I know this will be a minority opinion (as it seems most of my views on this forum are) but I just don't get "stealth". It seems you are trying to "hide". If you are legally parked, why do you need to hide. If not, then you are illegally parked and breaking the law. Do laws apply only to other people?
Stealth??
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Blanch
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Yes it does.
Perhaps look up public camping laws where you are located.
I am full time for two and a half years. I am visiting my adult children for the holidays and I am parked in front of their home. I am illegally camping per local and county ordinance. I can be ticket or even arrested for this. The neighbors are chill, and always have been, but I saw a guy who was sleeping in his RV get arrested last week, just down the street.
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Perhaps look up public camping laws where you are located.
I am full time for two and a half years. I am visiting my adult children for the holidays and I am parked in front of their home. I am illegally camping per local and county ordinance. I can be ticket or even arrested for this. The neighbors are chill, and always have been, but I saw a guy who was sleeping in his RV get arrested last week, just down the street.
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squire said:
We may be breaking the law but we are not harming anyone or damaging any property. Laws like this are broken everyday by people who consider themselves law-abiding citizens. They are enforced whenever it becomes necessary but most of the time the authorities will use commonsense judgement.
We do not attempt to be stealthy. We can't with our RV but we do stay overnight in parking lots in cities where it is illegal to do so. We have parked on the street on occasions. We've parked in driveways in cities where I'm sure that it's illegal. So we're not hiding but we are breaking a law, however, we don't feel like we are criminals for doing so.
Blanch
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I don’t feel like a criminal either, but I did watch someone taken away in handcuffs for doing exactly what I am doing.
Even with the ruling by the 9th district court that we can’t be arrested for merely being homeless, it still happens.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.la...th-circuit-20180904-story.html?outputType=amp
I really hope we are moving towards a kinder and gentler world.
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Even with the ruling by the 9th district court that we can’t be arrested for merely being homeless, it still happens.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.la...th-circuit-20180904-story.html?outputType=amp
I really hope we are moving towards a kinder and gentler world.
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Human standards of justice evolve much faster than written laws can keep up, very often The Law is an Ass is the best can be said about it.
The leaders of our society, especially the wealthy but also politically, are also the biggest criminals, almost by definition.
Every US citizen, no matter how law-abiding they try to be, is breaking hundreds of laws every day, likely dozens at the felony level per year, without even knowing it.
Then there are all the laws which if universally enforced, would cause our mainstream society to break down.
Then the tens of thousands that would be found unconstitutional if challenged, go against federal treaties, are immoral / unethical or in violation of our current standards of human rights.
The leaders of our society, especially the wealthy but also politically, are also the biggest criminals, almost by definition.
Every US citizen, no matter how law-abiding they try to be, is breaking hundreds of laws every day, likely dozens at the felony level per year, without even knowing it.
Then there are all the laws which if universally enforced, would cause our mainstream society to break down.
Then the tens of thousands that would be found unconstitutional if challenged, go against federal treaties, are immoral / unethical or in violation of our current standards of human rights.
Stealth is nothing more than trying to not draw attention to yourself. It''s not trying to be invisible. And I do agree that parking in a legal spot on the street is the way to go (I'm there typing this right now) but Blanch is right. Sleeping in your vehicle is not legal in most cities. And just because a lot of cities do not enforce it does not mean they don't have laws on the books forbidding it.
And so we park in our vans or cars and try not to draw attention to ourselves. Stealth. For me I work in Los Angels. An LA is expensive. Could I live in and apartment and pay an expensive rent. Yes. Do I want to? No. So for me it's a choice. So as I move around each night to my different areas I like to park in I pay attention to where I stay and try not to intrude into the lives of the people that live there. If they walk their dog right by my van and have no idea I am there then I feel like I'm doing it right. And in the morning I'll be gone and go to work or find something to do.
And so we park in our vans or cars and try not to draw attention to ourselves. Stealth. For me I work in Los Angels. An LA is expensive. Could I live in and apartment and pay an expensive rent. Yes. Do I want to? No. So for me it's a choice. So as I move around each night to my different areas I like to park in I pay attention to where I stay and try not to intrude into the lives of the people that live there. If they walk their dog right by my van and have no idea I am there then I feel like I'm doing it right. And in the morning I'll be gone and go to work or find something to do.
You sound kind of judge-ey, squire, wherever that comes from for you.
Some laws are clearly there for a reason, but rather benignly broken and so loosely enforced unless there is a problem.
I think this is a no harm, no foul kind of thing.
Some laws are clearly there for a reason, but rather benignly broken and so loosely enforced unless there is a problem.
I think this is a no harm, no foul kind of thing.
lenny flank
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I try not to park where I'm actively not wanted. Though I have indeed spent weeks in cities where it was technically illegal to sleep in a vehicle. In general those laws are targeted at homeless people who park in the same place for years, strew trash and toilet contents all over the grass, and panhandle everyone in sight. They're not usually enforced against plain ole ordinary campers who are not causing any trouble. Don't be an ass, don't bother anybody, and don't be a nuisance, and nobody will care that you are there.
The purpose of stealth is not to hide from the cops--that is impossible, since they know all the tricks and can always tell that you are living in the vehicle.
The purpose of stealth is to remain unnoticed by the ordinary public, as a means of security. Nobody can bother you or object to your presence if they do not notice that you are there.
The purpose of stealth is not to hide from the cops--that is impossible, since they know all the tricks and can always tell that you are living in the vehicle.
The purpose of stealth is to remain unnoticed by the ordinary public, as a means of security. Nobody can bother you or object to your presence if they do not notice that you are there.
I see it as similar to the no alcohol rule in many public parks.
They don’t really care what is in your glass, and no one is going to come looking, but they don’t want parties, keggers, etc.
Have a drink quietly at your own site, or sleep unobtrusively and respectfully in your vehicle, and it’s all good.
They don’t really care what is in your glass, and no one is going to come looking, but they don’t want parties, keggers, etc.
Have a drink quietly at your own site, or sleep unobtrusively and respectfully in your vehicle, and it’s all good.
Another way to say it:
TPTB can arbitrarily crack down on anyone for any reason.
The idiotic prohibition of recreational drugs is a great example.
Starting with the Jim Crow southern states
Harry Anslinger first commissioner of the Federal Bureau of Narcotics, a predecessor to the Drug Enforcement Administration:
> “There are 100,000 total marijuana smokers in the U.S., and most are Negroes, Hispanics, Filipinos and entertainers. Their Satanic music, jazz and swing result from marijuana use. This marijuana causes white women to seek sexual relations with Negroes, entertainers and any others.”
> “Reefer makes darkies think they’re as good as white men.”
Then Nixon declared his "War on Drugs" specifically to make it easier to suppress the anti-Vietnam student left and blacks fighting for civil rights.
These laws are still used for such purposes to this day.
TPTB can arbitrarily crack down on anyone for any reason.
The idiotic prohibition of recreational drugs is a great example.
Starting with the Jim Crow southern states
Harry Anslinger first commissioner of the Federal Bureau of Narcotics, a predecessor to the Drug Enforcement Administration:
> “There are 100,000 total marijuana smokers in the U.S., and most are Negroes, Hispanics, Filipinos and entertainers. Their Satanic music, jazz and swing result from marijuana use. This marijuana causes white women to seek sexual relations with Negroes, entertainers and any others.”
> “Reefer makes darkies think they’re as good as white men.”
Then Nixon declared his "War on Drugs" specifically to make it easier to suppress the anti-Vietnam student left and blacks fighting for civil rights.
These laws are still used for such purposes to this day.
lenny flank
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WanderingRose said:
Yep. I camp out mostly in Walmarts. Though that's not really the right word, since I make no noise, make no light, cause no disturbance, do not look like a homeless person, stay unseen in the back of the van, and give no one any reason whatever to suspect there's anyone in there. So for the most part, nobody is aware that I'm there--I am completely forgettable and virtually nobody ever notices me.
The security dudes probably know I'm there (that is after all their job) but in 4 years of dwelling I've only had trouble once (and that was because the store manager was kicking out ALL vans, not just me). I have had security folks wave to me as I was walking across the lot, so they apparently knew I was there. But since I was not being a PITA, they ignored me. I'm not the droids they are looking for, and they let me go about my business.
In my experience, if you don't cause problems for people, people won't cause problems for you.
kllcbosmetris
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Part of being stealth (a.k.a. blending in and trying to not draw extra attention to yourself) is about protection from criminal activity. If someone knows you are living in a vehicle, one can easily assume that the vehicle will have more valuable items inside, than a regular parked car. Once detected, criminals could track your in/out hours and break in when you are not there. A regular car break-in is a hit or miss (and sometimes more trouble than it's worth) but a live-in vehicle will definitely be a hit. This is another angle to think about.
