Wikipedia climate data questionable?

[badmotorscooter]

I have lived in Sierra Vista AZ for a little over 7 years.   One of the reasons I choose to live here is because of the relatively mild climate year round.

I was researching climates in various New Mexico cities, specifically the average high and low winter temps and comparing them to Sierra Vista.  I noticed the average low temp for SV never fell below freezing, but also noticed the average daytime high in January was 61 f.

I happened to come across my old notes from 7 years ago and noticed the daytime average temp in January was 58 f, which coincided with my memory.


Wikipedia says it bases its average temps on 30 years of recorded data. The winter weather has been pretty consistant, though last winter was a bit cool.  

If I take the last 7 years and compute the temps at 70 f and add that to a 58 f average from the previous 23 years, the average temp comes out to 60 f.  No way in hell it was that warm in the last 7 years.

Math doesn't lie, so either the previous January daytime high of 58 f was incorrect, or the current one of 61 f is.
To keep it simple I didn't bother factoring in tenths of a degree, but that doesn't have any real impact on the results showing some kind of error/mistake or whatever the issue is.

Of course my memory and notes could be in error, but I'm pretty sure they are right.

 

[DLTooley]

There is probably a source for actual monthly averages year by year.

If you are trying to undermine global warming science you’ll have to make a bit better case than that.

 

[badmotorscooter]

Global warming has nothing to do with this!

According to Wiki the average temps and climate info are based on 30 years, not one season or year.

 

[lenny flank]

Global warming has nothing to do with this!

Sadly, it does. The five warmest years on record were all in the past five years.

That pulled the average up.

 

[highdesertranger]

ok no arguing. this topic can be as bad as politics. so watch what you post.

you only have a couple of degrees of difference. a lot of things can account for the differences. like does your thermometer jive with the one from the official weather station? did you measure the temperature in accordance with NOAA/NWS guidelines? where exactly was your temp taken and where is the official temp taken? this can make a huge difference.

highdesertranger

 

[B and C]

Sometimes they move the official measuring location too.

 

[wayne49]

Readings can come from different sources.
But is an average of  58 really that different from 61?
Call it about 60 and forget about it.

I use city-data.com for their climate data graphs.

Sierra Vista ON AVERAGE doesn't go below 32 and doesn't go above mid 90s, so it is attractive. An average rainy (4") period late July early August.

One of the locations I had chosen to study last year for chasing perfect weather in AZ. Perfect for me in Sierra Vista would be April, May, and October. I look at both highs and lows.

 

[badmotorscooter]

I didn't take any temps. Just using wikipedia's temps to show that if the average January high jumped to 70 f for the last 7 years it would not pull the previous 58 f to 61 f based on a 30 year average.

 

[Qxxx]

BMS, either way be happy you chose SV rather than say Phoenix. SV is projected to get low-mid 90s this week while Phoenix is expected to hit 112F. And Quartzsite expected to hit 114F. From weather.com...

 

[maki2]

you have forgotten one very essential fact.....Wikipedia is open to editing by anyone who chooses to do so. That data is not actually being presented by any real scientific authority that is related to an organization that tracks the weather. That means you could have a person posting it who has no clue how to do an actual average. Maybe the person who edited it flunked 7th grade math

Of course EVERYTHING on Wikipedia is questionable...

If you don't think it is correct then make your own corrections to it

 

[ckelly78z]

From my experience, the data from my local town is WAY off from what I experience out in the sticks. I always have more snow, stronger winds, lower temps, higher temps (more extreme weather) than they do at their collecting site. For all I know, the collecting site is a sheltered urban setting that has some of the effects of being much closer to civilization than my farm does.

The real question for the OP...WHO CARES ? Why are you quibbling over historic data points ?

 

[badmotorscooter]

The reason for this thread is simple. Is wikipedia a credible source for accurate climate info?

The simple answer (if there is one) is apparently not.

 

[Qxxx]

This whole exercise seems like tilting at windwheels. Averages give you a general idea but smooth over the facts on the ground. In SV if you live right next to or in a mountain valley, your readings will likely be different from someone who lives 4 miles east of the mountains. On and on. In Colorado the saying is "if you don't like the weather, wait 5 minutes". Try to make an average out of that.

 

[bullfrog]

I have a very nice old quilt that was made several generations ago that I love to sleep under. My ultimate goal is to be able to park somewhere each night where I can sleep comfortably under it and wake up warm and under sunny skies. It will never happen probably but Arizona has many different elevations especially around Sierra Vista that within a day or two drive you can vary your environment by several degrees. Up on Mount Lemon or the Flagstaff area is cooler and Ajo or just outside Phoenix is warmer There are lots of spots on this earth that average a comfortable temp but few that are that temp most days of the year. Bottom line is if you stay in one place most of the time you will be too hot or too cold just like the little girl in the 3 bears story you will just have to keep trying to find where the weather suits you for a day or two. By the way wind makes a huge difference as well as temperature.

 

[Qxxx]

Speaking of the wind, I was just thinking of that because of where I live. If you live with some hills to your west, the sun will heat them up in the morning, and there will be an upslope wind created moving to the west. Then in the afternoon, the sun will no longer shine so intensely on the hills, they will cool off and there will be a downslope breeze going east.

Likewise, exactly the opposite thing will occur if the hills are to the east, as they will get morning shade and afternoon sun. So either way you have a local microclimate being created by the existence of the hills. If you live out miles away from the hills you'll not see the same effect. But if you're taking averages over the area, all that variation gets lost.

BTW, when I visited Sierra Vista 2 winters ago in early March, it was 24F at night. Very cold in the van.

 

[jacqueg]

OP, I'm not sure why you're worrying whether Wikipedia's weather data for Sierra Vista is being manipulated by some person or other. I mean, why would someone bother do that? For a 30-year average, a difference of 2 degrees between your data and theirs is nothing, and can easily be accounted for by a difference in location - yes, one side of town to the other can be 2 degrees different. Or more. In fact, one side of your house can register a 2 degree difference from another, a fact that gardeners regularly use to their advantage.

Full disclosure - I used to live at an experimental ag station, and we collected weather data. When you're dealing with a particular spot on the ground, you are dealing with a microclimate. That's why the data collected from a number of data stations are averaged together to obtain a regional value. In fact, if your data was exactly the same as the Wikipedia averages, I'd be very suspicious.

But if you are that worried about Wikipedia, just go straight to the mother of all sources - https://w2.weather.gov/climate/.

Or, if you don't trust the gubmint, try the Weather Underground - https://www.wunderground.com

Pick one, and stick with it when you are doing comparisons. And keep in mind, when comparing their data to yours, that an exact correspondence would be arithmetically highly unlikely.

 

[CityWoman]

OP, I'm not sure why you're worrying whether Wikipedia's weather data for Sierra Vista is being manipulated by some person or other. I mean, why would someone bother do that?

Why do people spray graffiti on private property and write on bathroom stalls? Because they can.

I semi-regularly edit articles on Wikipedia. Believe me, not only is there lots of vandalism going on there every day, there's also a lot of well-meaning but stupid people messing things up by adding incorrect data to articles or by not understanding how to use the editing interface. It happens because it's a totally user-contributed database open to the public, worldwide. There are some articles that get a level of protection by allowing only certain kinds of accounts to edit them, and that usually is prompted by frequent defacement of the article.

Wikipedia should NEVER be relied upon as a primary source. Any information gathered from Wikipedia should be taken with a grain of salt until verified by a reliable official primary source.

 

[jacqueg]

Wikipedia should NEVER be relied upon as a primary source. Any information gathered from Wikipedia should be taken with a grain of salt until verified by a reliable official primary source.

You're right, and I don't.

Which is one of the reasons why I suggested the OP consult either NOAA or Weather Underground. But I can just about guarantee that they won't match his data either, for all the reasons I stated.

 

[highdesertranger]

I take everything with a grain of salt no matter the source. highdesertranger

 

[Stargazer]

I live in a small town (pop 2,000+/-), near the base of a mountain at 6200 ft. Not a lot of trees, some land cleared for farming. My brother lives five miles up the road at 7200 ft, with a large stream running through it and mostly forested, same side of the same mountain. The difference in our weather is huge! If I get 4" of snow, he gets a foot. When it's 46 degrees here, it's 4-6 degrees colder there. Yet at times, it's colder down here than up there because the cold air is pushed down and he has sun while I have blizzard. Or vice versa.

The weather station that reports this area is at the small airport 15 miles away at 5100 ft and out in the desert away from the mountain. What they report is so far off, not even worth looking at.

My point is, where is the weather station that the data is collected in relation to the area you are researching? A few days ago, I stepped outside and thought, "Oh, it's a bit cool." My thermometer said 46. Checked my Weather Channel app for my town and it said it was 61! Hahaha! Nope.

There are so many variables. Average night time temps? From when to when? Now, at 7:30 pm, it's 78 degrees. At 9:00 pm, it's low 60's. Averages don't say much.