400A Fuses: Please tell me what to get

[BradKW]

I've pretty much settled on a GoPower 3k inverter, which seems to want a 400amp fuse. Ok. But the $72 sticker on their https://www.amazon.com/Go-Power-FBL...00153CXKQ/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8  made me start looking if there's other options. 

I found a Blue Sea https://www.amazon.com/Blue-Sea-Sys...?s=lamps-light&ie=UTF8&qid=1467081261&sr=1-12  for half the price.  But it's listed as a 225 to 400 amp fuse. I don't comprehend how a fuse can have that sort of range?  It's also seems to be a fast blow, whereas the GoPower one is slow blow...?

Certainly open to other options too...

 

[highdesertranger]

the Blue Sea doesn't come with a fuse. the block is rated from 225 to 400A. you chose a fuse in that range. the other one comes with a fuse. I like Blue Sea top of the line stuff. highdesertranger

 

[BradKW]

the Blue Sea doesn't come with a fuse.  the block is rated from 225 to 400A.  you chose a fuse in that range.  the other one comes with a fuse.  I like Blue Sea top of the line stuff.  highdesertranger

Thanks, that makes sense...so they are about same price with fuse.

Could you address the fast vs slow blow fuse? The GoPower one is "slow" and the one BlueSea 400A I see is "fast"  https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000MMH1JO/ref=pd_luc_rh_bxgy_01_01_t_img_lh?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1

 

[highdesertranger]

I didn't see were the GoPower was slow blow. I am no expert in this area but I would think you would want a fast blow. another thing the GoPower uses set screws to attach the wires. the Blue Sea uses lugs. lugs are a much better way to terminate the wires if you have good ring terminal crimps. set screws will come loose. highdesertranger

 

[akrvbob]

I use ANL fuses like this:
http://amzn.to/28Xb9dk

You'll need a ANL fuse holder also from Amazon
http://amzn.to/292n7XC

Bob

 

[SternWake]

I have not really studied up on these different types of fuses yet, and am no authority on this topic.

Much of Blue Seas electrical offerings in the fuse department are relabelled Bussman or Marineco products, which might be found cheaper under those monikers.

I really like this fuse which goes right on the battery terminal:

https://www.amazon.com/Blue-Sea-Sys..._SR160,160_&psc=1&refRID=XV9HP05F8T6C7T2JARVK

But the fuses only goto 300 amps, not 400.

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

Slow Blow fuses are for equipment like motors and compressors, where the initial starting current is much higher than the running current.  You've got to overcome the inertia.

I have the Blue Sea printed catalog.  There is more to fuses than just amperage and slow vs fast blow.  There is also something called Interrupting Capacity.

You know that a high enough voltage can jump an air gap - we see this on spark plugs - and keep right on flowing.  The ANL fuses such as Bob uses has an Interrupting Capacity of 6,000 volts.

Class T fuses have an Interrupting Capacity of 20,000 volts.

The print catalog has a short section on ANL Fuses vs Class T fuses.  They specifically say that the Class T Fuses have:

"Very fast response to short circuits protects high amperage electronic equipment such as inverters."

Part number for a Blue Sea 400 amp Class T is 5121.  It needs a Blue Sea 5502 Class T Fuse Block.

Btw, before you spend any money on a Go Power Inverter, I suggest you read Handy Bob's rantings on the subject:

https://handybobsolar.wordpress.com/inverter-issues-spring-2013/

In fact, if you're not familiar with his site, you should read all his stuff.

 

[BradKW]

Slow Blow fuses are for equipment like motors and compressors, where the initial starting current is much higher than the running current.  You've got to overcome the inertia.

I have the Blue Sea printed catalog.  There is more to fuses than just amperage and slow vs fast blow.  There is also something called Interrupting Capacity.

You know that a high enough voltage can jump an air gap - we see this on spark plugs - and keep right on flowing.  The ANL fuses such as Bob uses has an Interrupting Capacity of 6,000 volts.

Class T fuses have an Interrupting Capacity of 20,000 volts.

The print catalog has a short section on ANL Fuses vs Class T fuses.  They specifically say that the Class T Fuses have:

"Very fast response to short circuits protects high amperage electronic equipment such as inverters."

Part number for a Blue Sea 400 amp Class T is 5121.  It needs a Blue Sea 5502 Class T Fuse Block.

Btw, before you spend any money on a Go Power Inverter, I suggest you read Handy Bob's rantings on the subject:

https://handybobsolar.wordpress.com/inverter-issues-spring-2013/

In fact, if you're not familiar with his site, you should read all his stuff.

Thank you, just added to the cart and understand why I'm buying it now  

I came across Handybob a while ago and found him persuasive...and a bit nutty. In fact, I started a poll here to ask if he was crazed or knew his stuff:  https://vanlivingforum.com/Thread-Debunking-Solar-Myths. The only negative he has about GoPower inverters is he says: " Their inverters shut down at 15V" ...I'm not sure how that's a problem in the system I'm putting together?

Anyway, he's certainly part of the reason I had my system planned out with Magnum and Morningstar components at the core. Unfortunately that's just not working out for two reasons: 1) Morningstar doesn't make a charge Controller large enough for 1kw of panels, and 2) Magnum becomes much too pricey...initially I was willing to drop around $1k for the 800W Magnum, but as needs have grown, I'm not willing to spend $2200+.

While I wasn't willing to go earn an EE degree to competently choose an inverter, I researched them enough over the past year to feel confident that there is such thing as a "middle ground". I'm basically going with the GoPower because so many people have had positive results using it in a mobile setting for multiple years, and because the customer service is based in the States and by all accounts is proactive and friendly.

Haven't pressed "buy" yet, still adding to cart, and still open to suggestions...

 

[Optimistic Paranoid]

" Their inverters shut down at 15V" ...I'm not sure how that's a problem in the system I'm putting together?

All inverters have built in safety circuitry to shut down if the dc input voltage is either too high or too low.  On most inverters, the high cut-off is 15 volts, but on a few of them it's 16.5 volts.

Handy Bob believes that the 15 volt inverters were designed to be - what he calls - "trucker's inverters" and he thinks that inverters on solar panel systems need to be the higher voltage.  The problem is that under SOME conditions - cool or cold air temperatures, very clear skies, etc. the output from the system can exceed 15 volts and the inverter will refuse to run.  Obviously, this doesn't happen all the time, but Handy Bob HAS seen it happen at times, especially at higher elevations.  So instead of being able to run the inverter off the panels, you have to choose between charging the batteries and no inverter or shutting off the solar and running the inverter off the batteries. 

Take a look at the Samlex PST-3000-12 inverter.  Great brand with a good reputation, 3000 watts, pure sine wave, 16.5 volt high cut off, and Amazon has it for under a grand.

https://www.amazon.com/Samlex-PST-3...id=1467125107&sr=8-1&keywords=Samlex+pst+3000

I myself bought the Samlex PST-2000-12 inverter.  I haven't tried it yet, though.  Like you, I'm still in the middle of my build.  Plan to be on the road before the snow flies next winter.

Btw, if you need a transfer switch, take a look at Sterling Power:

http://www.sterling-power-usa.com/m...rsourcesareusedsuchasinvertersshorepower.aspx

 

[flying kurbmaster]

have you considered having two controllers and running two separate banks, I saw a youtube on this and the guy did it this way so he never had a total failure. made sense to me, he also said that buying two smaller mppts was cheaper then buying a big controller that could handle his total wattage. He also mentioned something called a desulfication or something like that, this he claimed would prolong the life of his batteries.

 

[BradKW]

Take a look at the Samlex PST-3000-12 inverter.  Great brand with a good reputation, 3000 watts, pure sine wave, 16.5 volt high cut off, and Amazon has it for under a grand.

https://www.amazon.com/Samlex-PST-3...id=1467125107&sr=8-1&keywords=Samlex+pst+3000

Can you find a idle power draw number? It's odd that with all the specs Samlex gives, and I just read through most of the actual manual as well, that it doesn't list the idle power draw.

It says "less that 1A idle" in generic description...that's all I can find.  So...0.99A would definitely be on the high side for a 3k unit I think?

 

[AngryVanMan]

The 12V Samlex model PST-3000-12 does list a no load current of 1.6A (19.2W), that's fairly typical of an inverter that size.  The <1.0A idle is for the 24V model.

The higher end Samlex SA-3000K-112 has a "Search" mode that makes it more efficient when it is powered on, but there are no AC loads.  Most high end units have this, and it can usually be disabled as it does not work with all load types.  So in search mode "off", it uses 0.55A (6.6W) , and no load "on" uses 3.0A (36W).

The Magnum brand inverters for comparison, seem to list 5-7W in search mode, and 25-30 watts in no load, but fully "on" in their spec sheet.   Pretty comparable.