The reality of not having a home, and getting old.

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Queen: "... how long of a life is enough?"

Many people are afraid of dying. But many others want to die when they know it's time, but they're not allowed to. This is sick.
 
TrainChaser said:
Queen:  "... how long of a life is enough?"

Many people are afraid of dying.  But many others want to die when they know it's time, but they're not allowed to.  This is sick.

I think that's why it all perplexes me, I have zero fear of dying.  It's either the next grand adventure or nothingness, I'm good either way.
 
There was a local writer awhile back who died at Mt Rainier on a dayhike. Huge figure in the hiking community here. The autopsy report didn't mention her dying violently, like a fall. Anyways, I was envious of her, she died amidst the beauty of a place she loved, doing what she loved. I wish my end is like that.
 
Waldenbound: They said she died of hypothermia. That could go either way for someone of her age (70): accidental or goodbye world.
 
As an older guy who has thought about the subject of when to call it quits I have to agree fully with Queen. In fact my intention is to enjoy the time I have until I feel it's time to go. I've thought about how I would euthanize myself and frankly my plan is to use the exit bag and helium route that is basically fast and painless. There's no sense to hang on when you know the future is short and bleak.

As far as age and homelessness are concerned I would love to see a survey done on the 50 plus year ago who are homeless to see how many can't support themselves because they are running into ageism.
 
This is a fascaniting thread and so relevant, thank u fir bringing it up. What newbewanna be says about quiet members I have found true in last couple of weeks. I have been meeting people who have been reading bobs blog and forum but not posting much. Two woman site ageism as a factor for being out here. One identifies as homeless. Four feel close to homelessess, one big expense could throw them into "homelessness status, how ever we define this for ourselves. Thanks so much everyone
 
I realized that I was working so many hours at a job I hated just to pay the bills that having a house creates.  One day I was pulling weeds in my garden and I stepped wrong and fell back onto the grass.  There was a little pop in my ankle.  I laid there looking at the sky and realized that if I was out of work for six weeks, I would lose everything.  If I had to go to the ER for an x-ray and a cast I never would have been able to pay the bill.  I had no money in savings.  I had nothing to fall back on and it was a precarious existence and I woke up every day wondering how I was going to be able to keep doing this.  The ankle was fine.

Also, I got a dog.  I started taking her hiking all the time and was reconnected with my love of nature and the outdoors.  

One day I had just finished cleaning the house on my one day off from work and I stood there in the living room looking around and said out loud, "I don't even WANT any of this."  

My biggest fears had nothing to do with hot showers or peeing or cooking if I lived in a vehicle.  I was mostly afraid of what my friends, family, and co-workers would think.  I mean, I have a degree, I own a house, I am living the American Dream - but I was one medical emergency or disaster away from losing it all.  I was so weary of being afraid.  

Quality of life is a huge issue for me.  I watched my husband die a horrible, painful, gruesome death following two years of physical decline.  He was scared and he suffered terribly. 

I moved to Oregon because of the Doctor assisted suicide.  I would never allow my family to watch me suffer like that.  

I figure I have about 14 good years with my beloved doggie.  I don't want to spend that working 60 hours a week and never having time or money to see or do anything.  I want to hike with her every day, in a new spot every month.  When she goes, I will go as well, having lived every day authentically.
 
Queen said:
I think that's why it all perplexes me, I have zero fear of dying.  It's either the next grand adventure or nothingness, I'm good either way.

I believe its a good adventure or a bad one , I can prove the nothingness is'nt possible after death ,, think about a timeline , on that timeline imagine your lifetime which could be anywhere from zero to120 years old , now compare your life time which would be a maximum of 120 years old ( your not going to live past 120 ) to the entire timeline that pretty much goes on for infinity , when you compare your life time what ever it my be , even if you lived to 120 , if you lived to 25 if you lived to 40 , it doesn't matter because the key point I'm trying to make is to show you how small your lifetime is , your lifetime compared to infinity is extremely small , think about how small amount of time your lifetime is , compare your small lifetime duration  to the total amount of time infinity which is astronomical. See how incredibly small amount of time your life time will be , see how massive the total amount of time there is.
Then Imagine where on the timeline of infinity your life is at , where is it at? 
Its right now , your living your tiny amount of time on this earth right now!!!!!!!!!!!
Out of all the time in the world which is a massive amount of time you just happen to be alive right now , whats the chances of that ?    Its like infinity to 1
So your not only alive right now on the timeline , your alive again and again and again on that time line , this may explain dejavu

The key points are how small amount of time your lifetime is compared to the massively huge amount of time of infinity is and the chances of you being alive right now which is pretty damn amazing considering you could have lived your life anywhere on the time line
 
waldenbound said:
This is exactly why I'm moving forward on the mobile lifestyle. Face it, no way could I afford to retire at 67, I don't know how far into my 50s I'll have a full-time job that hasn't been wiped out by automation or outsourcing.

Thats what burns me when talk of homelessness come up in news stories. It's always the heroin epidemic, or it's alcohol, or it's mental illness. The Big Three. Of course there are plenty of homeless with one or more of the Big Three, but there's a fourth cause of homelessness, ECONOMICS!

Excellent fourth addition.  It is even more important if you come to see that economics is not only one item on a list, but often the primary problem which causes or leads to the other three problems you listed.

I'm sure that those who love to beat the "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" drum will screech at the thought, but in fact, society is responsible for the creation of most of these problems.  On one hand, society is only us.  On the other hand, it is a huge, barely thinking entity with the potential for huge, often negative impact on the lives of individuals.  An entity that, despite what our national documents say, does not exist to help the average person.

In the U.S., our individualistic/self-reliant attitudes exacerbate all of these problems.  As do other major influences which we are not permitted to discuss here.  However, distilled, it becomes "screw you if you can't do it by yourself".  Or if you want any assistance at all, you have to first prostrate yourself on the floor and give up any remaining shred of self-respect in order to qualify.  There is something very twisted about the way we do that.  Why do we need -- and it is a need -- to see people so debased before we're willing to help them, and then, only help minimally?  There is an answer, but again, we can't discuss it.  Why do some of us preach about independence as if it is the silver-bullet solution for everything, without having the experience of suffering the opposite?  Why is it so hard for us to admit that 90% of us are much closer to having nothing than the American Dream would indicate?

Other countries in the world -- Canada, UK, Europe -- have solved much of this.  How?  They just started creating policies that are people-centered and not money- or selfishness-centered.  Instead of just creating million-dollar TV commercials about "caring" with world-class graphics and music, they actually just care and spend that money on action.

One example of the above relates to a subject discussed here -- mental health.  In some European countries, their mental hospitals are minimal, but not due to lack of funding or wrong-headed policy.  They are minimal because almost no one is in them.  Where are they?  Those people are still living in the communities, where family and friends care for them, with the help of medical professionals who do frequent home visits, and the larger community goes out of their way to integrate the person as a full member, rather than treating them like someone with Ebola.

Another example is medical care.  I have lived abroad in places with much higher population density than the U.S, but with far, far fewer resources nationally than we have.  Yet, because they had different priorities, and acted on them, they created a universal health care system that covers the entire population at a price that people can authentically afford, and which covers anyone less able as a societal responsibility.

Places with much less than us do much more for their people.  There is a better way.  It has been demonstrated.  In our society, we collectively lack what is required to choose it.  Instead of beating our chests because we developed the iPhone, maybe we should all be giving that some serious thought.

Vagabound
 
I think about this alot more now that I am getting older. I say to myself I'd like to retire sometime around 65 or so, but I don't think I will. My job can never be outsourced, automated, or streamlined. Many of my coworkers, one of which lives on property as I do, but not in an RV, but in an old (I can't for the life of me remember what the position is called, but its the fella who useto keep the steam engine boilers warm at night on commuter lines.) quarters, are well into their 70's. They refuse to retire and are more then happy to work until they literally drop dead even though they have enough of a pension to live modestly. A few already have.

The older I get, and the further out of date my I.T. skills become, the more I understand why they don't retire. As long as they stay working doing what they are doing, they stay relevant. In the end, I'm pretty darned sure that's what I am going to want when I get to that age, where I still matter in a world that's long left my computer/auto repair/welding/fabricating skills behind.
 
steamjam said:
The older I get, and the further out of date my I.T. skills become, the more I understand why they don't retire.

My brother is a 56 year old computer programmer with a very niche job.  For the past ten years, he has been predicting that if/when they close his division, he will never work as a programmer again.  But in the meantime, he is able to work remotely, from his 40 acres in SE Arizona, and adores all of his personal building projects.  He has a large Bobcat, and says that when that day comes, he will just take work as a Bobcat operator.  

My personal takeaway about growing old, is that there are no guarantees in life.  You can lose your home, no matter whether it's S&B or a Pinto, when you get too old to take care of yourself, or lack financial resources.  My Dad and I both agree that we prefer to "drop like a stone" when the time comes, but ultimately, that isn't up to us.   We've filled out all of the living will paperwork, and made our wishes clearly known, but the only security I know of in life is having a close circle of family and friends who will help take care of each other.
 
..............but the only security I know of in life is having a close circle of family and friends who will help take care of each other.
[/quote]

So true..........



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I think having a home invokes a certain sense of security. Whether that home be a sticks and bricks or a vehicle it doesn't matter, or even a small piece of land...if it's yours and no one can take it, there's comfort in that. There's also a lot of comfort in having a bit of a security fund, for me anyways.
There's no possible way to prepare for every situation. I think everyone should have some sort of plan for the worst case scenario but not get too hung up on it either. Life is short, life is dangerous and life is meant to be lived. You take all the parts of life, try and balance them out as best as you can and do what makes you happy. Otherwise, what's the point?
 
I've spent the last roughly 3 months learning that you will never be able to predict the path your life will take. I will take as much of life as I can at each phase.

My Dad died with regrets. Not over what he did, but what he didn't take the time to do. Mom has taken this lesson to heart...she wants to be on the road tomorrow. Give away everything and get gone! At 90 I sure hope I have half her spunk! Whatever happens to her, one thing she demands is the opportunity to live life her way and grab as much as she can.

I have lived without a house for a long time. Having the RV set up to go will be the first time in long time I will have a "home". It will just be on wheels. BUT, I have never considered myself homeless. I think the reason is attitude. I could be moving in my car from Florida to New York, not knowing where I will lay down to sleep. Yet, it was never a worry, nor a fear. One thing or another would present itself. Choices would always be available. This must be because I am willing to accept each day as adventure....or maybe I am just a social deviant and borderline plain ole nuts?

It does beg the question of what happens when I cannot drive or take care of myself. Many, many years from now. I will have to make plans and carefully consider how I Want the final chapter to be written
 
I don't think I want to be living in a vehicle when I'm 80 years old.Or any other time,actually.If you wait until you are old to plan for your old age,you've waited too long.Anyway,I see the UPS man is here with my new 50 in tv.Hope everyone has a good day.
 
Bob Dickerson said:
I don't think I want to be living in a vehicle when I'm 80 years old.Or any other time,actually.If you wait until you are old to plan for your old age,you've waited too long.

See, now that's where people differ so much!

I sincerely hope that I'm still able to live in a vehicle when I'm 80! And at 85. It may be a different vehicle but as long as it has wheels I'll be happy I think!

I make plans for my old age every day - I live within my income, heck I live below my income so that the money will be there if and when I need it. I try to get some exercise everyday because I know that only through activity will my body stay strong and fit enough so that I CAN live my way in to my 80's and 90's. I eat healthy every day for the same reason...well that and I really, really like good food.... :D

I visited with my 95 year old aunt last week and we talked extensively about different life choices - she was a band groupie going on 3 day bus trips to see 'her heart throb' until 3 years ago. Now she just goes to see him when he's playing a concert close by - those 3 days of a tour bus each way finally got to her. She uses a walker now to go for her daily walks - when the weather is bad she gets her exercise in the hallways of her apartment building. She does all but the heaviest of her own housework and still blanches and freezes her own fresh veggies in season.

My mother on the other hand, never understood the correlation between a healthy active lifestyle and good health. When she passed away this past summer she was 90 but she was unable to do just about anything for herself. She even had trouble pushing the buttons on the remote.

I want to be like Aunt Peg when I grow up (well except the band groupie thing... :D ) so I'm doing everything I can now to ensure that will happen...
 
steamjam1 said:
(I can't for the life of me remember what the position is called, but its the fella who use to keep the steam engine boilers warm at night on commuter lines.) 

Hostler?
 
I think it was Dave.  Yeah, that's right -- Dave.  ;-)

Vagabound
 

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