Propane hoses

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stinko

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I don't know much about propane at all and I'm having trouble finding the right propane hose for me online.  I have an E450 24' bus.  I want to put a 20 lb. tank on a hitch mount cargo carrier in the back and run a hose about 20+ ft. to the stove location which is a simple coleman 2 burner.

This may be stupid easy but when I start looking online I get the impression that there are many kinds of propane hoses.  Money is tight and I don't want to waste any buying products I can't use.  Can somebody help?
 
Black iron + 1/4" copper, or 3/8" copper all the way.

Do not use flexible hose.
 
I assume when John says not to use flexible hose he's referring to rubber/petroleum based hoses which degrade. 

However, CSST is flexible and is what I plan to use in almost identical situation on my E450 conversion. The problem with black pipe is that you need to be able to re-thread it in order to use pieces shorter than stock lengths, and that requires special equipment. So I ruled out using black pipe.

Copper is an option, but CSST looks to be the more durable choice for mobile from what I can tell.  

Corrugated Stainless Steel Tubing (CSST) is a flexible, stainless steel pipe used to supply natural gas and propane in residential, commercial and industrial structures. Do your own research and make sure you understand and feel comfortable with how it is installed and coupled.

[img=300x250]http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/pr...9a-8426-48da-956c-f575ce0af960_1000.jpg[/img]

HOME-FLEX 3/4 in. x 75 ft. CSST Corrugated Stainless Steel Tubing
 
As long as it's in a protected position for DIY I'd go copper, lasts longer than the van, easy to learn how to join flared fittings.

For CSST or black pipe I'd pay a pro.
 
Be very careful working with that CSST. Ends are sharper than obsidian. I wonder why commercial propane installations do not use CSST.
 
There have been home fires, lightning strikes burning holes, in the very thin wall.
 
Main advantage to CSST is saving expensive union labor costs vs black pipe.
 
I'm not quite finished with my own similar propane installation, but I have finished all of the investigation and research, done more than half of it, and watched that operate according to my expectations. When it did not meet my expectations, I determine what was wrong and fixed it.  I am no kind of expert, but I have learned quite a bit along the way. I'll mention a few things worth passing along:

* Regarding installing gas in any kind of a mobile application, there is no consistent answer about anything from anybody, accept the fact that propane is flammable. This includes everybody from your neighbor next door to plumbers and professional propane technicians. Everyone will give you their opinion, but there are precious few incontrovertible facts to back any of that up. In the end, you have to decide what seems to make sense for you and just try to avoid the obviously stupid things. But even which things might be on that list are contentious.

* BradKW made a good point about black iron pipe, but what he didn't mention is that the specialized equipment to cut and thread that pipe exists in almost every home improvement store. If you buy the pipe from them, they will cut and thread it for you, normally for free. I had quite a bit of that done a couple months ago. I used black iron pipe in unrelated projects, and used it in my propane project to cross from a non-living area through an interior wall into the living area. For several reasons it was the best choice for that portion the propane installation: 

Strength to resist any abrasions coming through the wall and potential damage resulting from vibrations during travel; commonly available and relatively inexpensive; a large assortment of commonly available parts to turn corners and change sizes as needed; connections made with nothing more complicated than pipe wrenches and gas tape or goop; and finally, it is a preferred construction material for gas installations according to many sources.

* The trickier and more contentious parts are the beginning and ending sections. Namely, the part from the propane tank to the beginning of the black iron section, and then the part from the other end of the black iron section to your propane device, such as a camp stove or Buddy Heater. 

You cannot use anything rigid to do that job. That leaves you with three basic choices: The flexible stainless steel gas tubing like Brad was talking about, copper, and black rubber hose similar to the type that the Mr. Heater company sells. All of those have pros and cons.

The flexible stainless steel tubing is not the panacea that it seems to be when you first look at it. According to people who do these installations in homes, that tubing is intended for a one-time installation and very seldom movement, such as pulling a gas appliance away from the wall once a year to sweep behind it. It is not designed for constant movement. People who know the most about that material are concerned about metal fatigue and eventual leaks in a situation where it would be moving or vibrating a lot. Although I first wanted to use that for the two ends of my installation, I decided against it for those reasons.

I considered copper, but shied away from it due to cost and the specialized tools and skill to make the connections. That might have turned out to be not such a big deal, but I decided to avoid it and do something more straightforward and within my control.

After much discussion and consideration of all of these different propane carrying media, I chose to get high pressure black rubber hoses custom made for those two sections. Those hoses were created by gas technicians at a propane gas company. Although it sounds like a highly specialized thing, it really is not for those people. They make hoses like that all the time. You just tell them what you want and they make it. Mine were made while I waited in the office.

I'm sure questions will get raised about rubber. On one hand, people say it degrades. Apparently it does, but it can take many years to degrade. I've had a greater number of people tell me they've had a rubber hose connected for many years and had no problems. And if you have a filter on your buddy heater and check the hoses periodically for leaks, it would help reduce or eliminate any real problems.

The great benefits of using rubber hoses are flexibility to make your connections; any lengths you desire within reason; any connector on any end of the hose that you need; speed of obtaining it; they do exactly what you want them to do; and relatively high durability.

I also got pretty deep into learning about gas valves for this installation, but I'll leave that for another day. 

In case you haven't seen them yet, there are other threads in here called propane hoses and connectors, and one on buying propane tanks. They're worth reading.

Tom
 
the stinker said:
on a hitch mount cargo carrier in the back

While not about hoses, my 1999 van has been hit from behind three times.  Since 1975 I have been hit from behind by cars while on a motorcycle.  For what it's worth, I keep my propane inside.  I have fear of other drivers, propane I'm good with.
 
Rubber hoses should ONLY be used where the flexibility is required, e.g. appliance kept in a cupboard and taken out for use.

They should be inspected for cracking and soapy-water for leaks monthly, and replaced IMO every year, certainly not less than two.

Dealing with copper tubing and its standard fittings is really not hard nor expensive, just run it in protected spaces.

You should still check for leaks quarterly, but copper should be fine for a decade.

With such dire consequences, relying on "I know lots of people that do X and never had a problem" is pretty silly.
 
"I know lots of people that do X and never had a problem" is pretty silly.

And they often quote odds, like one in five million. But things can get nasty if you're the ONE.
 
TrainChaser said:
I've seen this kind of mounting arrangement a couple of times, and it looks like a good solution to me: http://oi1382.photobucket.com/album...rra/Installed/20160416_134359_zpsk07nva8m.jpg
Adding weight up top is not ideal, nor heavy projectiles flying around in an accident. If a super-solid offroad type rig OK, but most consumer roof racks are pretty flimsy.

Best is underfloor as with the petrol tank.

Otherwise in back, clearly marked

G4886-lpg-sign.png


help keep tailgaters back :cool:
 
Half the tailgaters can't read 'cat', and they're probably the same ones who think four feet is a safe following distance.

A 50-lb tank on the STURDY roof rack of a 5,000-6,000+lb van isn't going to throw the balance off that much. But if they have that tank AND 800 lbs of gear up there, they're probably too dumb to recognize a problem until it hits them between the eyes, anyway, so it's a moot point: https://www.iforgeiron.com/uploads/500/van.jpg (this is NM).
 
highdesertranger said:
there are standards,  I think this should be made a sticky.  this document is the code book for RV propane systems it spells out everything you need to do to be legal.  it also answers all question related to propane.

http://code3rv.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/Book-5-Propane-Systems-small.pdf

highdesertranger


That's definitely a comprehensive read...very worthwhile. It looks like a textbook for students wanting to become qualified for mobile LP systems...
 
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