Generator installation

[Anhedonic]

I'm about to start building my van and I have ordered a Westinghouse iGen4500 generator: 


What I'd like to do is install it such that it works like one of the generators permanently installed in an RV. The way I'm thinking about doing it is to get an airtight metal box and put it up against the outside. I'd put in a fan to bring in a lot of outside air and an an exhaust pipe to the outside and leave at least an inch or two of space on all sides for ventilation. Further, I'd put in something like an inch or two of sound and vibration insulation. I would use the remote starter to start and stop it. 

It seems like it would work and even be safe, provided the box was sufficiently airtight. Still, I anticipate problems. First, there is no way to get it to fill from the gas tank; I *believe* these are gravity fed so any fuel pump would flood it. I'd have to get some kind of replacement cap as well. Work around is to turn off the generator, open the box, fill the generator, close the box, and start it again. Not ideal, but I can work with it. 

Does anyone have any thoughts on this plan? Whether it will work? How to make it work better? 

Keep in mind that this really is my first rodeo. Yes, as a matter of fact I did just fall off the turnip truck.
At least with regard to most mechanical things.

 

[Moxadox]

The installation instructions you receive with the generator will specify things like whether it's safe to do an onboard installation or whether this unit must be in the open air. I currently have an Onan installed in a box at the front of my trailer, but the whole bottom of the box is open to the air. The genny sits on the aluminum structural members of the trailer.

There are diesel generators that feed off the vehicle tank, but diesel is not explosive limit gasoline. I'd get some really good professional advice about running a line from your gas tank....might be a whole lot safer to put a fill cap somewhere convenient on the outside of your box.

The Dire Wolfess

 

[Anhedonic]

Thank you Wolfess. I really like your idea about moving the fill cap. One aspect that made me a little nervous was having to open the box inside the van to fill it. I'll have to look into how hard that would be.

As to safety, none of this type of generator seems to be made for installation and no company will say that it's OK. I'm thinking about doing it anyway. I really hadn't thought about venting the bottom though. That changes a lot about how I'm thinking about this.

My van already comes with an extra tap on the gas tank for just this sort of purpose. If that part is even possible, I will be having it professionally done. I don't want to explode.

 

[DannyB1954]

My onboard Genny is propane. It runs off of a 20 tank that can be changed. I don't have remote start, so I have to start it with a pull cord. In several places you say air tight. I hope you mean in an enclosure that is separate from your living space. Generators produce a lot of heat and fumes. Putting it in an air tight box it won't run for long.

 

[Anhedonic]

Danny, when I say air-tight, I mean relative to the interior, but vented outside. I'm currently planning a metal grille for outside the van with a fan pulling outside air in for ventilation, cooling, and to feed air to the generator. The inside must not leak as I do not wish to suffocate. :

I'm currently thinking about putting the whole thing on a heavy runner so I can open the grille from outside and slide the generator out for filling and maintenance.

 

[johnny b]

I think you're thinking along these lines....







I would recommend a welded box section done by a good, professional fabricator.
Then put sound deadening material on the outside of the box....leave the inside genny area as metal, spray painted with engine paint since it has to deal with exhaust. (Chevy orange is nice...but that may just be me )

Hopefully you can then build interior furniture, or bed to cover the box inside the van.

Good luck.

 

[Riverman]

I've been operating generators for over 50-years and a portable generator is not designed to be operated in an enclosed box.

It's your generator though...

Best wishes.

 

[Anhedonic]

Johnny B: Exactly what I was thinking about. Basically what your pictures show, with the entire wall to the outside replaced by a grille and fan to get plenty of ventilation. I have a friend who is much better at this sort of thing than me who is going to build the box. We're planning to use painted wood, sealed to withing inches of its life. Metal is just too expensive. A good fabricator could make me one, but those run into the thousand dollar+ range which makes them out of reach for me right now.

The grill on the outside of the van will be attached to what is essentially a drawer so I can pull the generator out to fuel and service it.

Riverman: Yeah, I know. If I had better options or more money I would do it all differently. Still, with sufficient ventilation and insulation, I hope to make this work.

 

[johnny b]

OK....
3 more suggestions:
Mount the fan(s) in the top half of the grill/door to allow air to flow in thru the bottom half.

Get at least two CO (carbon monoxide) detectors for your living area.

Connect the exhaust to an external 'snorkel'. Hopefully your genny will have a short nipple pipe on the muffler exit that you can clamp a piece of flex pipe onto and route down thru the floor. Then either run a pipe out the back, beyond the rear bumper or install a 'periscope' style pipe going up above the roof line.

Van bodies tend to flex a little and along with the constant road vibrations, a leak could easily form from a tiny break in the 'seal'.

 

[highdesertranger]

snorkel exhaust must be done correctly or you will increase the backpressure beyond safe levels. look how this one is done,

https://www.amazon.com/Camco-Gen-Turi-Generator-Disconnect-44461/dp/B000BUU5XG

notice the air gap. highdesertranger

 

[Anhedonic]

Johnny B and HighDesertRanger, thank you both for the suggestions. I will follow them.

With regard to the snorkel exhaust, would it be more prudent to buy something like in that link? While I am budget conscious, safety is absolutely primary. If I have to spend an extra hundred or two to make sure this is safe, I'm willing. I would prefer to route to the back of the vehicle rather than along the roof line personally, but I'm sure something similar to Ranger's link exists for that.

As to the seals, I was hoping we would use a flexible sealant where the box meets the wall so that a little bit of flex will be manageable. Do you think this will quickly become a problem? Do you have any thoughts on mitigating it?

 

[Anhedonic]

snorkel exhaust must be done correctly or you will increase the backpressure beyond safe levels.  look how this one is done,

If I want to run a pipe from the small exhaust pipe on the generator to the rear of the van, what can I do to avoid this? I I can't just run some flex pipe from the exhaust to the back?

 

[Riverman]

When my Onan generator finally goes out and can't be repaired reasonably, I'm going to seal that compartment up 100% with welded metal.

Then, build a slide tray like a kitchen drawer, sit an inverter generator on it with the exhaust pointed away from the rv, and slide it out when in use.

The gas fumes, exhaust and heat will then be outside the RV. When it cools down... slide it back into the sealed compartment and head home.

 

[Dingfelder]

Since carbon monoxide is heavier than air -- that's how those African volcanoes occasionally erupt gasses that quickly kill off the dogs and children while leaving adults standing and bewildered -- wouldn't it be best to keep the exhaust low? If high, it could drift down and asphyxiate you.

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

Since carbon monoxide is heavier than air . . . 

Carbon monoxide is actually lighter than air:  CO has a molar mass of 28.0, air has an average molar mass of 28.8.  In reality CO mixes with air quickly.

 

[Dingfelder]

Hmm really? I guess my chemistry memory has dimmed, thanks for the correction.