Lessons learned—1st trip in a half converted van

[jonyjoe303]

For staying warm in cold weather you need to make the van as airtight as possible, I have a removable foam covering my sliding door, the front of the van is seperated from the rear of the van. Foam insulation on the roof/sides/windows. Once I made the van airtight, I got extremely good results, where I don't even use a heater anymore, and I usually sleep on top of a sleeping bag with a light blanket. On the roof of the van I got 6 layers of 1/2" foam, everywhere else maybe 2 layers of foam, so I can definitely increase the performance if I needed by adding more foam insulation. You can never add too much foam especially if you hate freezing.

Any inside temp over 50 degrees is good, below 50 degrees you need a sleeping bag, when outside air is getting in your van, you need 2 sleeping bags and maybe a blanket on top of that. I experience those days even here in southern california, where inside and outside temperatures where the same.


This is the inside/outside temps, I took the pictures in the morning when its the coldest. No heater in use.

 

[StacyK]

Thank you for the further recommendations, folks.

Jacque, I love your one thing at a time suggestion—that’s really wise. I have felt the benefit of my insulation in the heat (though covering the windshield seems to make just as much difference), but I’m currently more dubious about cold.

jonyjoe, where do you store the foam when it’s not in use?

 

[tx2sturgis]

Doodie Bags in combination with a hassock type camp toilet, or a bucket with a 'loo lid'...well they just work.

Kinda spendy, but they work. No poop 'pyramids', no smell, no messy tipovers while driving.

They are double bags with a gel/powder that treats the waste (one or two) and renders it disposable in any available dumpster. 

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Ozark-Tr...let-Bags-with-Bio-Gel-6-Pack-2683-13/14550463

https://www.cabelas.com/shop/en/reliance-double-doodie-waste-bags-with-bio-gel-6-pack

 

[Qxxx]

They also sell just the poo powder.

https://www.backcountry.com/cleanwaste-mini-55-use-poo-powder-waste-treatment

 

[jonyjoe303]

I don't store the insulation, I just move it out of the way when I need to open the side door which is rare. In the front it's just a sliding door, to get in and out of the drivers seat. All my cabinet doors are made out of foam insulation. It does take up alot of space especially the 3 inches on the roof, but it works too good to try something else.

I started with 1 inch of foam then realized the more foam I added the better the results. Its been 2 winters that I havent had to use a heater, and I already know I won't need it this winter. If I start to feel cold I just add more foam. If your going to do it fulltime, you need alot of foam to make it livable. Nothing worst then waking up freezing.

In the picture it shows before with alot of foam, and after with alot of foam but sticky decorator tape to improve the appearance. Straight ahead is the driver area behind a sliding foam insulated door. The large windshield is where alot of cold gets in, thats why I keep it isolated from the rear of the van. You know you done a good job with the insulation when its 12 noon, and in the back of the van its pitch black.

 

[tx2sturgis]

They also sell just the poo powder.

https://www.backcountry.com/cleanwaste-mini-55-use-poo-powder-waste-treatment

lol...I got a 'kick' outta that....I mean....mini? C'mon.....What about us manly-men and our MAXI poo?

 

[nature lover]

TX2Sturgis I have just what you need. The bucket I use in my Porta potty is a 5 quart ice cream bucket and it says family size. Is That big enough?

 

[vanbrat]

I also like the blankets over bag sleeping, but like you didn't like the extra blankets under the mattress. So I got out my trusty singer sewing machine and chopped off the bottom 10 inches or so and then to help keep it 'tucked' in sewed elastic around the bottom edge. It stays nice and neat, we now have three blankets this way as well as the sheets. both top and bottom sheets needed to be refit. The top is covered with a quilt that just barely over sized the mattress so it keeps things looking neat. I have 3 big over sized "pillows" that hold extra blankets if we need them. But really are what we lean against when sitting up on the bed to read watch movies or ?. They make the bed the sofa during the day/evening. But get in the way at night when sleeping, so not sure how long I will put up with that. We have lots of pockets and are still getting used to them. I have surprised a few people by what I can carry in my little van. Lighting is going to keep being a challenge as it gets dark early now and the inside is going to be needed more for evening living. We don't live in our van just long trips so ......

 

[jacqueg]

Thank you for the further recommendations, folks.

Jacque, I love your one thing at a time suggestion—that’s really wise. I have felt the benefit of my insulation in the heat (though covering the windshield seems to make just as much difference), but I’m currently more dubious about cold.

jonyjoe, where do you store the foam when it’s not in use?

It all depends on your own definition of comfort and your own estimation of what's worth the effort. I've spent enough years living in 100-year-old houses with no insulation, as well as tent camping, that I just don't feel the need for the air surrounding me to be toasty warm every single minute. That's why we invented socks, sweaters, and blankets.

Yes, covering your windshield on a sunny day makes a big difference. It makes a difference when it's cold too.

 

[StacyK]

tx2sturgis and Qxxx—aha. That may be just the ticket—thank you. For me the extra spendiness would be worth it, not to have to lug mammoth new bags of fresh pine shavings into the van every so often. Cost comes in many forms, and physical energy is the steepest for me. That’s very, very helpful. Qxxx was probably being kind to my delicate sensibilities with the Mini, tx2sturgis.

jonyjoe, thank you for all the info and the photos. I think for someone susceptible to claustrophobia it may not be the best choice, but it sure makes an impressive difference for you. I will think further about separating the cab from the living space.

Thanks again, everyone, for the input.

 

[StacyK]

I've spent enough years living in 100-year-old houses with no insulation, as well as tent camping, that I just don't feel the need for the air surrounding me to be toasty warm every single minute. That's why we invented socks, sweaters, and blankets.

Socks, sweaters, and blankets are fine for everything except hands. I don’t require toasty warmth for the rest of me—my joints do ache in cold, but that can be managed with knee-covering cardigans or coats. In cold temperatures, though, my hands turn into claws that I can’t use to hold a kitchen knife safely, or to hold a pen. They hurt to the point of actual pain. As in, moaning out loud pain, and I generally have a reasonably good tolerance for pain. I have tried many remedies, from pain relievers to hot wax baths to heat rubs to medication to fingerless gloves, and the only reliable one is a good pair of mittens—which makes most activities of everyday indoor life a little challenging. So it really is important to me to find a way to address the temperature issue, in ways that those lovely socks, sweaters, and blankets just can’t. I had hoped for more from the insulation which, since I am unable to do overhead work, I paid to have installed. Now that I know it’s not enough, I’ll move on to...some plan B or other.

 

[Qxxx]

 Qxxx was probably being kind to my delicate sensibilities with the Mini,

Sorry to say, more like I was being lazy. I was just endeavoring to point out you can buy the powder alone, and posted the "first" link I found. I'm sure you can get a SUPER-DUPER-MAGNUM sized can of poo powder if you really need one,  :angel:

 

[wayne49]

"Mini" means a small container with 55 uses versus 120 uses in the "large" Poo tub.

https://www.amazon.com/Cleanwaste-Large-Powder-Waste-Treatment/dp/B000SOJRXE

Of course, some cowboys may need double scoops to do the duty. Full of it sometimes, ya know.

 

[nature lover]

About living and sleeping in the cold. I grew up living in a 200-year-old house that was Double brick but no insulation. I used to take a glass of water to bed, still do. back when I was a child there was ice on top of that water in the morning when I woke up. We used to heat up bricks by the only stove we had in the house a wood range for cooking and heat in the kitchen. Then we wrap those bricks in burlap bags and put them in the bottom of our bed to keep our feet warm till we fell asleep. In my later childhood we had electricity and bought electric blankets. We were told electric blankets are bad for your health and might cause cancer. So one of us would go upstairs and turn on everybody’s blanket an hour before bedtime to get everybody’s bed warm and then we turned them off and crawled in a warm bed and fell asleep without the blanket turned on. I could always tolerate the cold in most of my life didn’t wear anything but a jacket or heavy sweater even in some of the worst of weather. No more, this old man Has to be toasty warm. As I said somewhere else isn’t it wonderful getting old. Lord bless the nomads and keep us all warm.

 

[jacqueg]

Socks, sweaters, and blankets are fine for everything except hands. I don’t require toasty warmth for the rest of me—my joints do ache in cold, but that can be managed with knee-covering cardigans or coats. In cold temperatures, though, my hands turn into claws that I can’t use to hold a kitchen knife safely, or to hold a pen. They hurt to the point of actual pain. As in, moaning out loud pain, and I generally have a reasonably good tolerance for pain. I have tried many remedies, from pain relievers to hot wax baths to heat rubs to medication to fingerless gloves, and the only reliable one is a good pair of mittens—which makes most activities of everyday indoor life a little challenging. So it really is important to me to find a way to address the temperature issue, in ways that those lovely socks, sweaters, and blankets just can’t. I had hoped for more from the insulation which, since I am unable to do overhead work, I paid to have installed. Now that I know it’s not enough, I’ll move on to...some plan B or other.

Ouch, that IS a problem.

 

[desert_sailing]

 my hands turn into claws

aka T-rex syndrome.  

The cold does that to me as well so I try to keep the heat up as much as possible..especially if it would decrease pain. 80 something inside is ideal for me... and I am testing to see how long my propane lasts for nice toasty heat. Having worked outside in cold weather.. I will have perma claw much sooner than I would like... Stay toasty.

I like you also need a nice tucked in bed. It has actually been one of the more minor annoyances I have had so far in the rig. Yesterday I finally realized a possible fix.
I have a twin size bed that is also a couch in daytime. I have sheets for a twin but my blankets and quilt are all king size. Yesterday, instead of folding the excess behind the mattress I tucked the excess underneath the mattress at the foot and the wall side. It worked great! I stayed nice and snug without everything balling up. If I needed space and the room was nice and toasty I could just flip back the untucked side and have a breather.. also get out fast to use the "bottle".

I think the best thing about using extra large blankets and tucking them like that was in making the bed in the morning. I do NOT hvae a hightop and can NOT walk around the whole bed. It took me much longer than I would like to make it..especially while hunched over.. 6'1, bent over fighting with king size blankets is less than ideal and not a way I like to start my day.

Soo far soo good we will see how long one tuck lasts before having to retuck I am already thinking of velcro..or hem tap or something to the underside of the mattress.

Good luck to you. I look forward to hearing from you as your van living evolves.

I did have terrible lighting but bought a couple strands of warm white led strips with usb and now instead of a harsh and dingy vibe, I have a warm snug little den and it is great. I think at walmart they are about 12 bux.. I used two strands and they are dimmable. For warm white they give off a great amount of brightness. The cool white is exactly that cool and cold..not what I want for cozy vibes.

 

[kygreg]

I think the whole idea of vanlife is not to actually live in the van, but do most of your "living" outdoors, and sleep in the van. 

I was at the 2019 RTR touring as many different vehicle conversions as I could to help me decide what I wanted to live in. Your statement seemed true for most of the folks I talked to. Then we had 2-3 days of rain and I was feeling sorry for many of those folks in the vans that I toured. That's what helped me to decide that I wanted my primary living space to be in my conversion with of course the option to be all of the outdoors. I'm more than halfway through my step van conversion and making a nice, open, uncluttered, bright interior was a top priority. The extra width of a step van makes all the difference.

 

[eDJ_]

I really enjoy reading threads like this and would like to read more of them.  "My First Time Out".  

Loioking back on my old Boy Scout days when on the trail back packing and hiking,  we were to attend a "Shake Down" seminar.  We had been given a long list of things to bring.  Our instructor showed us how little of all of it we would really need.  

The trail we were on (similar to being on the road)  had many camp stations where we stayed.  Sometimes we camped in the wilderness.  As an example we were instructed to bring a roll of toilet tissue.  The instructor had all of us to take the roll an make 20 wrappings of it around one of our hands.  This was then compressed and placed in one of the plastic sandwich bags.   We were told we probably wouldn't even use all of it.......and he was right.
When I travel on the road today in my Rig,  I hit a fast foods place or 24/7 super convenience store and take care of business there before I find a place to park and sleep.  Anymore I just carry a box of kleenex and I always have a roll of paper towels.  (not only handy in the kitchen, but if I have to work on the rig I can clean parts or my hands with them.  (and if worse comes to worse use them as toilet tissue)

A couple of other observations.  Cotton clothing and bed stuff is fine as long as it is dry.  Wool will still keep you warm even if damp.  Goose Down is light and warm. (in your rig it probably won't get wet)  Goose Down doesn't do well when wet.  Polarguard is thought by many to be fine synthetic insulation for bed comforters or sleeping bags.  There are varieties of it.  I have a comforter that is insulated with "Hollifil" synthetic fiber.  It's a twin size and has been OK for me sleeping in my van.  Acrylic blankets are rather warm.  Some electric blankets made with acrylic are around and are expensive.  They claim to be the warmest.  Today most electric blankets have a 6 hour
automatic shut off timer built into them.  I guess by 6 hours you are plenty warm enough to make it thru the night.  Bob once mentioned to sleep wearing a toboggan which makes sense as  your head is mostly exposed and uncovered. 

I agree with having a heater in your rig,  but if you can sleep in a warm bed try not to use a heater.  Turn it on when you get up.....and then stay up.  Otherwise you could wake up dead.    

I like the idea of carrying a 2 gallon  garden sprayer with a kitchen sink sprinkler hose adapted to it.  It can be handy for numerous things including taking a shower.  Have other containers for drinking & cooking water.
If you have room, a small foot locker with a flat top will add space to sit things on.  You can always fit a thin piece of plywood to the top of it should you want to set something hot on it.  Just throw a pot holder down on it to sit the hot skillet or pan on.

 

[Qxxx]

 That's what helped me to decide that I wanted my primary living space to be in my conversion with of course the option to be all of the outdoors. I'm more than halfway through my step van conversion and making a nice, open, uncluttered, bright interior was a top priority. The extra width of a step van makes all the difference.

Good thinking. In good weather, for a van dweller living mostly outside or in a tent is fine, but several days of bad weather take their toll, if the inside of the van is too cramped and cluttered.

I have a regular GMC Savana and over the course of 3 years, I have worked at producing ever more open floor space. Originally I had just 3'x3' (oof), but now I have 4'x6'. This is enough room to move my chair around and even erect a folding lounge chair. I was also mortified that so many "fancy" and "expensive" van builds had so little open floor space, usually just a 2' wide corridor down the middle, with cabinets packed all along the sides.

In regards the truism that "with a van you sleep inside, but mostly 'live' outside", this brings up the issue of those big RVs, like Class-As, 5th wheels, and large TTs. In 3 years wintering around Quartzsite, by far the most common thing I've seen is that people who live in those units tend to hardly every come outside. Just like being in S&B with all the conveniences, TV, microwave, and easy chair. OK for some. If you really want to spend your life inside, that's the way to go.

 

[kygreg]

 In 3 years wintering around Quartzsite, by far the most common thing I've seen is that people who live in those units tend to hardly every come outside. Just like being in S&B with all the conveniences, TV, microwave, and easy chair. OK for some. If you really want to spend your life inside, that's the way to go.

Traditional RV'er with a winter park and a summer park are (in my opinion) recreating their bricks and sticks life. They can't afford to have a true summer and winter bricks and sticks home, so this is the next best thing. Boondockers tend to approach it a different way, we are not trying to duplicate a house and the lifestyle that goes with it but we are building from scratch a new nomadic lifestyle. At least that's how I look at it. I've done a lot of bicycle touring and backpacking, I don't try to reproduce a house in a backpack, I build a set of tools that will fit in a small package that allow me to enjoy the trail. Outfitting my van is an extension of that methodology. Granted, my van looks a whole lot more like a house than a backpack or set of panniers, but the thought process is similar.