Diesel van

[steveh2112]

sorry if this has been discussed (and i'm sure it has but can't find anything with search), but what are your thoughts on a diesel van?

specifically this http://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/cto/4996132734.html
2004 Ford Econoline E-350 Turbo Diesel Extended - $4900 no millage listed

i have a toyota vigo diesel pickup and i love it, great gas mileage and will probably live for ever

i'd rather not have a turbo but if that dies, can you just disconnect it and forget about it?

 

[Bdog1]

Better mileage, somewhat diluted by today's diesel prices. More expensive repairs, unless you can fix it yourself.
Better range per fill-up. Of course, everything is tight in a van.

Mine is the older (non electric) model, last used in 95 and the parts can be cheaper than the power strokes, but they have less power.

 

[Canine]

Another oversimplification answer from me:

Ford didn't have a lot of luck with the 6.0 diesel until 2005-2006. In the pickups they weren't de tuned like the vans, so the higher torque engine was big trouble. They have (generally) a piss poor reputation. Spend some time on a ford truck or diesel forum and type in ford 6.0 power stroke, you can read for days...

Diesels are high torque motors superior to gas for heavy towing. They generally don't do as well in urban stop and go. This motor was very sensitive to fuel quality, water in fuel trashes them. Very expensive repairs. A rebuild on a 6.0 is like the same cost as two complete long block gas 5.4 motors. Many of the earlier 6.0 engines that have survived have had to be "bulletproofed". Again, read the ford diesel forums to understand what all is entailed in that repair. It's roughly 3-4 grand...

Many owners hate them, they have really hurt commercial fleets, a few people have had good luck with them. I don't know how much the van motor was detuned vs the truck.

You'd better have a big maintenance fund if you buy one with an unknown repair history. A Ford Oasis report (from the dealer) will give you some information.

I'd personally steer clear.

 

[masterplumber]

I'd steer clear of a 6.0 liter also, but would snatch up a 7.3 in good shape in a heart beat. But I haul and tow a lot, and love diesels. I think the average van dweller would probably be better off with a gas motor when looking at it from just a monetary point of view. Personally I would rather have a turbo - better power, especially at altitude, and generally better mileage. They live a long time if properly taken care of, a whole other subject. I,ve never lost a turbo and that includes a truck I hauled and towed with for well over 200,000 miles. And while I take care of my vehicles, I would never be described as being easy on them.

 

[Canine]

I'd steer clear of a 6.0 liter also, but would snatch up a 7.3 in good shape in a heart beat. But I haul and tow a lot, and love diesels. I think the average van dweller would probably be better off with a gas motor when looking at it from just a monetary point of view. Personally I would rather have a turbo - better power, especially at altitude, and generally better mileage. They live a long time if properly taken care of, a whole other subject. I,ve never lost a turbo and that includes a truck I hauled and towed with for well over 200,000 miles. And while I take care of my vehicles, I would never be described as being easy on them.

I agree totally with the 7.3.  A lot noisier, clacker, smellier than the 6.0, if that motor had worked, it would have been great.  It's quieter, a lot more power in theory...  But it was a major fail.  The 6.4 wasn't much better, they finally got the 6.7 to work.  But I digress as usual.  

A quote:  One huge problem with the 6.0L PSD was people using them like a gas engine. Hop in, start it up, drive a few miles to the grocery store, then back home. Repeat over and over. Pretty soon the turbo vanes and EGR cooler is getting clogged with soot because the engine isn't getting to operating temp and staying there.

The happiest owners are those that let the engine work. They tow with it or haul with it, which allows the the junk to be burned off on a regular basis."
From the ford power stroke forum...

I agree, stick to,gas unless you plan to tow a heavy trailer.  If so then maybe a diesel.  There's nothing "wrong" with a bulletproofed 6.0, but you have to have that done and invest in a good secondary filter system, as well as be very careful of your fuel and change fluids regularly with OEM oils and filters.  The oil cooling system was a real issue on those motors.  

It's ok to own one, just invest in the upgrades and still have a big maintenance fund just in case.  

The 5.4 won't cost you like the diesel will if it breaks.  Won't pull like one either, but most vandwellers don't tow much of anything.  I have seen a few 6.8 (V10) vans out there for sale, that's a pullin' motor...  Gas hog though.

 

[steveh2112]

thanks, good advice. i'll most likely stick to gas anyhow since 95% of the vans out there are gas, but i was just interested to know.

 

[Canine]

Steve, it you read those diesel forums you'll find strong defenders of the 6.0. I'm not an owner and have no experience with them, I only know what I've read and heard. My belief is that anything that has so much bad press has likely earned some or all of it. I'd rather have a motor that nobody talks about, as that means there isn't a lot wrong. The Ford 4.6 and 5.4 have a couple issues, spark plug and coils issues with some model years, but in general they are fine.
Want tons of torque, by the 6.0. Want a greater chance of problems and a less forgiving motor? Buy the 6.0. The main proponents of the motor are truck owners that haul heavy trailers, they factor in the maintenance to have the power.

 

[highdesertranger]

my 2 cents. our ranch has 2 ford diesels. a 2001 f-250 4x4, 7.3 and a 2005 f-250 4x4 6.0. the 01 is a daily driver, the 05 is for towing. the 01 has 250k on the clock, the 05 56k. the 01 has been a trouble free workhorse as far as the engine goes. the 05 not even close, several costly problems. imho the 7.3 was fords only good diesel, the rest are plagued with problems. on another note in kalifornia diesel is cheaper than gas, has been for the last couple of years. highdesertranger

 

[Canine]

my 2 cents.  our ranch has 2 ford diesels.  a 2001 f-250 4x4, 7.3 and a 2005 f-250 4x4 6.0.  the 01 is a daily driver,  the 05 is for towing.  the 01 has 250k on the clock,  the 05 56k.  the 01 has been a trouble free workhorse as far as the engine goes.  the 05 not even close,  several costly problems.  imho the 7.3 was fords only good diesel,  the rest are plagued with problems.  on another note in kalifornia diesel is cheaper than gas,  has been for the last couple of years.  highdesertranger

Nothing like real experience. The 95 6.0 was "supposed" to be relatively "fixed" according to their defenders, and the ford service techs had by then figured out the main issues, again according to the defenders. Doesn't sound like you would support that point of view.

There's a nice looking fire engine red 06 e350 power stroke cargo low top with something like 105K on the clock for sale here in Phoenix on Craigslist for 4500. What a deal, right??

 

[oldogre]

Here in Pensacola, one particular used vehicle sales lot will not even buy or sell these models because so troublesome, I find them the best people to deal with, they are very honest in my experiences.

 

[Canine]

Another oversimplification. There's a car show on the radio on Saturdays, I can't remember the name, but the moderators and "Jerry and Kevin". It's a national show based out of Dallas. Oh, "The car guy". That's it. Anyway, the host Jerry is a retired 30 plus year Ford dealer in Tx and was the Ford Dealer President for 2 years. Obviously has some cred. Anyway, he has repeatedly told callers to stay away from the 6.0 and the later 6.4, but he especially hates the 6.0. He states that Ford spent millions, many millions on warranty work, buy backs etc. and lost an enormous amount of goodwill and customers to Dodge and GM over that motor.

Then Ford sued International (the maker) due to the design and parts used. So you have a very credible source that trashes the motor, not some old ex trucker like me.

Are there strong defenders of the 6.0? Sure thing. If I had the money, I mean about 14,000 to replace the entire engine with, would I risk it? Maybe if it could be bulletproofed and if I had a need to tow. I'd risk your money but not mine. Course, I don't have 14000 to play with...

 

[Canine]

Ok guys and gals, last post on this, I promise. Over at ford-trucks.com forum there's a guy with 37,599 posts who said this about the 7.3 vs the 6.0:

Begin post: "7.3's are known for their reliability, and I have heard very few guys say that they were anything but generally great engines. My previous full time job (now winter job) was out in the oil fields of Alberta where diesel trucks are a must, and they get used and abused hard. (and ive literally talked to thousands of guys about their trucks, me being the truck guy that I am)

Ive ran into so many guys that praise their old 7.3 (and alot of dodge guys their 5.9 cummins) and would buy another one in a second to get the reliability.

Now to say they are perfect, no, not by any means, but as a whole they are the most reliable ENGINE put in a ford truck to date, by far.

Common problems on a 7.3 are a cps sensor recall. Yeah, thats the most common, and thats a minor one. (AND thats on a stock truck, we all know there are chances to be taken when adding mod's)
To say one has never blown up, or blown a turbo, is not what Im trying to say either. But they have far less problems then any ford diesel (in a pick up truck) to date.

I could go on talking about the massive problems with the 6 liter engine, but most of us diesel guys know what they are allready, and they can easily be found in the many posts and threads in the 6.0 liter forum

FWIW Kenworth, I had a coworker that had a complete stock 05 6 liter truck, blow the turbo, head gaskets, I forget how many injectors, and the transmission while he was pulling his 5th wheel camper (stock truck)
The amount of km's on it was less then 60,000. (and hes an older fella that does nothing but maintain his vehicle to the T, and drives it normally)". End of quote

 

[highdesertranger]

yeah, I hear you. my boss had the 6.0 in a 2006 f-250 blew the motor, less than 100k. my brother has a 2014 f-550 with the 6.7 already replace the motor less than 100k. I would not buy a ford diesel unless it was a 7.3. highdesertranger

 

[Canine]

That's sad. I was wrong on the overhaul cost, closer to 8-9000 for the 6.0. "Only" 9K. That's still two gas engines...

I still like diesels for heavy trailers, hot shot delivery, in city delivery like FedEx and UPS, that sort of thing. Maybe it's guys amping them up too much with tuners. I know they run like a bat out of hel* when they pass me up grades but I don't see the repair bills either.

 

[wagoneer]

I paid 3600 for my .E350 high top 2001 extended passenger it was a fleet sale and had 196k on the stock 7.3 navistar. it was un-reliable invested
3k in new injectors and a few plugs. I love this truck. It will do whatever I ask and would not hesitate getting another but I have no need. Nor would I hesitate pulling a trailer across country August to Chicago.

 

[Canine]

Wow, I'd put up with the 7.3 clatter and noise for that deal. Good sniffing that one out.
Like I said, I'd play with a 2005 or 6 ford 6.0 as long as I had a pile o cash... But I don't.

 

[highdesertranger]

ah cmon, that clatter is the sound of a real truck. highdesertranger

 

[Canine]

As long as the OP knows that's what he is getting not. If he went that route which it doesn't sound like he is wanting to. Zillion more gas vans to choose from and he could get engines by the dozens n a boneyard... Economy of scale for parts...

Course, the super shuttle van busses in my area are all gas ford 350's with the 5.4, and they have between 300 and 550K miles on them... Most have seen one or two trannies but same block. All are 2010 or newer. Says something about those modular motors...

 

[offroad]

Dodge is better than ford for longevity and reliability. Look at what is for sale used. New they are close to even. Used there are a lot of dodge engines out there still rolling. Ford is for sale too often.


That's gasoline engines of course. But it seems to follow the same pattern for diesel

 

[Canine]

Wonder what OP has done. It's been long enough...