Which is cheaper, staying put in Virginia, ID for the winter or heading 800mi south?

[debit.servus]

Vandweller A desires to be in a different biome for the winter to enjoy pleasant tempetures all 12 months out of the year. He travels 800 miles south for the winter and travels 800 miles back to Virginia, ID for the summer. Because he enjoys warm days during the winter, he doesn't need to much heat. Each year, he moves 787 miles twice a year between Phoenix, AZ and Virginia, ID. Vandweller A LIVES LIFE TO THE FULLEST.

Vandweller B stays put and spends the winter in Virginia, he wants to be comfortable in a 68 degree van. Vandweller B thinks he is saving the big bucks not snowbirding, even with the Mr. Buddy burning propane at least 18 hours a day for those four-to-six months out of the year. So factor the cost of propane to run a Mr Buddy using average winter temperature in Virginia with a 15% cushion increase for potential downward cold fluctuation. Vandweller Bs life radius is less than 50 miles if that helps with the cost calculation. Vandweller B is a SAVINGS EXPERIMENT.

Vandweller A & B have identical regular top, regular cab vans that get 10 MPG highway. They both have decent insulation, and ventalation. Both vandweller A & C have identical cravings and health, with necesseties and insurances equal. Both have a 4000/9000BTU Mr Buddy propane heater and use them to keep their vans between 68-72 degrees F. 


So who is cheaper, Vandweller A or Vandweller B? We are comparing the costs to keep warm and comfortable between Vandweller A & C. I believe that it's cheaper to snowbird 1600 miles than to stay put in the Mountain West winter. I believe it's cheaper due to the high cost of propane in the winter.


787 miles From Phoenix, AZ to Virginia, ID (You can pretend you're in Virginia state in Virginia, ID and be a good little ecoslave not travelling 2200 miles to Virginia state) http://www.distancebetweencities.net/phoenix_az_and_virginia_id/route.

 

[SoulRaven]

I think your scenario is skewed to provide the answers you want...

A) Who's going to spend 18 hours a day, every day, in a van?  12 hours per day if you include sleeping time would probably be more accurate.  PLUS, many people don't run the heat while they're sleeping, so now you're down to 4 hours a day for average heating costs.

B) If it's a window van, many days won't require added heat if the suns out.

C) Buddy heater is a poor choice, because once the van is up to temp, it will need  to be cycled on and off to hold the temperature from getting too hot.  A camp stove would be a better choice because it can be set to a lower temperature, and will use less fuel, while maintaining a more consistent temperature level.

D) You need to consider other heating choices as well,  to determine the cheapest form of heating.  My generator could run 2 x 1500 watt electric heaters for 8 hours on a gallon of gas.  My small kerosene heater, or my kerosene camp stove will easily do over 24 hours straight on a single gallon of kerosene.  14 gallons of kerosene will provide me with 9+ months of heating and cooking in colder temperatures than Virginia, ID.  14 x $2.50/gal = $35.00

So, 787 miles x 2 (round trip) = 1574 miles / 10 mpg = 157 gallons of gas@ $2.00/gal = $314.00  vs. $35.00 with my setup.  Gas would need to be under 50¢/gal before you could even come close.

Buddy heater @ 4 hours per day = ~1# propane per day  = 4 days per gallon of propane @ $4.00/gal = $1.00/day in propane.  $1 a day x 6 months = $180.00, still cheaper than driving @ $2/gallon gas.

I don't see snowbirding as saving any money if you have an efficient setup.  But if you're doing it for better weather to make your life more enjoyable, then the added expense could still be money well spent.

 

[highdesertranger]

is this that new math they are talking about? my brain is burning again. highdesertranger

 

[jimindenver]

I would also not assume it will be warm and you will not need heat down south. The year I started designing the final solar system it was coolish and cloudy that winter.

 

[SaltySeaWitch]

is this that new math they are talking about?  my brain is burning again.  highdesertranger

If a train A leaves the station ....... whew! my brain hurts too! I'm a word person not a math person.

 

[Spirituallifetime]

New math:

Vandweller A: A x C + Y = Vandweller A meets new people sees new places and is enjoying life.

Vandweller B: X ÷ B × A = Vandweller B has a cold miserable winter stuck in the same place working the same old job B doesn't like.

 

[SoulRaven]

New math:

Vandweller A:  A x C + Y = Vandweller A meets new people sees new places and is enjoying life.

Vandweller B:  X ÷ B × A = Vandweller B has a cold miserable winter stuck in the same place working the same old job B doesn't like.

Or Vandweller B keeps the high paying job he loves, and spends his off time hunting, fishing, skiing, etc; doing everything included in his dream life.

Vandweller A quits that same high paying job and heads south, and proceeds to break down where the winters are worse than where he just left.  Repairs & motels eat up his savings, and he runs up a bunch of credit cards before he arrives in Phoenix.  He's forced to take a minimum wage job that he HATES, and he's too tired during his time off to enjoy doing anything.  Hot weather rolls in, and he is still trapped and broke in Phoenix.  When he does finally get back up north, all of the decent paying jobs are taken, and he has to travel to a bigger city only to get another minimum wage job he HATES, and wishes he would have never left in the first place.

The moral of this story is that if you have a good paying job, you should stay put until you can line up something better and have it waiting for you at your desired destination, or have big bucks saved up, because your dream can turn into a nightmare in a heartbeat if you're not properly prepared.

 

[jimindenver]

Some people do well with the throw a sleeping bag in the van and take off. some people plan for everything they think is possible only to find they considered the wrong possibilities. Some just have no luck no matter what they do.

I think before I pulled up roots for good that I would want to take a vacation to see if the life style fit me.

 

[johnny b]

Looks like the "Common Core" style of word math,

Bob closed the last one at page 2.......Deja Vu?

https://vanlivingforum.com/Thread-W...les-or-staying-put-with-generator-powered-A-C

 

[debit.servus]

I was thinking of calling this thread: EASY WAY to SAVE A FEW BUCKS VANDWELLING.

 

[GotSmart]

I was thinking of calling this thread: EASY WAY to SAVE A FEW BUCKS VANDWELLING.

SAVE THE FEW BUCK TURKEYS!

18 years of academia and my brain just went as radioactive at that!

 

[Spirituallifetime]

I was thinking of calling this thread: EASY WAY to SAVE A FEW BUCKS VANDWELLING.

Vandweller A or B will be saving a lot of money either way, B will save more money living in one place and working a good paying job. Paying rent or owning a home takes a lot of money, so vandwelling is a great way to save money. Where I'm at now rent is $1000 per month! Just be careful not eat your saings at Mcdonalds or any of the other fast food place's.

 

[myke]

I think the cost difference would be negligible.

Just go where you want to be...

 

[USExplorer]

Many of us give up luxuries and live out of cars and vans for the express purpose of traveling and living in a wide range of places. Places that suit our mood, whether we desire wild rugged forests or open desert plains or bucolic little towns or bustling cities. If you are going to stay in one place for a year why not get a singlewide and a moped or rent a room? Paying thousands of dollars for a propulsion system under your house that is never used is rather pointless. Unless of course you are too poor to pay for gas, but in that case you are not living minimally, you are stuck.

 

[SoulRaven]

Many of us give up luxuries and live out of cars and vans for the express purpose of traveling and living in a wide range of places. Places that suit our mood, whether we desire wild rugged forests or open desert plains or bucolic little towns or bustling cities. If you are going to stay in one place for a year why not get a singlewide and a moped or rent a room? Paying thousands of dollars for a propulsion system under your house that is never used is rather pointless. Unless of course you are too poor to pay for gas, but in that case you are not living minimally, you are stuck.

Some of us find that we can have as much or more luxury living in a van, than we could achieve any other way.  The fact that our homes happen to be on wheels is just an added bonus.

Living on wheels should never be about giving up luxuries or comfort, it should be about expanding them.

Just like in all other aspects of life, as van dwellers we are continually being bombarded to buy products or follow ideas that will never pay for themselves or improve our lives.  We need to remain aware of that fact, and act appropriately.

Since retirement, I usually stay in towns for months or less rather than years.  Sometimes where it is either very cold, or very hot, or very wet, or snowy, or icy.  Regardless of the length of time I'm staying, or the weather, there is no place more comfortable or convenient than my van, and I would still be using it for transportation, so it would seem counterproductive to pay for a secondary place to stay, or a secondary mode of transportation.

Among my MANY luxuries, are the luxury of not paying rent/mortgage, utility bills, or property taxes & upkeep... (okay, I do pay property taxes and upkeep for my off grid cabin, but that's a little different)

 

[debit.servus]

I think the cost difference would be negligible.

Just go where you want to be...

I can save over $1500 not going to EDC Las Vegas this year and visiting relatives in CANADA this year. Am I going to? HELL NO, as two months on the road this summer is living not existing.

... If you are going to stay in one place for a year why not get a singlewide and a moped or rent a room?

Paying thousands of dollars for a propulsion system under your house that is never used is rather pointless.

Unless of course you are too poor to pay for gas, but in that case you are not living minimally, you are stuck.

Because the rent is too high! Besides I can rent a spot with an extension cord for $100 a month through means I won't tell you about (social connections)!

Well yeah but how else could I live on $500 a month?

USExplorer, Isn't being too poor to fuel the van and thus being stuck part of the adventure?

...
Living on wheels should never be about giving up luxuries or comfort, it should be about expanding them.

Just like in all other aspects of life, as van dwellers we are continually being bombarded to buy products or follow ideas that will never pay for themselves or improve our lives.  We need to remain aware of that fact, and act appropriately.

...

"Living on wheels should never be about giving up luxuries or comfort, it should be about expanding them." Agreed. Like to add there are no points for making oneself miserable.

That is true, tons of camping and conventional RV gear that doesn't improve full time living.

On second thought one way to save big bucks is to just go without heat. Just bundle up as clothes are heated space! If you get sick as a direct result of going without heat or sleep poor and subsequently crash the van, don't get cold medicine or replace the van as you don't want to wipe out your savings. If you end up dying from the cold induced sickness or fatigue induced crash, more the better as there is no need to spend money in the afterlife!!!

Personally I'll stick with thermostatically controlled propane heat ran 24/7 on the coldest days of the year and have it set to 65 degrees. And carry a tiny 1500w electric heater to use on grid power or from a generator if the thermostatically controlled propane heat goes bust.

 

[debit.servus]

Actually, why not stay all year in the midsection of hot summers and cold winters? Salt Lake City, Reno, and Omaha, NE come to mind.