94 F-250HD How large a camper can I have? (Learning my towing capacity... again)

[Happy Camper]

Bottom line to me is be smart, and possibly a touch conservative, with your choices.

Slide outs on a camper is just a ton of added weight over the center of gravity in my opinion. Since you have a 94 with a single wheel axle, you probably shouldn't give that idea a first, let alone second thought.

Growing up, we had a truck camper that was decent and didn't weigh a crap ton and would have been more than enough for solo living. Put it on a 73 Chevy long bed. Dad didn't like the slight sag so he added a booster leaf. It doesn't increase what the axle can carry, it just leveled it.

We made sure we had the correct tires and it drove everywhere we wanted to go on vacations. Took it off and used the truck when we weren't using it much.

But campers at that time were much simpler than what it seems like these days. It had a stove, potty closet. Above cab bed. Stove, benches and a table in the middle. All the weight was towards the bottom, as it should be. Keeps things stable. Also had water tanks and a sink, plus simple inverter with house plugs for light usage wired in. If you could find something similar I think you'd like it. Add a few cheap tech things such as backup cameras and led area lighting and you'd be doing good.

I know you're safety conscious, so having very small cameras setup would keep you feeling better about things. Plenty of space on top for solar. The only thing you'll definitely not like is if you like to go through drive thru for food. That's generally not happening lol.

Wind will always be a thing driving a higher vehicle. But again, everyone here has dealt with it to some extent. Keep center of gravity lower and it'll help immensely.

I have used one of the two cents I borrowed to give here. I personally have no cents.

 

[user 22017]

Forget the slides! Just a basic camper to fit in an 8' bed won't be that heavy.

For instance, these weigh 2160 lbs, and lots of used ones are for sale:

I keep missing out on Lance 835's on FB Marketplace. I've known for years that Lance recommends that model for my truck. Thanks for the reminder

 

[user 22017]

Bottom line to me is be smart, and possibly a touch conservative, with your choices.

Slide outs on a camper is just a ton of added weight over the center of gravity in my opinion. Since you have a 94 with a single wheel axle, you probably shouldn't give that idea a first, let alone second thought.

I don't want a slide on a trailer, let alone a truck camper. Just one more thing that can break. My truck is a '95

I had a truck camper before. A 2001 SunLight (in this photo). It weighed 1400 pounds according to the sticker. I liked it and it was close to the perfect size. It was a tad too small. No place to store a potty seat/bucket.

Seems the truck campers with showers and ovens are heavier. And ones with the garage extension on the rear.

I loved having a truck camper. The only thing I didn't like was always having to be alert for overhead passes. You have to give up fast food drive thru's, too.

Ideally, the TC won't have that long bed area above the cab. It scooped up too much wind on the interstate.

They are small, though. Mine worked out, because I used the overhead bed area for storage and slept where the dinette becomes a bed.

Back to including TC's in my search, lol.

 

[rruff]

It scooped up too much wind on the interstate.

Slow down, take your time... makes a big difference in the wind effect.

Or maybe avoid the interstate. Last summer I had to drive back and forth on the 70 west of Indy, and holy crap what a mess! Construction everywhere, and endless trains of semis going 80+. I was hoping nobody would hiccup else I'd get squashed like a bug.

 

[LargeMarge]

Im sorry but this is BS. You dont get to make up your own GVWR based off the axle ratings and ignore the factory GVWR. The axle numbers are the max weight that can be on each axle. The load can be biased to front or rear for many reasons, thats the max each axle can have, not to exceed the max GVWR, its NOT a number to be added up to get the REAL GVWR. You phrased it in a way "if it were you", but its done in a way to suggest its a reasonable thing for others to do, and its not. This is bad advice.


As for locks, its a false premise to base locking effectiveness on what a very small number of pros may do. Most thieves are not pros nor part of any brain trust. Videos commonly show people going along looking for unlocked vehicles to steal from. Not locking your stuff is inviting theives to steal your stuff if not openly giving away your stuff for free. Even cheap locks are an improvement, but as lock quality goes up, it starts reducing the number of people able to defeat them. It seems self defeating though to throw ones hands up in despair of locking anything because a very small number of thieves may be able to defeat a lock.


Trailers can be difficult to many people, just like math can be to others. It seems to come easily to some but not others. Experience will help of course, and probably anyone can learn to do it with some good instruction. The more you do it the easier it will be. Borrowing or renting one and someone that has experience to help you get the basics may make it less intimidating or mysterious.

In the line of thought of it comes easily to some, Ive seen many people with seemingly a lot of trailer experience that cant back one up well, or make extreme overcorrections. It often takes very little adjustment to get a better line or angle on something, maybe 3-5 feet of rolling motion at most, yet some will pull forward several vehicle lengths and end up making the whole thing far more complicated, frustrating and difficult than it needs to be.

.
Apology accepted.

 

[user 22017]

Slow down, take your time... makes a big difference in the wind effect.

Or maybe avoid the interstate. Last summer I had to drive back and forth on the 70 west of Indy, and holy crap what a mess! Construction everywhere, and endless trains of semis going 80+. I was hoping nobody would hiccup else I'd get squashed like a bug.

I did that on my way home from northern Minnesota when I bought the TC. It was "porpoising" so much I had to switch to back roads. Learned that Google maps has that option (avoid highways). I prefer using the two lane highways now.

Just discovered that people can't agree on what causes porpoising. They are debating it here:

https://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/24375240.cfm

 

[Happy Camper]

Bad/wrong shocks and higher weight distribution. Would make the most sense to me.

 

[user 22017]

Bad/wrong shocks and higher weight distribution. Would make the most sense to me.

As soon as I got off the interstate and onto a two lane highway it was smooth sailing. No more porpoising. I thought it was because I was driving into the wind on the interstate.

I've read in forums where people build deflectors to block the gap under the bed area. Pool noodles shoved in the gap are suggested, too.

 

[rruff]

Just discovered that people can't agree on what causes porpoising.

I don't think it's wind or really shocks, though it could be. On mine it's frame flex resonance on roads (usually concrete) that have regular undulations. I bought my truck in Denver and coming back south on the freeway it bucked like a bronco... seriously thought I'd get whiplash. That was empty. On most roads it doesn't do it at all, and on most concrete it isn't nearly that bad.

The extra weight and higher CG of the camper, the flex of the camper, and how well it's tied down can all contribute too.

 

[user 22017]

I don't think it's wind or really shocks, though it could be. On mine it's frame flex resonance on roads (usually concrete) that have regular undulations. I bought my truck in Denver and coming back south on the freeway it bucked like a bronco... seriously thought I'd get whiplash. That was empty. On most roads it doesn't do it at all, and on most concrete it isn't nearly that bad.

The extra weight and higher CG of the camper, the flex of the camper, and how well it's tied down can all contribute too.

Do you still have a truck camper? Sorry if you already posted about it. What kind is it?

 

[rruff]

Do you still have a truck camper? Sorry if you already posted about it. What kind is it?

I built it in the garage and just got it mounted on the truck a couple months ago. It's excessively huge since it was made for two, but not heavy being foam core and fiberglass and carbon fiber layup. Still a work in progress.

 

[user 22017]

I built it in the garage and just got it mounted on the truck a couple months ago. It's excessively huge since it was made for two, but not heavy being foam core and fiberglass and carbon fiber layup. Still a work in progress.

Looks like it was built by a professional

 

[rruff]

Looks like it was built by a professional

Not up close... easy to tell it's home made. In the past I avoided the attention of thieves with my janky setup, but not cops. Since this is a nicer vehicle than I've ever had, I'm hoping to avoid the attention of both thieves and cops... but probably will fail on both counts.

 

[bullfrog !]

^^^If you don’t have the skills or the desire for the better looks of fiberglass Poor Man’s Fiberglass (PMF) only involves TiteBond wood glue , canvas and exterior house paint. It’s basically an arts and crafts project on a larger scale. For a cheap enclosed space that is durable and easy to repair it is hard to beat. Check out tnttt.com foamies forum. A shell this size can probably be built for less than what a new truck bed topper costs, is lighter and has better built in insulation. When I first built my box I had to open a vent to close the door. All of mine lasted several years with little or no maintenance as long as water isn’t allowed to puddle on the roof. I found a slightly slanted roof solved that problem. People kept thinking mine was a dumpster or ice dispenser being hauled to its next location so no problems with thieves! Did find a bag of trash left next to it one morning! Lol!!!

 

[user 22017]

Not up close... easy to tell it's home made. In the past I avoided the attention of thieves with my janky setup, but not cops. Since this is a nicer vehicle than I've ever had, I'm hoping to avoid the attention of both thieves and cops... but probably will fail on both counts.

I missed out on a foamie last summer. A guy in St. Louis was selling it for $300 to anyone who helped him get it off his truck. He needed it removed ASAP for a job.

It was the first time I saw pics of the inside of a foamie. Didn't realize everything was made the foamie way. The sink, cabinets, bench. All rounded corners and edges.

Are all foamies like that or do some people use traditional furniture, counters, etc.?

 

[rruff]

^^^If you don’t have the skills or the desire for the better looks of fiberglass Poor Man’s Fiberglass (PMF) only involves TiteBond wood glue , canvas and exterior house paint.

Ya, I know... I did a bunch of experiments with it.

On the strength, weight, stiffness, impact, creep resistance spectrum, its not in the same league as fiberglass-epoxy. It's more like a heavy duty coating for the foam... in other words if a 2" thick XPS box seems pretty structurally sound, the PMF will definitely improve on that. PMF was traditionally used to cover wood, and does much better with a hard backing.

Are all foamies like that or do some people use traditional furniture, counters, etc.?

I think most people use more traditional interiors.

 

[bullfrog !]

My box was built using damaged interior hollow core doors for structure so the water proofing qualities of the PMF and lack of holes for windows were key to making them. I simply used spray foam to hold wooden dowel inserts in the hollow core doors to mount shelves, milk crates or peg board. The painted interior doors look pretty much like finished dry wall in a regular house except I used semi gloss paint so it could be easily cleaned if needed. The foam works pretty much the same way and for more money you could glue a thin plywood on the foam for exterior strength then do PMF. Some people just glue soaked paper on the interior or bed sheets for a smooth finished look then a sealer. It really is an art project like decoupage. My sleeping platforms are simply a hollow core door filled with spray foam and a top layer of thin cheap luan glued on. At 200 lbs. I often stand on them to get to upper shelves. Really if properly done or even close to properly done it worked well enough to last me several years. My current trailer is several years old now and still water tight. I probably have less than $2,000 in materials in my almost 12’ long 7’ wide 6’6” high box with two 28” x 78” sleeping platforms with center isle in one room and a separate end bathroom with composting toilet, 30” corner shower and solar battery bank for a yet to be 12 volt refrigerator taking up the rest of the space. Living is pretty much to be done outside in a screen spring bar tent with cooking on a to be built outside drop down table maybe. All this sits on a 24’ flat bed utility trailer so I have a 12’ porch after I unload my Suzuki Samurai. Whole thing loaded is between 5,000 to 6,000 pounds. The box (camper) itself is less than 1,000 lbs.

 

[rruff]

Did you spray the foam core yourself?

 

[cortttt]

I found papers about the truck and the trailer it towed (from previous owners) in the glove box. They towed a 10,000 lb. 5th wheel. Your link says my towing capacity is 8,000lbs., but added something about 5th wheels. I don't see a higher tow rating "listed".

F-250 HD 4 x 2

5.8 V-8

8000 lbs.

A higher tow rating is listed for pickups that tow fifth-wheel trailers

Requires weight-distributing hitch.

I doubt I will be towing, but it is good to know. I want to know how much weight the truck can carry... for a truck camper.

This is something I recently learned. You cannot go by the towing capacity to understand how much you can tow. How much you can tow is determined by the amount of payload (passengers, stuff) in the tow vehicle as well as the weight of the trailer. If you carry alot in your truck you can't tow as much safely.

https://www.motortrend.com/how-to/gvwr-vs-gcwr/
Gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR)

Gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR), in the simplest of terms, is the maximum amount a vehicle can weigh as it rolls down the road. This number includes the curb weight of the vehicle, all occupants, and all cargo.

What Is Gross Combined Weight Rating (GCWR)?​

Gross combined vehicle weight rating (GCWR), however, is the maximum weight of a vehicle and its attached trailer. This figure is also inclusive of all passengers and cargo in both the tow vehicle and the trailer. This is also sometimes referred to as gross combined vehicle weight rating (GCVWR).

Can I Tow More Than My Truck's Tow Rating?​

No. Often you'll find that when you subtract your vehicle's gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) from its gross combined weight rating (GCWR) that the number is a touch higher than the manufacturer's advertised maximum tow rating. Sometimes it goes in the opposite direction. Whichever is the lower number is the one that needs to be observed when it comes to maximum trailer weights.

My instance

In my instance, my acceptable trailer weight is actually a bit lower than advertised. My GMC Savanna has a towing capacity of 10,000 lbs but the gross combined weight rating is only 15,000 lbs. With the van weighing in at a curb weight of 5,261 lbs. I have about 260 lbs less towing capacity than advertised - not enough to make much of a difference actually.

I'm now towing about a 6000 lb trailer and will have to get the whole rig with its solar panels, refrigerators, recovery gear, passengers, etc. weighed. I was astonished to learn that I somehow managed to use up the entire payload of my former 1-ton Savana - 4,000 lbs or so - with all my stuff!

Towing capacity can apparently go up when using a weight-distributing hitch - which I am using and things like bigger brakes. I'll just have to see when I get it weighed.

 

[cortttt]

That's what I was thinking! I should get over my fear of towing and buy a trailer.

I was in a similar boat - I was terrified of towing. It kept me up nights! I particularly envisioned getting stuck in gas stations. About a month ago I got a 24 ft trailer. I found that towing - which I am still not completely comfortable with - was nonetheless pretty much a breeze - just allow for a bit wider turns and it's pretty much fine.

I was greatly relieved

It helped me to envision the trailer swinging on a pivot behind the van. It also helps to watch how big trucks with trailers handle intersections and such. I recently saw a truck with two trailers behind it do it with ease.