L.A. City Council Votes To Ban People From Living Inside Cars And RVs

[darude]

http://laist.com/2016/11/01/criminalizing_homelessness.php?utm_source=feedly&utm_medium=webfeeds

 

[ArtW]

the bad: what Cali does, the nation copies
The good: I never intended to go to LA, anyway

 

[darude]

the bad: what Cali does, the nation copies
The good: I never intended to go to LA, anyway

you know what they say don't you :huh:..  what starts in cali never stays in cali. though this article makes me sick take that last tool from a person that they have for survival. id'e rather have em camping out in cars vans rv's than taking up the sidewalks. and there's no section 8 out here and there's no affordable housing there's a waiting list to get in the shelters

 

[GotSmart]

This from the article says it all.


The 9th Circuit ruling resulted in a [size=small]$1.1 million settlement paid by to the city to the law offices of Carol Sobelhttp://clkrep.lacity.org/onlinedocs/2015/15-0804_mot_08-19-2015.pdf, a Santa Monica based attorney who's successfully sued the city multiple times over homeless related issues.[/size]


Time will tell whether or not Los Angeles will be sued over this latest ordinance. How the new rules will be enforced also remains somewhat unclear, given the only way to know whether or not someone is living inside a vehicle (RV with closed windows, at least) is to knock and wait for them to answer.

At the same time, it is still perfectly legal for someone to park their vehicle in a residential neighborhood, and sleep on the sidewalk outside of it.

 

[ArtW]

I am aware, darude, see what I said forst
The bad: what Cali does, the nation copies

 

[darude]

This from the article says it all.


The 9th Circuit ruling resulted in a [size=small]$1.1 million settlement paid by to the city to the law offices of Carol Sobelhttp://clkrep.lacity.org/onlinedocs/2015/15-0804_mot_08-19-2015.pdf, a Santa Monica based attorney who's successfully sued the city multiple times over homeless related issues.[/size]


Time will tell whether or not Los Angeles will be sued over this latest ordinance. How the new rules will be enforced also remains somewhat unclear, given the only way to know whether or not someone is living inside a vehicle (RV with closed windows, at least) is to knock and wait for them to answer.

At the same time, it is still perfectly legal for someone to park their vehicle in a residential neighborhood, and sleep on the sidewalk outside of it.

i hope they do get sued again and the homeless win!!! i am wondering how the new laws will be enforced as they are unclear also. that's the dumbest crap i ever heard of that it's perfectly legal to park your vehicle and sleep on the sidewalks. i see problems with sleeping on the sidewalks id be in everyones way and my saftey wich is far more important than being in everyones way. and what person with a vehicle  is gonna sleep on the damm sidewalk :huh:  explain that one LOL.. this will be interesting since the state don't even have the money to enforce there so called CARB laws wich is a crock to since those wing nuts let someone be on CARB that lied about getting there degree i forgot who it was

 

[darude]

I am aware, darude, see what I said forst
The bad: what Cali does, the nation copies

i did read what you said and i said what we say out here.. the nanny state starts everything and everyone else follows. i wonder what state will be the next to regulate cow farts that's the dumbest crap i have ever heard of

 

[djkeev]

A lot of times inane rules like this are on the books only for select enforcement as the need demonstrates.

They probably have No intention to enter every parked Van or car looking to bust people down on their luck but view it as a tool, a way to legally say "move along people" when they become a localized public nuisance.

There are towns in my area that already ban staying in a RV on your own property! (Often a duration limit allowing guests for a week or so) Some HOA's and even some towns even regulate if you can park an RV, unlicensed car or a boat at your own house!!

This sadly is nothing new and is simply another form of NIMBY.

My thoughts anyway..........

Dave

 

[frater secessus]

I think DJ is correct.  I will tweak a couple of phrases to represent my cynicism about local officials:

"for select enforcement as the need demonstrates" --> as people complain to the city council
"when they become a localized public nuisance" --> when they generate complaints


Under the hood (subconsciously) there may be a few moving parts leading to this NIMBY:
* class issues - I don't want "those people" around here
* money issues -  I don't want "those people" pulling down my home value
* sublimated frustration about their position -  If I have to kill myself for a mortgage then you have to kill yourself for a mortgage

Regarding the two former points:  we've heard that song before but it was about ethnic groups (or hippies) instead of full-timers.  

And on the latter point:  the existence of free, nomadic, and mortgage-unencumbered person in the immediate area can be an uncomfortable reminder of the heavily compromised life they lead.  How many times have you heard "I'd love to do that but I have [a spouse|kids|mortgage]..." ?

 

[ccbreder]

" The new ban is born out of those concerned residents, and specifically outlaws vehicular habitation on any residential street, defined as "any street that adjoins one or more residential single or multifamily residences." "

 

[Goshawk]

" The new ban is born out of those concerned residents, and specifically outlaws vehicular habitation on any residential street, defined as "any street that adjoins one or more residential single or multifamily residences." "

So park in light industrial areas?


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[Almost There]

So park in light industrial areas?


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From reading the article, I'd say yes!!

LA learned from the previous lawsuit that they aren't able to just ban sleeping in your vehicle all the time, everywhere!

Sooo, their solution - ban it in residential neighborhoods, close to parks and schools, during night time hours only! Keeps the residents who have been complaining happy, avoids the 100% ban that they tried before.

Park in light industrial areas, business neighborhoods, etc. and you're outside the letter of the law!

 

[MikeRuth]

This problem would be essentially non exsistant if these folks would keep things cleaned up.
For Several years motor homes primarily were parking along Woodley Ave at the Sepulveda basin. Cops didn't give them trouble and for the most part those parked did not cause trouble, but alas they did not keep the area clean. Recently they are all gone, and what did they do, moved about a half mile over to Balboa and parked there. I doubt they learned there lesson.

Homeless around my home in Tarzana has grown, and I noticed that ares under the freeway bridges have more and more. To me I don't mind as long as they keep the area clean. I stopped the other day and caught up with a guy I have seen there for a long time, I gave him a box of large trash bags and said tell your friends to keep this area clean and you will likely keep the folks around here much more comfortable. In just two weeks the entire area looks great. I told them add or make a sign that says "were keeping this are clean for you".

MIke

 

[drysailor]

http://laist.com/2016/11/01/criminalizing_homelessness.php?utm_source=feedly&utm_medium=webfeeds

Coming from the community that addressed it's homeless problem by giving them one-way bus tickets to other places, this does not surprise me.

 

[TrainChaser]

What kind of people do you think comprise City Councils?

Who do you think they're most worried about? And whose property values?

And who do you think will be on the phone to the police to get rid of that RV parked on their street?

 

[akrvbob]

There is actually a very great deal of very good news in this article. So you don't actually have to read it, I pulled some quotes from it.  In fact, overall, it is a positive article toward the homeless:

"If passed, the ordinance would allow individuals to live in their cars as long as they are parked on streets zoned for industrial or commercial purposes."

So the headlines could have read, "L.A. votes to LEGALIZE homeless parking and live on some city streets" And it would be 100% true. But we'd all rather hear bad news and complain how the government is only composed of monsters. There is a reason that if it bleeds, it leads.

In fact, they are actively looking for places for the homeless to live in cars right now:

"Though the city is proactively attempting to find safe locations for these people to park their vehicles at night... During Tuesday’s Council meeting, several council members spoke about how they wanted to ensure that the motion in question does not impede the ultimate implementation of a safe parking program in the city (the city is in the process of considering a program that would allow for individuals to park their cars overnight in designated lots around the city)"

I view this article as very positive and hopeful for us. Perhaps we should have read it a little more closely before passing judgment.

 

[Goshawk]

Thanks bob. From now on vow to read all the source material more thorough before comment. This is good news.


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[frater secessus]

I read the full article before posting. I do not believe the council, in general, is interested in the well-being of car dwellers. I *do* think they are keen on not getting this iteration of the law overturned by the circuit for overbroadness.

 

[USExplorer]

The title of this thread is misleading. The ban will only be in place for residential streets. In all likelihood those caught for the first time would be told to move to the industrial areas, where they could sleep in peace if they are not violating any other laws. When I was last in Ventura this was the de facto policy in place, but LA City Council now wants to codify it.

I took a look through the comments in that article and saw the pictures one LA resident posted of the street in front of his house, and even as a car dweller I sympathize with the homeowners trying to chase these people out of their neighborhoods. I've seen some of these encampments myself. Giant piles of trash and filth on the ground, tarps strung up all down the sidewalk. Evidence of drug use everywhere. Some of the camps are downright dangerous. It would be best if they were offered treatment, but the only available solution seems to be sequestering them in the industrial areas.

 

[Wanderer]

I also got this (At the end of the article)

An earlier version of this post incorrectly stated that the ban had been voted into law; the City Council voted to direct the City Attorney's office to draft an ordinance. The post was also revised to more accurately reflect the fact that the potential ordinance would allow individuals to legally sleep in their cars on streets zoned for industrial or commercial uses.

If I was on the CC, I'd ask the lawyer who sued and won how best to draft it, that way everyone can benefit from this...