Being Undetected

[WinterSmith]

Hi,<br><br>I read a lot about people who are discovered by the cops sleeping in their vans. I am curious how these people get caught. I mean, there are a zillion vans on the road, and I've never seen a cop at night stop to check out a specific one. Is it b/c they are the RV like vans, is it b/c neighbors notice a new vehicle on the street and call the cops, or is it b/c the windows might steam up on a cold night?<br><br>In the state where I live, all of the side and back windows may have very dark tinting. If someone were to do this on a regular size van and put a dark curtain partition between the cab and back part, I don't see how a cop would even notice anything out of the ordinary.<br><br>Am I missing something?<br><br>Thanks,<br>Wintersmith<br><br><br>

 

[She]

Somehow I think cops or anyone in that matter would see the curtains and think someone is in there. I know I would. Its sort of like a cat who thinks he is hiding but the tail sticks out. So its not what they can't see but the clues leading to it. Certainly steam on the window&nbsp;doesn't&nbsp;help or nosey neighbors. But sometimes cops know the area so well that they know when a new van just shows up. My plan is to bring the van around a lot before I start sleeping in spots around town here,so I think I'll blend in better.

 

[WinterSmith]

I would think he'd have to be a Columbo or Monk to be able to detect a black curtain in a van with very dark tinted side and rear windows at night. <br><br>But maybe I'm wrong : I mean, after all, cops are very observant. Did you ever notice how they always pick out the donuts with the most sprinkles? ;&gt<img src="/images/boards/smilies/wink.gif" border="0" align="absmiddle"><br>

 

[WinterSmith]

I do think you're right though about cops noticing new vehicles, esp if you are doing something that tips them off that you live in a van (and then they see the van later at night). I'm considering sleeping near the place where I live now (and where I frequently parked on the street). <br><br>I recently saw an ad for parking space in a fenced in lot for real cheap. That may be better. Like that credit card ad. "Rent for parking space: $25 a month, price of not getting caught: priceless." Ah, the fun of exploration.<br><br>Thanks for the tips,<br><br>WS<br><br>

 

[Ricekila]

I would think ( it hurts my head <IMG src="https://vanlivingforum.com/images/boards/smilies/rolleyes.gif" align=absMiddle border=0>&nbsp<img src="/images/boards/smilies/wink.gif" border="0" align="absmiddle"> <br><br>Blacked out windows - Work truck / van = tools <IMG src="https://vanlivingforum.com/images/boards/smilies/wink.gif" align=absMiddle border=0>&nbsp;<br><br>Blacked out windows - Passenger van = van dweller <IMG src="https://vanlivingforum.com/images/boards/smilies/eek.gif" align=absMiddle border=0><br>( what are they up to -- lets look shall we <IMG src="https://vanlivingforum.com/images/boards/smilies/mad.gif" align=absMiddle border=0>&nbsp<img src="/images/boards/smilies/wink.gif" border="0" align="absmiddle"><br><br>Plus it has a lot to do where you park too <IMG src="https://vanlivingforum.com/images/boards/smilies/thumb.gif" align=absMiddle border=0><br>

 

[stude53]

<p style="margin: 0px;">Wintersmith,</p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;">I asked a similar question earlier and got some interesting answers:</p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;"><a href="https://vanlivingforum.com/post/What-makes-good-stealth-5653279" target=_blank>https://vanlivingforum.com/post/What-makes-good-stealth-5653279</a></p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;">Good luck and Godspeed,</p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;">Bob</p>

 

[VanTrekker]

<p style="margin: 0px;">Good points, Ricekilla.&nbsp; With a work van with no windows on the sides and blacked out back windows burglaries are a worry.&nbsp; That's why the spot of preference is Walmart - no hassles from cops,&nbsp;more visibility, plus I don't have to crap in the bucket that way.&nbsp;&nbsp; <img src="/images/boards/smilies/smile.gif" border="0" align="absmiddle"></p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;">Remember the "location, location, location" saying?&nbsp; It's&nbsp;very important&nbsp;when trying to stealth camp - just as important as what you camp in.&nbsp; Even a slightly less discreet vehicle is more likely to be incognito if parked in the right place.&nbsp; When out of town, I try to chose a spot as early as possible and arrive late.</p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;">If I was camping mostly as stealth, a minivan with a soccer mom decal or "My kid is an honor&nbsp;student" sticker would be preferred.&nbsp; Dark windows on one of those vehicles wouldn't be too unusual.</p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;">Here is my biggest fear when camping:</p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;"><img border="0" hspace="0" alt="" align="baseline" src="http://heddalettuce.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/Mrs-kravitz-bewitched-300x232.jpg"></p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;"><font size="1">"Abner!&nbsp; Someone is sleeping in a van in front of the Stevens house!"</font></p><p style="margin: 0px;"><font size="1"></font>&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;"><font size="1"></font>&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p>

 

[WinterSmith]

Love the sticker/decal idea. Post an "honor student" decal on one side and a "DARE sticker" (or a "I support local police" like sticker) on the other end and you'll blend right in.<br><br>FWIW, in the neck of the woods in which I live, very dark tint is pretty common (and I don't even live down South, go figure), so I doubt that will raise any suspicion in and of itself. Tint is pretty cheap (&lt;$200 in these parts for a good job on both rear and side windows), so I think it is probably a pretty sound investment.<br><br>Will check out the previous thread suggested too (in my spare time, haha).<br><br>Thanks!<br>Wintersmith<br>

 

[Ricekila]

How about -- "My juvenile delinquent beat up your honor student and took his lunch money" <IMG src="https://vanlivingforum.com/images/boards/smilies/eek.gif" align=absMiddle border=0><br><br>But now -- hes a D/I at Ft. Brag teaching the fine art of "Body Bombing" <IMG src="https://vanlivingforum.com/images/boards/smilies/thumb.gif" align=absMiddle border=0><br>

 

[She]

I would think he'd have to be a Columbo or Monk to be able to detect a black curtain in a van with very dark tinted side and rear windows at night. <br><br>But maybe I'm wrong : I mean, after all, cops are very observant. Did you ever notice how they always pick out the donuts with the most sprinkles? ;&gt;<img src="/images/boards/smilies/wink.gif" border="0" align="absmiddle"><br>

<div>LOL yeah in between their buddy talks..in the middle of the street</div>

 

[SoulRaven]

never underestamate a beat cop for any city, they know their town and notice anything out of the ordinary... it is best to be up front and honest, if he asks you to move along ask him where it is safe and sound, chances are he will show you a good place if you are upfront and honest... remember you are not a criminal, just a person trying to get some rest... it is all part of vandwelling, just play the game or head to the nearest NF to camp...<br>

 

[Guest]

I totally agree with Steve on this. If you are sneaking around you are far more suspicious than someone who is just upfront about it.<br>In my little town if a LEO sees you parking on the street to sleep and it catches their eye enough to wake you up and tell you to move, they direct you to one of the dirt areas where it is ok to park for the night<br><br>We have put up the resources for that on here in several threads. I have them all bookmarked in my computer. If you research that a bit you will find boondocking websites and freecampsites.net, etc.<br><br>We had a member of Yahoo Vandwellers forum who traveled the entire US for three years by herself in a Class C motorhome and almost never stayed in a campground or RV&nbsp; park. She stayed in parking lots everywhere she went and was never bothered once in the 3 years.<br><br>I think it is easy to get paranoid about how much you will be bothered while vandwelling.<br><br>In all the many years of my vehicle camping, traveling and living in the US, Canada, Mexico, Belize and Guatemala, I have only been woken once by a LEO and it was in Texas in a truck stop where I had asked and gotten permission to stay the night....go figger! Actually it kinda made sense and he was just being cautious which served to make me actually feel more secure. This truck stop was very remote and had two women only working the night shift...the women I had asked had gone off shift and forgotten to tell the next two I was there. I had out of state license plates and the cop did the right thing.<br><br>The lesson for me was that when he knocked and asked me to "open up, it's the police!" or whatever he said, he woke me from a dead sleep and I actually opened the door. Stupid, I know now. It was a cheap lesson and I will never open the door until I look and see if they have ID to show me.<br><br>Bri<br>

 

[Seraphim]

<p style="margin: 0px;">

I think it is easy to get paranoid about how much you will be bothered while vandwelling.<br><br>

</p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;">I agree; and people stereotype cops just as badly as they stereotype vandwellers. The small percentage of rotten apples make the whole barrel look bad.</p>

 

[sl1966]

Bri, I think your browser is stuttering. I see your reply 4x.<div><br></div>

 

[twokniveskatie]

Hiccups, it was. Fixing that now. Brian and the post button have history it will submit, by golly!

 

[twokniveskatie]

I agree with Bri that Steve is right-on with his post.&nbsp;<div><br></div><div>The only time I was ever approached in a Walmart parking lot was in Yuma Az, which is clearly posted "no overnight parking". I got rousted at about 4 am by a guard who called Mutt a viscious mongrel. The irony is that I fell asleep near the front entrance the night before while waiting for rotisserie chickens to finish cooking. I hadn't shut the windows or pulled the curtains or even locked the door. It was unpleasant, but totally my fault. I drove to the algodones border crossing where I got in trouble with the border patrol for feeding wild dogs. Actually, he was a little upset when he saw me hiding something under the front seat as he approached. It was cookies. Can't say I blamed him, ya know?</div><div><br></div><div>Anyhow, I had a thought while reading this thread. Sh!t happens in parking lots. To assume that we are being harassed when a LEO knocks on our door is premature. How do we know something isn't going down, and they are looking for a bad Chappie, as Bri would say. A good reminder, Seraphim, that prejudices run in all directions. .....</div><div><br></div><div><br></div>

 

[Guest]

Oops,oops, oops,oops and I am happy Katies got my back....thank you Steve and Katie.....<br>Bri<br>

 

[Seraphim]

<p style="margin: 0px;">

I mean, after all, cops are very observant. Did you ever notice how they always pick out the donuts with the most sprinkles? ;&gt;<img border="0" align="absmiddle" src="https://vanlivingforum.com/images/boards/smilies/wink.gif"><br><br>

</p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;">You're behind the times: bagels are the new donut...</p>

 

[Seraphim]

<p style="margin: 0px;">

I am curious how these people get caught. I mean, there are a zillion vans on the road, and I've never seen a cop at night stop to check out a specific one.<br>

</p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;">An officer gets to know the area he works, and notices things which are out of the ordinary. A parked van with curtains does not mean someone's sleeping inside: that's an assumption and assumptions can get you hurt. An officer's safety is always foremost in their minds. Or should be.</p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;">If you are operating a vehicle you are required to respond and produce a driver's license. If there is an emergency and you are given an instruction for safety's sake, you are required to follow instructions. Else no, there is no requirement to respond unless he informs you you are under arrest, then you are required to cooperate with your arrest. He will have to prove the charges in court.</p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;">If you don't answer the knock on your door, and the property owner wants the car gone, you might find yourself inside a vehicle getting lifted by the tow truck, and responsible for the tow bill. If you answer, and the officer finds himself dealing with honest responses,, and finding no criminal activity (other than a possible tresspassing) the most is you will probably be told to leave. </p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;">I say probably: there are jerks in all walks of life.</p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p><p style="margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</p>

 

[WinterSmith]

FWIW, I agree with you. If the windows have curtains and there is no noise or motion in the van, a cop cannot know you are in the vehicle (although the noise and motion part can be a big IF when you are woke unexpectedly). You are obviously not doing anything illegal just sitting quietly in a van, and I doubt they are going to take it further. If a cop would break in, you can always claim you are a sound sleeper. Most cops just want to know that you're not doing anything bad, and there's not going to be any trouble on their watch. <br>The hard part though, as your story indicates, is how to distinguish the bad visitor from the good one. Another person coming out of a heavy sleep and somewhat&nbsp; disoriented and scared might have put a bullet through Chief Wiggim. What would you have done if they broke the window: shot them, fired a warning shot, said "I have a gun"?<br>