Bike Home

[light trip]

Hey Vermint,

Yeah, at that price I don't see many being sold. Yes, I have a juggle hammock and a tent. I once bought a used slide-in truck camper for $500. I never had a pick-up to move it and lived in it for more then two years. I figured if I ever needed to move it I would rent a pick-up truck. But in the end I got my use out of it and gave it away for free.

I don't really think of a bicycle camper/trailer being practical for travel, I like my Pro Force jungle hammock for that. It would be okay maybe to move a short distance. But anything more like the slide-in camper, rent a pick-up.

What I really like about the idea of a bicycle camper is no registration fees or "real property" tax that some state charge. So no tag (lic plate). This is the same for a slide-in truck camper.

With my disability I'm pass the point of biking long distance, even if I was a younger man. There was a time I could cover more then 70 miles in a day. I also will probably lose my driver license some day due to my disability, so boondocking most likely won't be in my future.

But a small slide-in camper or bicycle camper that doesn't require a tag or property tax in a cheap RV park in the west near a WalMart would about as cheap as I could live if needed. With being disabled I would need to be near services. Some might consider renting a room in a home, but I rather be in a small camper. Plus you have your privacy. Even if I can't drive in the future, lots of people have trucks and pull vehicles you could pay to move.

For $5,000 or so you mention, I could buy a very nice slide-in camper, and maybe quad-cycle or mobility scooter.

You have good, valid points. I'm in a good place right now, but life can throw you a curve ball, so I try to think ahead.

 

[Willy]

Living in the USA, many states allow a person to have a small engine powering a bicycle without having to register/insure. Being disabled myself, if I were to live down in the US, I'd seriously look into some sort of bike/camper rig with an engine. Hell, I'm almost tempted to do it up here, despite the nasty weather, seeing as gas/insurance/maintenance costs near eat me alive. ..Willy.

 

[light trip]

Hey Willy,

You are absolutely correct. In fact there is a U.S. federal law here, HR 727 in case any one needs to look it up.

In part this is what it states:
Federal law says that an electrically driven bicycle is considered a "bicycle" and the laws of bicycles apply if:
o Electrically driven bicycle has less than 750 watt motor
o Functional pedals
o Max speed is less than 20mph
The Federal law shall supersede any State law or requirement with respect to low-speed electric bicycles. (The state must regulate the electric bicycle as a bicycle)

Some manufactures even recommend printing, laminating, and carrying the HR 727 federal law in case you're stopped by law enforcement.

So one of the problems I see when you really start to read into this is; state and local laws can't supersede federal, but when you look into the details state and local law can be more restrictive on electric bicycles.

I know this is splitting hairs, so hang in there with me on this because it's important. One town where you are riding may not have any law regarding electric bicycle. Now you cross into another town that has past a law that states electric bicycles can only have a 500 watt motor and have a top speed not more then 15 MPH.

Now just by riding your bicycle too far you've broken the law, and most likely the police know about the law. Why? Because the local city council wouldn't have past the law unless someone had caused a problem, and they want it enforced.

You may also think I'm taking this just a little too far. But I know for a fact that this happened in Utah for low powered gas scooters and electric bicycles. Odds are if you show the federal law to law enforcement, they will at least think you're prepared to defend yourself in court and let you on your way. Always better to be respectful and avoid escalation when possible.

I know this is a bit lengthy but there might be another solution and it comes under the Federal Americans Disability Act or ADA. I don't have a publication number but here's a link to the document:

http://www.ada.gov/opdmd.htm

This is written by the Department of Justice, Civil Rights Devision, so this could carry a lot of weight with law enforcement, and any court you might find yourself in if needed. It is four pages long, so go to the link to read the entire document.

In part, it states:
In recent years, some people with mobility disabilities have begun using less traditional mobility devices such as golf cars or Segways®. These devices are called "other power-driven mobility device" (OPDMD) in the rule. OPDMD is defined in the new rules as "any mobility device powered by batteries, fuel, or other engines... that is used by individuals with mobility disabilities
for the purpose of locomotion, including golf cars, electronic personal assistance mobility devices... such as the Segway® PT, or any mobility device designed to operate in areas without defined pedestrian routes, but that is not a wheelchair". When an OPDMD is being used by a person with a mobility disability, different rules apply under the ADA than when it is being used by a person without a disability

This document goes on to state under the title "Credible Assurance."

An entity that determines it can accommodate one or more types of OPDMDs in its facility is allowed to ask the person using the device to provide credible assurance that the device is used because of a disability. If the person presents a valid, State-issued disability parking placard or card or a State-issued proof of disability, that must be accepted as credible assurance on its face. If the person does not have this documentation, but states verbally that the OPDMD is being used because of a mobility disability, that also must be accepted as credible assurance, unless the person is observed doing something that contradicts the assurance.

So if you glazed over that, and I don't blame you if you did, here are the two very important points:

A person with disabilities has the right to determine what OPDMD he or she can use.
If you're disabled and stopped by anyone and can't prove or provide documentation that you are using an OPDMD for mobility, that person must take your word for it if you state it.

So... If you are using an electric bicycle because of your disability you may be covered under the law, even if local law states you can't operate the electric bicycle. And of course this would cover many other types of devices.

I can tell you that if I ever am stopped by L.E. my defense won't be it's a violation of the law. Instead this is allowed under the ADA. Local law enforcement can't know it all and may not understand. But I think local courts and cities will take notice if your defense is you are violating my Rights under the American Disabilities Act.

As a side note (as if this isn't long enough) an electric mobility scooter, even one that exceeds the speed and capabilities of electric bicycle might be more accepting to law enforcement, especially where laws have been past to restrict electric bicycles.

---

So my last post was soooo long I wanted to put this as a separate idea and get back to the original issue, bike home.

How about putting a pickup truck cab extension longways on a bicycle trailer. It would be a little heavy, but if the opening to the rear window cab was not cut out, it would be a pretty safe and secure place to sleep, with a low air profile.

 

[Willy]

There has been some discussion about 'grey areas' in Canadian legislation wherein a person who's disabled could claim that a gas powered bi/tricycle is, in fact, a powered wheelchair and thus not come under the classification of an ICE powered bicycle (illegal here).

Regardless of that, I'm rather enamored with recumbent trikes and would definitely prefer to have one that incorporates some sort of 'living area' vs. a trailer. ..Willy.

 

[light trip]

Agreed, due to my disability I can not ride a standard two-wheeled bicycle. A recumbent trike or quad would work.

I like the idea of a quad cycle. For one reason I could place a plastic, locking weather proof box on the rear. Keeps honest people honest. And I feel they're more stable. I also don't like missing a pothole only to have the third wheel hit it.

My current front runner is pedalcoupe.

http://www.pedalcoupe.com/

At four wheels it comes in at 57 pounds, 25.9 Kg for Canada and the rest of the world. And according to the website... "posi-traction control system, that gives unsurpassed traction on all surfaces by transferring power to both rear tires." Nice for snow or off road.

Of course there are electric quad cycles. But for the cost you can purchase the top of the line mobility scooter and have enough cash left over to to buy a Honda 1000 watt generator,,, you could charge the scooter batteries in the boonies. And you can still pocket some cash. I don't know what some electric bike manufactures are thinking.

More pluses are the acceptance of a mobility scooter by law enforcement and businesses. Then there's travel. If you purchase the correct size scooter they're permitted on buses, trains, and even some airplanes.

On the downside, I'm of the impression that a quad cycle is made better and would last longer then a mobility scooter. Also a quad cycle would be easier to repair.

But as much as I like the idea of human powered quad cycle, I would probably go with a good outdoor mobility scooter. I've notice that some are rated for heavier weight capacities, one would think suspension and bearings would hold up better on these scooters.

---

Correct photo

 

[Willy]

I prefer the delta trikes. Not too hard to build one either.

Just make the rear a bit longer and.. VIOLA!! ..Willy.

 

[mconlonx]

If y'all are thinking engines on bikes, go electric. The 49 and 60cc Chinese clip-on engines are not meant for continuous, reliable duty. They can be cantankerous and you should know your way around small engines, expect to be tinkering with them on a near constant basis. Electric assist probably doesn't have the range, but it's a more set it up and forget about it kind of experience.

 

[light trip]

Willy, I like the delta bike with the two wheels in the rear. I could put a lock box back there. Also seems to get you up a little higher, but hard to tell.


Mconlonx, I like to stay away from anything gas powered, it's just who I am. But thanks for the heads up. I worry that many mobility scooters are made in China and would be very skeptical of the quality. There are kits to convert bikes to electric here: http://www.ebikekit.com/. Again as with full electric bike, pricy. I can find electric mobility scooters for what these kits cost.

 

[Willy]

The nice thing about that kind of delta trike design is that it uses conventional bicycle wheels, with 'proper' dropouts, and they're relatively easy to build. Don't even need a conventional triangulated/box frame up front.. mono-tube would work just fine. DIY would allow you to, like I said, extend the rear section for hauling stuff. ..Willy.

 

[Varmint]

I've seen some of those three-wheeled "tadpole" bikes with two in front and one in rear. One appears to have been hand-made by the owner, and the frame was long enough to hold a footlocker-type box up front between the front wheels, as well as having saddlebags over the rear wheel. He even had a clear windscreen that was supported by fiberglass poles attached near the front wheels that bend backwards over his head, and some kind of elbow joint fashioned to drop straight behind his seat. It shaded him directly overhead, while allowing great visibility in front. I have a picture of it here, but I'm averse to re-posting someone else's pics without permission. Those that build or modify their own rigs can figure out such things for themselves. I'm just sharing an idea, and I wonder what it would take to fully enclose something like this with a lightweight shell.

While not viewed as a "home on wheels", it's rather easy to take a nap while seated in this, and dropping a bug screen over it would also be nice at night, although not as stealthy as a two-wheel bike and hammock.

 

[Willy]

Were it a tadpole design, I'd lengthen the frame behind the driver by a few feet an have storage there. Been thinking about front wheel drive w. rear wheel steer. With a longer wheelbase it shoud be more stable at speed and I'd look at some of the tech drawings for Buckminster Fuller's Dymaxion car for proper steering geometry.

 

[AltTransBikes]

If y'all are thinking engines on bikes, go electric. The 49 and 60cc Chinese clip-on engines are not meant for continuous, reliable duty. They can be cantankerous and you should know your way around small engines, expect to be tinkering with them on a near constant basis. Electric assist probably doesn't have the range, but it's a more set it up and forget about it kind of experience.

Stay away from the China kit engines. However a quality 4 stroke ICE such as those from Honda or Subaru is a completely different story. I've built over 75 MABs for customers, some have over 10K miles on them. One rode from the east coast to Denver and back, another rode route US 1 from Maine to Florida.

Ebikes can be good for certain applications but, at the moment at least with available battery chemistry, also suffer severe drawbacks of price, weight and range. I can build an ICE powered MAB at half the cost, near half the weight and with practically unlimited range.

 

[light trip]

AltTransBikes,

Riding a gas powered bicycle from the east coast to Denver, did you ever have a problem with law enforcement? When did you do this? I read a story about a guy who went Durham, N.C. to pickup an Organic Transit "Elf" and road it home to New York or Boston. The Elf is a partly enclose electric and very pricy tricycle with solar.

So people are doing this.

 

[AltTransBikes]

AltTransBikes,

Riding a gas powered bicycle from the east coast to Denver, did you ever have a problem with law enforcement? When did you do this? I read a story about a guy who went Durham, N.C. to pickup an Organic Transit "Elf" and road it home to New York or Boston. The Elf is a partly enclose electric and very pricy tricycle with solar.

So people are doing this.

Sorry, it's summer and I don't find much time on the forums at this time of year. Indeed, people are doing this.

The trips I mentioned above were not me but customers I built bikes for. Both were legally registered in our home state and neither mentioned any issues with LE other than good natured curiosity.

The PBS story on the ELF (if that's the one you read) talks about a couple of guys who rode back from NC. One I do not know, lives in the eastern part of the state, but the other lives in the next town from me and I've visited with him on occasion. The enclosed ELF actually falls into a different vehicle class here, LUV (limited use vehicle). LUVs must be registered, titled, insured, and inspected (and emissions if liquid fueled),
while motorized bikes require none of that other than a moped sticker ($20@year).

But yes, people are doing this. I have many contacts in the MAB (motor assisted bicycle) world who have been doing this for some time now. Good aquaintance Paul Crabtree aka Bamabikeguy (RIP) rode his MAB from his home in Alabama through-out much of the US, east and west. AugieDog, another MABer known for the long ride rode from Washington state to Alaska, back to WA, then Idaho and Oregon. Augi lived on his MAB pulling a single wheel trailer.

My forays include a trip earlier this summer from my home to Bar Harbor Maine, a relatively mild trip of only 800 miles ;-)

 

[akrvbob]

I'm assuming the picture is your bike. Can you describe it for us and tell us it's cost.

I tried an electric bike and I loved that I could charge it off my solar so it was free powered transportation, but my knees just aren't going to let me pedal as much as it needed.

I have a friend with the cheap Chinese 49cc motor and he really likes it but it does take constant tinkering which is fun for him. It's not fun for me so I won't do it.

I've considered the Honda powered ones but it seems really expensive. How much can I get into a Honda powered bike all set up ready to ride?
Bob

 

[jeanontheroad]

I'd hate to have to pedal one through the Rockies.

 

[Willy]

The 4 cycle Huasheng bike engines seem to be rather highly regarded.. and a lot cheaper. ..Willy.

 

[66788]

OK....you guys wanna see a cool USEABLE/PRACTICAL bicycle camper???<BR><BR><BR><IMG class=bbc_img src="http://bikeportland.org/wp-content/motorhomebikeFullView.jpg" rel="lightbox"><BR><BR>My wife and I met this fellow in Ashland about 10-15 years ago. Very intellegent man. <BR>He lived in this rig. It was pretty complete with a useable kitchen configuration, and sleeping quarters.<BR><BR>The pedals did NOT power the bike....they ran a generator which in turn, powered the bike. We saw him climbing a pretty good size hill and he wasn't working any harder then he did when going down a flat road. He aslo had solar panels which helped I'm sure too!<BR><BR>Very interesting guy to talk to, and I was so glad we circled around to go back and chat with him.<BR><BR><BR>Unfortunately...(and this is the part that you don't wanna hear about)....<BR><BR>In a frustrated/depressed fit, he demolished it!!! <IMG class="emoticon bbc_img" title="Eek - " src="/images/boards/smilies/eek.gif"><BR><BR>there's quite a bit here about him &amp; his bike... <A href="http://bikeportland.org/tag/brian-campbell-motorhome-bike" rel=nofollow target=_blank>http://bikeportland.org/tag/brian-campbell-motorhome-bike</A>

That happens when you live in a green house. Cooked his brain...