endorsement so a CM is a normal license and you can ride motorcycles, AM, BM, and so on. you also have special licenses for livery, Taxi, and Bus driver. I know CA is crazy but that's the way it is. highdesertranger

 

[tx2sturgis]

lol...but we all know California doesnt count...



Just like 'APD' could mean Atlanta Police Department or Abilene Police Department or Anaheim Police Department.

But 'CDL' means Commercial Drivers License in this context....in the case of a bus, hauling paying passengers (or school children) for pay, mainly.

 

[highdesertranger]

I know CA doesn't count but I am trying to get people to put definitions with the abbreviations. old habit, in California you CAN NOT(it against regulation) use abbreviations when you write up a bill for auto repair. there are to many meanings behind certain ones like R&R could mean remove and replace, or it could mean remove and rebuild, or going in a completely different direction it could mean rest and relaxation. just trying to help those not familiar with the lingo. highdesertranger

 

[travelaround]

Sorry ... didn't mean to produce alphabet soup!

I wasn't referring to anything in California.

CDL = commercial drivers' license (in all states, right?)

DMV = department of motor vehicles

RV = recreational vehicle  

How am I doing?

Here's a page that shows a visual graph with the 4 types of school busses - A, B, C, and D

 

[LoupGarou]

Run the VIN across your insurance company. Sourcing insurance coverage on DIY conversions can be problematic.

 

[highdesertranger]

no CDL does not mean Commercial Driver License in all states. that's my point, in California, CDL = California Driver License. a commercial license is a class A. so if John had a commercial license you would say John has a Class A license, not John has a CDL.

I know for people who these abbreviations are second nature this seems silly but for people who don't know the lingo it's very confusing. highdesertranger

 

[tx2sturgis]

no CDL does not mean Commercial Driver License in all states. 

Actually, it does, especially in the context of the original post:

I looked at FMCSA and found that a "Class C" CDL might be required even if the bus was classified as a non commercial vehicle; the language states

{snip}

"Drivers have been required to have a commercial driver's license (CDL) in order to drive certain commercial motor vehicles (CMVs) since April 1, 1992. "

The original post is asking about a federal "Commercial Drivers License", and has nothing to do with California. And a federal CDL can be Class A, Class B, or Class C.

By the way...

The FMCSA is an agency that regulates 'motor carriers' that cross state lines (or haul hazardous materials anywhere) in commerce....they have no power whatsoever to regulate private motorhomes and RVs, UNLESS you are being paid to drive or haul one, (or carry paying passengers within it) across state lines, such as when you are 'transporting' it 'for hire', from manufacturer to dealer (or seller to buyer) etc.

 

[highdesertranger]

well I will have to respectfully disagree. any paper work California you fill out that asks for your CDL number wants your driver license number. the police refer to it as a CDL as do insurance companies. if you go into a DMV(Department of Motor Vehicles) and ask for a CDL they will give you a standard drivers license not a commercial.

I didn't even realize that there is a Federal driver license, where do you get those at?

highdesertranger

 

[rm.w/aview]

 I looked at FMCSA and found that a "Class C" CDL might be required even if the bus was classified as a non commercial vehicle; the language states "Any single vehicle, or combination of vehicles, that does not meet the definition of Class A or Class B, but is either designed to transport 16 or more passengers, including the driver,..."  The language seems to target the designed use of the vehicle rather than its commercial or non commercial registration.

Yes, it's as tx2sturgis has said, and what you have inferred to above. To add, The link that you've provided above contains this... https://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/regulations/title49/part/383 So as you can see, it is the end usage that affects or requires a CDL (Commercial Driver's License). Another example, there is an established protocol that can have a truck that is built & designed for over the road commerce, what you typically see on the roads hauling freight, also be used for and registered as an RV and thus not requiring a CDL. This driver will obtain a license that is now based on the weight of and intended usage of the vehicle. You may have seen trucks similar to commercial vehicles towing RVs. These are most likely personal vehicles registered as and insured as RVs and will be defined in the Exemptions category within the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration (FMCSA) regulations. And for Mike, a random search on your engine of choice for CDL will reveal Commercial Driver's License, Republic of California notwithstanding

 

[tx2sturgis]

the police refer to it as a CDL as do insurance companies.  if you go into a DMV(Department of Motor Vehicles) and ask for a CDL they will give you a standard drivers license not a commercial.

I didn't even realize that there is a Federal driver license,  where do you get those at?

You could say the same thing about Colorado, or Connecticut. Local verbal 'shorthand' or the fact that 3 states have a 'C' as the first letter doesn't change the OP topic or federal law. 

Anyone who has a CDL, Commercial Drivers License, is in the federal database, and is subject to many federal laws (such as medical testing, DUI laws and ticket 'masking') even when driving a private motor vehicle, and even though the license is applied for in the state of residence.

 

[tx2sturgis]

I think HDR is stirring the pot a little bit...

Testing our knowledge and having a bit of a 'poke'....which is OK...we expect and deserve correct information on this forum....mistakes here can cost members REAL money.

 

[highdesertranger]

I am just trying to get people to define their abbreviations. I can't say that about Colorado or Connecticut because I don't know about how those states do it. highdesertranger

 

[tx2sturgis]

I am just trying to get people to define their abbreviations. 

That was done in the OP...(Original Post*)...post number one:

 Yesterday he told me that a larger bus requires the driver to have a commercial driver's license (CDL), a fact of which I was unaware. 

That looks well-defined to me...as far as I can tell, he wasn't asking about driving a bus in California.

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*defining OP...gotta keep the mods happy...