Cost of owning/repairing

[steamjam1]

Would you says buying a van with your last $3000 is a wise move? Or gambling that it's not going to blow a gasket, drop a transmission, throw a rod. When you know nothing about engines at all? Seems like gambling.

If I was down to my last 3K and had no job, I wouldn't buy a van. I'd get an older Toyota Camry station wagon with a 3S engine. Then I'd get a maintenance free deep cycle battery, a constant duty solenoid, wire, switch, a 600 watt inverter, spray glue, some black fabric, reflectix, Mylar sheets, LED dome light bulbs, a Coleman 533 stove and a Swedish Army stainless steel mess kit.

That totals under 2K. Then I'd hit the road!

 

[Bela's Mom]

I too have eaten many a meal from a dumpster. Lived under a tree by a river. I would have preferred to have a vehicle to sleep in but I had nothing but a blanket. I guess we will do whatever we have to do to survive the circumstances we are in at the time. There is risk in everything we do daily, including just leaving the house, be it brick and sticks or a vehicle. All we can do is prepare the best we can and resolve each problem as it arises. I'm not saying not to have some emergency funds...but not everyone can save that much before having to make whatever life change that is staring them in the face.

Today, I don't have to live in my van but I sure would like to!

 

[flying kurbmaster]

I think there are a lot of variables, I don't think your rainy day fund needs to be excessive, if you are working, and are in one place. If you are travelling I think it should be enough to get a tow and some repairs, especially in remote areas where getting a tow can be expensive. I like to carry some cash in very remote areas. The less you have the bigger the risk, while this may be true, the risk lessens if your vehicle is reliable and your luck is good. If you have grown to trust your vehicle, have maintained it well, you don't worry as much.

 

[Belinda2]

Jo,
It sounds like you worked very hard to rise above all the challenges that have been dealt to you. You seem to be a very special person.
Steamjam1,
I have some very basic questions.
1. The Mylar sheets: Are they for warmth? Can you really use something that thin on a regular basis as a blanket or are they for wall insulation?
2. That stove is a classic. I have a lot of experience with it. Why that stove over any other one about that price? Would you always just get Coleman brand?
3. I assume you picked the Camry station wagon verses the Camry sedan so you could stretch out in it. I agree the 3S engine is a superior value. If you were buying an engine that was more modern than the 3S, what do you think of the Toyota Sienna minivan for space compared to the Camry with the great Toyota reliability? If you were leaning towards a foreign engine that was fairly new and tow weight didn't matter, what would you buy today? What would you buy if money was no object and all you cared about was reliability, economical value, and good resale value years later?
4. Stainless steel is nice. It doesn't rust. Would a stainless steel pot and dinnerware with plastic disposable knives and forks for eating be just as useful? Why the Swedish brand?
5. Why the maintenance free battery when the other and adding you own water and monitoring it is so much cheaper?
Thanks for all your time. Your blog is interesting.

 

[offroad]

While I certainly agree that we should all have an emergency fund the simple truth is many of us can't and don't. I had the choice of live in a cardboard box or live in a van. I found an old POS box van for $1500, (which was every penny I had in the world) so I bought it.

Again, I could live in that van or I could live in a cardboard box, I think I made the right choice. i was lucky and it was virtually trouble free until it blew an engine 3 years later, but by then living in the van had got me back on my feet financially and I had no problem putting a new engine in it.

Every moment of every day, life is a horrible risk!!! The only option is to live in a box in the ground. I can either live in constant fear and terror of what could happen or i can embrace it and live life to it's fullest.

“I would rather be ashes than dust! I would rather that my spark should burn out in a brilliant blaze than it should be stifled by dry rot. I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow than a sleepy and permanent planet. The function of a man is to live, not to exist. I shall not waste my days trying to prolong them. “ Jack London

“I will not die an unlived life.
I will not live in fear
of falling or catching fire.
I choose to inhabit my days,
to allow my living to open me,
to make me less afraid,
more accessible;
to loosen my heart
until it becomes a wing,
a torch, a promise.
― Dawna Markova,

Thanks Bob. London is a hero. Believe folks. Drink the koolaid. Take the blue pill. Head down the rabbit hole. Hiding may no longer be a choice.

 

[offroad]

Car camping is a cheapest option. You can do it now. Get a winter sleeping bag, and some no see em bug netting; and a car.

 

[steamjam1]

Steamjam1,
I have some very basic questions.
1. The Mylar sheets: Are they for warmth? Can you really use something that thin on a regular basis as a blanket or are they for wall insulation?
I've done two things with Mylar sheets. The first is I peeled back the headliner and installed a layer of it to the inside face of the headliner using spray- glue, and for emergencies.

2. That stove is a classic. I have a lot of experience with it. Why that stove over any other one about that price? Would you always just get Coleman brand?
I suggested the Coleman 533 because they excellent stoves and are so easy to find used but in great condition for under $30.00. I bought mine for $25.00. I use mine as a back up. I use a Cold War era Russian built Shmel-2 gasoline stove for my daily needs. It's built like a tank, will run on just about any liquid fuel cept alcohol, and best of all instead of costing $20.00 to service it like the Coleman, the only replacement service parts are 5 o-rings. The last time I serviced it, it cost me 74 cents.

3. I assume you picked the Camry station wagon verses the Camry sedan so you could stretch out in it. I agree the 3S engine is a superior value. If you were buying an engine that was more modern than the 3S, what do you think of the Toyota Sienna minivan for space compared to the Camry with the great Toyota reliability? If you were leaning towards a foreign engine that was fairly new and tow weight didn't matter, what would you buy today? What would you buy if money was no object and all you cared about was reliability, economical value, and good resale value years later?
I suggested the older Toyota Camry because they are cheap to buy (About 1K), parts are super cheap and they get 28-30mpg. Used 3S engines go for about $300-400 from those "Used Japanese Engines" companies in case you blow one up, and they are well known to run for 400K+ miles before they wear out. You wouldn't have to have a huge "just incase" fund to travel around. They are ubiquitous in just about every neighborhood on the continent so you'll blend right in when you gots to be on the stealth. If money was no object, I'd dispense with living in a van/wagon, buy a Boeing 747, an EarthRoamer and hire a full time crew to fly my *ss all over the world and wait for me!

4. Stainless steel is nice. It doesn't rust. Would a stainless steel pot and dinnerware with plastic disposable knives and forks for eating be just as useful? Why the Swedish brand?
I suggested the stainless Swedish mess kit because its an all-in-one pot, pan, dinner plate, and stove so its very flexible. You can use it over a fire or Coleman stove using its bale, or handle one meal when your at a camp site/rest stop, then use the stand and its alcohol stove in the wagon for the next when you gots to lay low. I use a bundeswehr utensils set instead of disposable utensils just to minimize the trash I generate.


5. Why the maintenance free battery when the other and adding you own water and monitoring it is so much cheaper?
Hydrogen. Having a maintenance free battery only means its abit heavier duty and sealed better then a conventional battery. It further minimizes (does not eliminate!) the chance that you'll have an explosion in the wagon due to wear and hydrogen build up. I'm not too keen on having a battery blow up in my wagon/wan while I'm making my ramen!

Thanks for all your time. Your blog is interesting.
Thanks!

 

[Simran]

I prefer the older vans but then I'm mechanical by nature. I bought my hi top for $1500 43,000 miles ago. I replaced the weather stripping right away. Mechanical stuff I've done:

1) Water pump
2) Brake master cylinder

Neither one of these repairs were $100.00. Right now it needs the AC fixed and it wouldn't hurt to put a rear seal in the transmission as it is leaking a bit.

This thing has been a real gem for a 1975 van!

I have a job and regular income coming in with money in the bank. I think it would behoove anyone to not have at least $1000.00 in the bank if possible. The key words here being "if possible". Not everyone can do that, and yes, more is better. Just learn to be a saver & thrifty shopper. Live within your means and save what it left after the necessities are purchased. I've been on the wrong end of the short stick; it ain't fun. Creativity is the rule of the day when in a situation like that.

 

[SoulRaven]

If I was down to my last 3K and had no job, I wouldn't buy a van. I'd get an older Toyota Camry station wagon with a 3S engine. Then I'd get a maintenance free deep cycle battery, a constant duty solenoid, wire, switch, a 600 watt inverter, spray glue, some black fabric, reflectix, Mylar sheets, LED dome light bulbs, a Coleman 533 stove and a Swedish Army stainless steel mess kit.

That totals under 2K. Then I'd hit the road!

Greetings!

Huh??? Why would you do that when you could get a van and outfit it to be comfortable for less money than that?

A cheap old van is as cheap as any other vehicle, and makes a much better living quarters. You can outfit one on the cheap for under $200-$300 and <b>BE COMFORTABLE</b>.

Then you would have a good comfortable home base, to figure out the solutions for your other problems.

I just don't quite follow your logic.

Cheers!

The CamperVan_Man

 

[Van-Tramp]

Agreed.

An old mini-van if you must also use it to commute or find work. I bought a mini van a few years back for $600, got all new tires ($300) and built up an interior for another $50 and was set. Mini van over a passenger car any day.

 

[SoulRaven]

Greetings!

I think if I was in a bad situation, I would spend every last dime on a van. Even an empty van would provide a roof over my head, and keep the wind out. That would give me a base to build upon as time and money allowed.

I have seen vans parked in one spot for a year or more, and if that was what I had to do, that is what I would do. You have to start somewhere, and at least a van would give you a good starting point, while being a useable shelter from day one.

Desperate times call for desperate measures, but wise choices can make your future goals easier to obtain.

With no skills, almost anyone, in almost any city, could find nearly instant work. If you are in a needy situation, people will create work for you to do, to earn a free meal, or money. So many people don't realize this. When I teach homeless people how to find work and support themselves, they are amazed at just how easy it really is, but they just never knew.

Cheers!

The CamperVan_Man

 

[66788]

I don't let high mileage deter me from considering a vehicle. I bought a 1993 Ford Aerostar van off Craigslist for $300.00 and it didn't run because of a stretched timing chain. The van had 202,000 miles on it and I put a new timing chain in it for less than $100.00 and that same van now has over 300,000 miles on it and is running fine.

My 1994 Buick Regal had 69,000 miles on it when I bought it and I recall thinking, if it makes it to 100,000 miles I'll have enough money saved for a new car by then. Years later the car had 260,000 miles on it when it was hit by a Fire Truck and totaled.

I look at how it runs at the moment and the condition of the suspension, engine, and transmission. If it appears fine, then I don't worry about it.

 

[steamjam1]

I just don't quite follow your logic.

I was approaching the hypothetical that I only had $3000 and no other income. Yes, Its true that you can buy a van as I did for $800, spend $300 on it and you have a good home base. You can also buy a 1990-ish Toyota Camry station wagon for $800-$1200 that's in presentable condition. A van is better, but there are a few drawbacks:

1.Gets bad MPG. I only get 15-16. A Camry would gets 28-30 and if you only have X amount to spend until who knows when you have income, stretching every penny becomes critical.

2. Its harder to hide in plain sight. A Camry station wagon would look completely innocuous no matter where you park. I would assume that I would haveto be as mobile as I could in an effort to find a job. If the job is 200 miles away in say a up-scale neighborhood, then you need a vehicle that can blend in up/down there as well as it does where you are now. In a van, you haveto be more selective on where you stay the night.

3. Vans are big, and boy it got chilly last night. My Mr. buddy heater is efficient, but not that efficient. It takes a bit to heat up my van. In a Camry, it would heat the insides much faster, and the cars original sound deadening and insulation keeps it warmer longer then my barely insulated passenger van. The less I haveto heat, the less propane I'd go through, thus the less $$ I haveto spend on fuel. No interior to build in the Camry. Just a few small containers that sit on the floor and there are side "pockets" built into the interior paneling for things.

4. Just because its cheap to buy, it doesn't mean its cheap to own. Let's say I bough a Camry Wagon instead of my van for the same money, and lets suppose I ran into the same problems with the Camry as I did in my Dodge when I moved into it. Of course I have no address at the moment, I'm stuck in a parking lot, so I need parts now. (No rockauto)

Smog pump = $78.00. Toyota has no smog pump.
Alternator = $150. Toyota $109.00
Brake pads and rotors = $102. Toyota $68
Alternator = $150. Toyota $109.00
Total = $480. Toyota = $268.

I just called my local Napa Auto and did a P/A and all the parts to the Toyota are in stock like they were for me van

I've gone 1500 miles since I started living in the van.
gas = approx 94 gallons @16mpg or $357 ($3.80 average gas price) Toyota = Approx 54 gallons @28mpg or $205. ($3.80 average gas price)

I agree. Its not ideal, a van is much more comfortable. I'm 6"2 and I can barely lay down in a Camry with the back seat folded down/removed, but it is doable. If I only had $3000 and no job, then the above makes sense. Yes, you van get a cheap 4cyl 1997-ish Dodge Caravan for about $1200, but they don't get as good a gas mileage, the engines don't have nearly the longevity as Toyota 3s, and the transmissions are utter garbage. I also can't lay down in one. I tried.

 

[Simran]

Steamjam1,
I like your reasoning!! I've often thought of using a station wagon. No headroom but the economy is there as is stealth; if you're so inclined. Station wagons have gone out of style with the onslaught of minivans to hit the market but Toyota, Ford, BMW, Volvo & Mercedes still make them. Up until Saturn went out of favor they made one too with a Honda drive train I believe; so there is another good, used option.
I used to have an old 1984 Olds Delta 88 diesel wagon that got 28 mpg. It was one of the better diesels of a horrible idea GM had. It was fun to camp in and when it got older I used it to haul nearly everything. If I had it today it would most certainly be sporting curtains in the back. I loved that car.

 

[Belinda2]

I have a Toyota. Bought it new. Never one problem in it's history. And now it's historic. Stealth. Stealth. Cheap parts. Stealth. The new one's of it's kind get XX mpg....mine is still getting that. Get it?

 

[wagoneer]

If you can get and older VW Passat TDI go for it

 

[steamjam1]

Another great wagon is the earlier 2wd Subaru Legacy wagon. Also cheap and plentiful in decent shape at about 1200.

 

[SoulRaven]

I just don't quite follow your logic.

I was approaching the hypothetical that I only had $3000 and no other income. Yes, Its true that you can buy a van as I did for $800, spend $300 on it and you have a good home base. You can also buy a 1990-ish Toyota Camry station wagon for $800-$1200 that's in presentable condition. A van is better, but there are a few drawbacks:

(trimmed)

Greetings!

Curtains or blacked out windows in a wagon would make it stand out big time...

You already have a van it sounds like. To make a long story short, to me it would be the difference between surviving & thriving. Your mental attitude would be different between living in a mini RV and a station wagon. Would your clothes be crumpled vs. presentable... Eating out vs. cooking your own meals could far outweigh any fuel savings.

Comfort is worth it's weight in gold, both physically & mentally.

A kerosene heater will solve your heating problems, or you could also use your campstove if you have one. Put a heat diffuser or an overturned clay flower pot over a burner and you will have adjustable heat.

Excuse me for being blunt here, but you say you're having a hard time finding work... WHY?!?!?!? Work is plentiful. A good temp agency can send you out on a job almost instantly. Just don't wait for a job you WANT, take what's available. I've done everything from dog sitting to driving an ice cream truck, to being a fill in RV salesman, to phone answerer, to customer service, janitor, you name it. If you are flexible, there's plenty of jobs. Staying a while, do temp agencies, just want work for a day, do the day labor places. If I'm feeling bored, I'll just walk into one and say I'm looking for non-skilled labor job, and I'm available right now. At least 8 times out of 10 they'll send you right out to somewhere that they don't have anybody else available for right then. If they don't have anything, then go to a different one. Some have very little work available, while others have more than they can find workers for. If they want to charge you a fee up front, walk away.

My business runs in spurts, I may go 3 or more months without a call, and I'm a workaholic, so that's what I do if I get bored, and it works. They'll teach you how to drive a forklift if that's what they need, or a loader, or you name it, and before long you're qualified for darn near anything.

It's the time of year when they're going to start needing ice cream truck drivers, it's a very fun job (I think), and the pay is good. I often cleared over $100 a day in just tips.

Carnival and Fair season is here, they need ride operators, game operators, food stand workers, you name it. Low pay usually but it can be fun.

Get yourself any old job to get yourself stable, then work on starting your own mobile business. I may be able to help you with some ideas for that if needed too.

We do live in the land of opportunity, most people just don't know how to take advantage of it. They don't teach important things like this in school, they're to busy teaching you to be a good corporate slave.

I deal with a lot of homeless people with my ministry work, and not one of them knows or understands how easy it is to get out of the gutter. If they did know, they would have never fallen so low.

Give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day, teach a man to fish, and he'll eat for a lifetime. Teach a man how to sell his fish, and he can provide for his family and they can thrive.

Between everybody here, there is a wealth of knowledge, and between us there is no reason that anybody should have to be struggling. Just the fact that you're here, proves that you have the ability to make money to support your lifestyle. Anybody that has an internet connection and can type can be getting paid to post ads for other people or businesses.

Tell me where you're at, I can probably send you a whole list of jobs.

Cheers!

The CamperVan_Man

 

[steamjam1]

The CamperVan_Man,
haha.. Its coo man. I never said I didn't have a job. I've been working full time for the same Railroad for 10 years. If it runs on steam I can drive it, if its made of metal I can weld it, if its got pistons I can fix it. If its got Windows ME on it I know why I'm laughing at.
.

It was just a hypothetical situation where if I was down to my last 3K and didn't have my job anymore, and didn't already live in a van, yet still have what I've learnt from living in my Dodge.

Yep I'd still buy a Camry Wagon.

BUT if I had to buy a van... Then I would buy the older Toyota mini-van (Pre Sienna) because its RWD and powered by a commonly found industrial 4YEC engine. Because of its industrial application (Primarily forklifts) CNG conversions are easy and bolt on.

 

[SoulRaven]

Greetings Steamjam!

I couldn't comment on your site, but your van looks fine, not out of place in that parking lot at all. Nice paint job too!

Like most other window vans, it is pretty much invisible. It gives people the illusion that there can be nothing out of the ordinary going on inside, because if there was they could see it.

Cheers!

The CamperVan_Man

---

Greetings All!

I'm tickled that that was a hypothetical situation, but hopefully my post might help others if they're struggling...

Nobody needs to struggle, between myself and others, if anybody needs help, please don't be bashful, we WANT to help.

Cheers!

The CamperVan_Man