Generator + Battery Bank?

[ExploringOne]

So, I’m looking at doing a few weeks at a time in my travel trailer.

I had thought about doing solar, and I may eventually. However, I found a 30 amp 4000 starting watt generator, with 3500 running watts for $300. It runs on dual fuel (propane and gas), so I jumped on the deal shortly after I purchased the camper.

Now, I’m no electrician, and I’m kind of looking for advise from someone who would know. I’ve scoured the board and searched the internet, I’m not coming up with much that makes sense to me.

I currently have 1 12 V car battery on my travel trailer. It does “okay” for what it needs to run, but of course I want more. 

Here are my thoughts, someone correct me if I’m looking at this incorrectly.

I’ve seen some of the 100-200 watt solar kits... I think 200 watts would probably be plenty, especially if I have a battery bank. I’m currently thinking of getting some Duracell 6V 215 amp hour batteries from Batteries Plus as they’re $99 each.

I’m currently thinking I can run 2 batteries in series and have plenty of juice to run what I need to run after night fall. (Would charge the batteries from shore/generator power.)

Now, this is where I hav questions:

1) I’m going to need a charge controller, so I don’t overcharge the batteries. Correct?
2) I’m going to need some kind of inverter, so I can run appliances off the batteries. Correct?
3) Will I need an automatic transfer switch?
4) Can I charge the batteries off the generator? I’ve read that it can be done, but you need to get the correct hardware/gear.
5) Am I over thinking this? I feel like since I already have $300 generator, I should just install a battery bank, inverter, charge controller sans the solar to save a few bucks.

 

[highdesertranger]

So far you are just guessing. here's what you need to do,

1. Add up your daily power use
2. size your battery to #1
3. size your solar to #2

Now for your questions,
1. yes you need the charge controller if your want to use solar
2. what appliances? you are not going to run your AC off of a battery or 2. For a microwave you should have four 6v batteries. everything else should be 12volt.
3. your trailer should already have a transfer switch.
4. yes you can charge off of the generator, Your trailer should already have a converter the older ones are pretty much poor battery chargers you should upgrade it.
5. the charge controller is for solar not the generator.

before you spend any more money you need to break this down into smaller issues and ask questions about each one. Keep in mind you need to charge your batteries to 100% everyday not every other day but everyday. This is why solar works so well.

So do the little 1,2,3 I gave you and use the genny when you want to run the heavy loads. I hope you bought a super quite generator or you are not planning on camping close to anyone, your neighbors will hate you if you run an open frame generator.

Highdesertranger

 

[ExploringOne]

1) Appliances
12v/propane fridge.
Microwave (rarely use, maybe 10 minutes a week?)
Coffee Maker - Daily, maybe 5 brews a day.
Phone charged nightly, Verizon MiFi, Laptop, iPad.
Water pump

I probably will cook some, but majority just eating out. I’ll be working remotely, so I’m going to be making money. When I do cook, I’ll be using the propane stove and oven a lot more than the microwave.

I’m not really a TV watcher.

I did the math on the batteries, maybe I’m wrong, but I’m thinking 250ish amp hours should be a good start. Easy to add 2 new batteries to the system if I need more.

My generator is an open frame, it is a inverter generator though, so I’ve definitely heard louder ones.

 

[Camper]

Here's a simple to use solar system calculator that works for me.

It can show you what size panels, how many, controller, batteries needed, etc.

Scroll down to List Your Devices to get started:

https://www.parkedinparadise.com/solar-calculator/

 

[bullfrog]

Just a note many new trailers that don’t come with a generator do not have a transfer switch and have an external 30 Amp plug, make sure you get the cord to be able to hook up. Most new trailers come wired with a Zamp only connector plug for solar with too small wire in my opinion, use thicker wire and go directly to the batteries. Some new units that do come with a generator also come with a regular residential refrigerator and use an inverter so check before you buy. If you are in a cold climate the RV heater fan will be the largest draw. Check and bulk charge your batteries first thing in the morning and last thing at night before quiet hours. Having solar during the day tops the batteries off and really reduces the required generator run time even on cloudy days somewhat. If you are like most people you really won’t want to run the generator any more than you have to. Change the oil at least every 100 hours of run time or what ever the manufacture recommends if less. Plug the generator into your shore power plug as your generator should have a 30 amp outlet but may require an RV adaptor.

 

[Freelander]

I agree my Class C doesn't have a transfer switch, inside the little door where the shore cable goes, is a 30 amp receptacle where I plug my cable in. Since I don't plan on using to many RV parks it works good for me. And its one less thing that can go wrong.

As far as making coffee I use a Perk Pot on the propane stove inside and it makes good coffee. I found a small 3 cup pot on Amazon that works great for me.

No reason to fire up the generator just to make coffee.

 

[ExploringOne]

Okay, so my travel trailer did not come with a generator. It's a 2013 Keystone Bullet Ultra Lite. I don't think she came with a transfer switch.

The trailer definitely didn't come with a pre-wired for solar.

I'm in a warmer climate, the Southeast of the US.

My generator has a 30 amp RV female outlet, so I just plug: Trailer -> Surge Protector -> Generator

 

[highdesertranger]

You need to find stuff like this out. If it doesn't have a transfer switch, what happens when you plug it in? Transfer switches are automatic you don't actually flip a switch. Does your refrigerator automatically switch to 120v when you plug in?

An open frame inverter generator? Do you have a link to that?

Highdesertranger

 

[Freelander]

It least on mine, without a transfer switch, I either plug it into either shore power or to the generator.

 

[ExploringOne]

That's what I'm trying to find out, if it has a transfer switch. The fridge does automatically switch to propane if the power is cut off.

I admit, I'm wrong, it is not an inverter generator. I thought it was when I bought it. However, it looks like it is on sale again.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Sportsm...s-on-LPG-or-Regular-Gasoline-803266/304541553

 

[ExploringOne]

My question about the transfer switch, maybe to clarify things.

To have the trailer automatically switch over power from shore/generator to battery, does it require a transfer switch? I would think so.

Maybe I'm looking at the wrong thing, but I see no mention of it in the manual.

https://keystone-rv-dealer-app.cdn....6c9d286_2013+Keystone+owners_manual_final.pdf

 

[Freelander]

My fridge has a switch that says either Auto or Gas, when on Auto it will look for 110v first if it doesn't find it, it will switch to Propane. And when 110v is available it will switch to it.

Transfer switches are on higher end RV's, not all RV's with a built in Generators have Auto Transfer switches.

Like I said, on mine the little opening where the shore cable comes out of, there is a 30 amp receptacle inside the little box, I coil the cable up stick in back inside the box and plug it in. When on shore power I pull the cable and plug it into the pedestal.

 

[Freelander]

My question about the transfer switch, maybe to clarify things.

To have the trailer automatically switch over power from shore/generator to battery, does it require a transfer switch? I would think so.

Maybe I'm looking at the wrong thing, but I see no mention of it in the manual.

https://keystone-rv-dealer-app.cdn....6c9d286_2013+Keystone+owners_manual_final.pdf

Yes to automatically have it switch, you will have to have an auto transfer switch installed, since your trailer didn't come with a generator it didn't come with an auto transfer switch.

 

[ExploringOne]

My fridge has a switch that says either Auto or Gas, when on Auto it will look for 110v first if it doesn't find it, it will switch to Propane. And when 110v is available it will switch to it.

Right so does mine. I feel like we're stuck on this, so let me ask my question a different way.

Is that "automatic transfer" just for the fridge? Or would it be for all appliances? I'm thinking it's just like that for the fridge and not the wiring as a whole on the trailer.

 

[ExploringOne]

Yes to automatically have it switch, you will have to have an auto transfer switch installed, since your trailer didn't come with a generator it didn't come with an auto transfer switch.

THANKS!!!!

 

[Freelander]

The switch doesn't switch from shore/generator to battery, it switches from shore to generator.

On mine the only things that are 110v or the Microwave, and the AC, the fridge can run on either, the internal lights are all 12v. The 110v power comes into the control panel and it have a convertor that convert 110v AC to 12v DC, and charges the battery.

 

[Freelander]

Right so does mine. I feel like we're stuck on this, so let me ask my question a different way.

Is that "automatic transfer" just for the fridge? Or would it be for all appliances? I'm thinking it's just like that for the fridge and not the wiring as a whole on the trailer.

Yes that switch is just for the fridge.

 

[highdesertranger]

Well I think what everybody is calling a transfer switch is when you have an inverter that keeps all the 120v outlets live. Then when you plug in it automatically switches from the invertor to shore power. The refrigerators have a mini transfer switch that only switches the refer. Sorry I made that confusing.

Yeah you are not going to have happy neighbors with that generator. But the price is right, Just park a long ways away from anyone.

Highdesertranger

 

[ExploringOne]

Well I think what everybody is calling a transfer switch is when you have an inverter that keeps all the 120v outlets live. Then when you plug in it automatically switches from the invertor to shore power.

Exactly, I'm looking to keep the 120v outlets live on a battery bank (quiet hours), and then top off batteries with the generator or shore power later.

So, it looks as if I'm going to need an automatic transfer switch unless I want to manually flip switches. It doesn't really matter to me, but I'd prefer not to think about it, and I know if it's not automatic and I backfeed the generator from the inverter, I'm not going to have a fun or safe time.

 

[Freelander]

They do make an Auto Transfer Switch that will switch from Shore power to Generator power and they also make an hybrid invertor that will use battery power as a back up to low shore power, and some of these come with an auto start unit for the generator. But those are on your high end Class A units.