Thoughts on older camper vans

[David]

I've always like older cars & trucks and with that I tend to like older vans. Right now I'm using a 84 Westy as my full time rig. My plan was always to sell the Westy and finish rebuilding my other Vanagon.

However as I spend more time living the van life, I do find myself slightly cramped and not being able to stand up all the time gets old.

One thing I must note is I've had absolutely ZERO problems with being harassed when I park at night with the Westy. In fact the only times I've ever had cops stop to check me out, was in the day times when I was just hanging out somewhere.

I tend to do a lot of urban camping and usually rotate around various big box store parking lots or the occasional strip mall. With that in mind as I mentioned I've never been hassled at night. I kind of wonder if cops just ignore my Westy because it's in good shape or if they don't realize someone is in it. (yea a lot of people have no clue what a Westy is and that it's essentially a micro RV inside).

As I look at other future options I tend to see various older Chevy or Dodges with the high top camper roofs. I typically like the bubble top style roofs for the "surfer van look" and not the un-godly monster sized roofs that hang over the front of the van.

With that in mind, they then to be very obvious for being camper vans. I'm wondering if I'd lose my self perceived invisibility cloak if I switched to one of those style vans for the extra space and stand up room?

When I say surfer van, I'm meaning the older Chevy & Dodges with the bubble top roofs.. Like the one in the bottom part of this picture.

I wonder if I'd get harassed if using a van like that, vs now it seems like cops leave me alone, even though to me my Westy is a obvious camper van.

 

[caseyc]

Ahhhh. The grass is always greener on the other side syndrome, haha! I'm sure many would like to trade places with your Westy.

 

[Bdog1]

Would a camper pop top give you the best of both worlds? Stealth at night and stand up room when needed.

 

[David]

Ahhhh. The grass is always greener on the other side syndrome, haha! I'm sure many would like to trade places with your Westy.

Not if they had to work on it... lol

I love the van and it's size for driving, but it's seems no matter how well you take care of them, they tend to be problematic little *******s. :s

I've also had a full size Falcon class B, which was way too big. I'm thinking a standard size van, not extended would be a nice middle ground.

---

Would a camper pop top give you the best of both worlds? Stealth at night and stand up room when needed.

I want cab to back access. If you mean a truck camper top, which I don't want.

As far as pop tops, I never pop the top on my Westy as it is, because it's a dead give away I'm camping out. The only times I ever pop it, is if I'm boon docking out in the woods somewhere.

Also with the size of the Westy, I always have to move stuff around when I fold down the bed. That gets old, specially when your motor is under it, and you have to move everything just to get access to the engine..

 

[caseyc]

I was seriously considering a Vanagon and a Falcon when I first started searching for a van a few years ago. For myself, I think a Vanagon would be a bit too small and a Falcon a bit too large.

 

[David]

I was seriously considering a Vanagon and a Falcon when I first started searching for a van a few years ago. For myself, I think a Vanagon would be a bit too small and a Falcon a bit too large.

Yes that's the feelings I'm at right now. I can deal with the smaller size of the Vanagon better vs dealing with the very large size of the Falcon, simply because the Vanagon's size is like driving a regular small truck.

It's easy in traffic, but these vans are worth a lot of money and I'd rather have the money than the hip ride if you will..

With that said, for a business I once owned, I had a Chevy 1500 cargo van regular length and it was just fine driving around town. I also had a extended Ford and you could feel those extra feet..

 

[akrvbob]

Do you need all the facilities that come with a Class B camper van? If not then you can get the best of both worlds with a high top conversion van. Conversion vans have good stealth and aren't noticeable as RVs because they aren't. You'll have a lot more room, more head-room and much greater reliability than the VW.

To me, the fact that they are empty is good, they make a blank slate for you to make whatever you want. But if you want all the nice things of a Class B, you'll have to make them. If you check out the home-built conversions here, it's very easy to make the van comfortable, but much harder if you want a shower, hot water and a real toilet.
Bob

 

[David]

Do you need all the facilities that come with a Class B camper van? If not then you can get the best of both worlds with a high top conversion van. Conversion vans have good stealth and aren't noticeable as RVs because they aren't. You'll have a lot more room, more head-room and much greater reliability than the VW.

To me, the fact that they are empty is good, they make a blank slate for you to make whatever you want. But if you want all the nice things of a Class B, you'll have to make them. If you check out the home-built conversions here, it's very easy to make the van comfortable, but much harder if you want a shower, hot water and a real toilet.
Bob

The problem with conversion vans, is the windows. They are horrible for getting any sort of breeze in and almost all of them, the only opening part is way at the bottom. This means if you want any sort of open window access you are drastically limited on your how you build out the interior.

Also most (not all) conversion vans have "designer tops" best thing I can think to call them, but they try to make them look fancy with neat shapes to fit TVs, which leaves very little mounting surface for any sort of solar system outside.

This is one of the reasons I'd only consider a cargo style van or the older school camper vans. The camper vans because they often have RV style windows that actually allow a breeze to get in and the hi tops are typically flat on the roofs. Added to this the 70's era camper vans tend to be reasonable size.. Meaning they don't suffer from today's current trend of trying to make the most ungodly sized vehicle in order to impress the guy parked 5ft away from you at the campground.

In a sense, It's my opinion that the camper vans of the 70's were more practicable and not over designed trying to sleep 12 people that are never really going to sleep in the van in the first place, but it looks good on a sales brochure. I just worry that it might be a cop magnet if I switched to one even if it looked nice.

As for the cargo van, with no windows it allows me to add my own RV windows for the previously mentioned reasons. Conversion van's just don't make very good starting platforms for what I'd want out of a full time rig. I know people make them work, but there are too many negatives for how I want to build out my next van to use one.

The Vanagon, despite it's mechanical faults, really was a well thought out van. The large side sliding windows are awesome for air circulation, and even with my top down on my westy, the extra space from the fiberglass top gives a decent amount of head room.

 

[David]

This is a good example of what I'm talking about. Granted it's a 80's Ford, but it's a regular length van body, not the extended and has the bubble top hi top. It gives standing room, while not looking like some giant banana sitting on the roof.

This one has no sliding side windows in the body, but those top windows would still allow good air circulation.

 

[SternWake]

I bought a windowed conversion Van. All that foo foo tv housing stuff on the roof was ripped out first thing. I need roof for my 10 foot surfboards up there. So much wasted space is an insult to me. Not tall enough to stand though. I can do everything inside sitting on my fre spinning 3rd captains chair. Only time I really miss standing fully upright inside is putting on pants

As far as ventilation goes, I bet I can keep my van cooler inside than anybody without airconditioning.

I lived in a 72 westy in South Africa for 9 months. Amazingly well thought out interiors. I remember sitting 4 at the table eating dinner. Could not do that in my current Van, but I have had 12 people inside partying during a rainstorm. Could not have done than in a 72 vw.

Stealth, hard to say what others think. I tend to think many white vans are simply ignored, and I've tried to keep it ignorable.

I see any van, and if I can't see inside the back, I presume somebody lives in it. I always thought about putting fake pictures of a conversion van interior up to my windows, but I have not really needed stealth for a while now.

But soon. The road calls, but coastal san diego's weather is just so damn pleasant. Looks like everywhere nearby is roasting, and I am sleeping with 2 blankets at night.

 

[rvwandering]

We lived in a Vanagon for a year back in the 70s. We loved that van but a year was enough time to know that we wanted something bigger and more suited to fulltime living. We're way bigger now than anything you'd want (25' class C) and very obviously a RV but we very rarely have any problems with cops or parking lot security. Maybe five times in over twenty years and we've stayed in thousands of lots. Park in the far corner, don't make a mess and don't stay for days without moving and you'll be fine.

Don't forget to come back with pictures of your build out!

 

[cyndi]

Check out Glen Morrisette's blog, "To Simplify." He's gone from a Falcon, to a Chinook and now he's in a VW. He urban camps quite frequently, often in Los Angeles . To the best of my knowledge, he's never been rousted. He's been full-timing since 2009

http://www.tosimplify.net/

 

[David]

Well, I jinxed myself. After saying I have never been bothered by cops in my Westy, wouldn't you know it. Last night I had just dozed off and bang bang bang.

Cops..

They were cool with me, but I knew I had been abusing the parking lot I was staying in, because it was close to my work. I was parking at a Target store that had a parking lot off to the side of the building, but guess they got tired of me.

I ended up having to move to a walmart a few miles down the road for the night. So there goes my invisibility cloak. LoL

 

[akrvbob]

The ideal for you then is to get a plain cargo van and add rv windows and a high top. That would meat all you needs! But, it may be out of your price range. That depends on how much of it you could do yourself. You can get a high top for around $1200 but then you have to pay to install it or do it yourself. Or you can find one at a junk yard and take it off and stick it on your van. Finding a flat one at a junk yard might be hard but you can find flat ones new.

Give thought to doing what Sternwake did with computer fans in his small side windows. He really makes it work and you can't need more ventilation than he has. It's pretty cheap and easy to run off solar. Find it here:
https://vanlivingforum.com/showthread.php?tid=9631&highlight=calling+out+Sternwake

But, it's hard to argue with your logic for an old Class B. My only fear is for reliability. I'm afraid you are going to be making constant repairs. Of course a lot of people will tell you that's not true, but I wonder if their nostalgia isn't clouding their vision?
Bob

 

[David]

The ideal for you then is to get a plain cargo van and add rv windows and a high top. That would meat all you needs! But, it may be out of your price range. That depends on how much of it you could do yourself. You can get a high top for around $1200 but then you have to pay to install it or do it yourself. Or you can find one at a junk yard and take it off and stick it on your van. Finding a flat one at a junk yard might be hard but you can find flat ones new.

Give thought to doing what Sternwake did with computer fans in his small side windows. He really makes it work and you can't need more ventilation than he has. It's pretty cheap and easy to run off solar. Find it here:
https://vanlivingforum.com/showthread.php?tid=9631&highlight=calling+out+Sternwake

But, it's hard to argue with your logic for an old Class B. My only fear is for reliability. I'm afraid you are going to be making constant repairs. Of course a lot of people will tell you that's not true, but I wonder if their nostalgia isn't clouding their vision?
Bob

Well, when I build my next full time van I will be modifying it quite a lot. I need off road capability and with my other vanagon being the syncro it's a pretty good start. However I'm really debating if I want to go vanagon this next go round or not, hence reason I'm looking at other options.

Both my westy and the syncro are worth a decent amount of cash due to them being so popular. Meaning if I sell both, I walk away with a decent chunk of change and to be honest, I don't keep full coverage insurance on them, so if I ever get into a wreck or one was stolen I'd be out what I could of sold them for.

With that in mind, I'm pretty good at finding deals on cars. I also don't mind fixing them up. The problem is, with newer cars or vans I suck trying to fix them. This is one reason I liked the vanagon, because even though it was a learning curve, I can usually figure out what is wrong and fix it.

This is one of the reasons I was looking at the 70s style vans. They are pretty simple when it comes to working on them. However, if I did buy a older van, I'd most likely put a 1 ton full floating rear axle under it, give it a little bit of a lift and most likely install a modern truck transmission with over drive and so on.

This would give me a pretty capable off road van, that also would do good on the highway. Added bonus, is it wouldn't be to hard to work on.

 

[Patrick46]

Ha! This is the same reason I like my Harleys.

They're built so crudely, that even a dumb Czech like me can completely rebuild it sitting alongside the road, using nothing but a rock and a coathanger.

 

[akrvbob]

That is a good reason to go with a 70s van. I can't work on my rigs so I need one that is very reliable, but since you can their simplicity is a BIG plus!!

I think a 70s camper van sounds perfect for you!! Sell the VWs and have a big pile of cash leftover and hit the road for a few years!!
Bob

 

[Patrick46]

I've had 7 stepvans, and there are so many reasons I love 'em...

one of them is that since they were all older rigs with 'reasonable' sized engines (290's, 350's)...you could practically climb right inside the engine compartment to work on them. Tons of room under the hoods! They also didn't have all the fuel injection stuff either. Just a carb, distributor, and a handfull of wires was all. Simplicity at it's best!!

oh...and I could work on the engine stuff from INSIDE the stepvan too!! (Awesome in a rainstorm!!)

 

[highdesertranger]

well i don't have much to add, except to agree with you about the older vehicles being much easier to work on. those pics you posted in your first post are great, so 70's, nice pull, brings back memories. highdesertranger

 

[user 423]

In my travels I am constantly eyeballing for salvage yards that might have a hightop that will fit my '91 Dodge B250 and I'm betting I could buy one for cheap if I ever find one. New ones cost more than the van is worth. I have a regular length window van and it's easy to handle in town. The tipout windows work fine for ventilaton except it's a hassle adding screens.

My '91 has been pretty faithful but recently I've had to replace the PCM,idle speed motor,timing chain,water pump,etc. and the nickels & dimes are adding up. The voltage regulation failed twice on the PCMs and I had to install an external VR. Now I have a constant CEL that I live with.

My dream van at this time would be a non-computer '80s regular length B250 cargo with a 24" hightop and the RV sliding windows. A new Holley or Edelbrock on a 360 with a 5-speed manual from a PU. I tend to carry a lot of weight and travel through mountains regularly so even though the 318 is great, I'd like to have the extra oomph of a 360.