Amp hours

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David

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How do I determine my amp hours? I have two of these deep cycles but little confused about the amp hours.

http://www.samsclub.com/sams/durace...group-size-31dtmagm/prod3590232.ip?navAction=


Specifications
1 amp hour rate:68.2
100 amp hour rate:110
20 amp hour rate:105
3 amp hour rate:85
5 amp hour rate:86
6 amp hour rate:87.4
8 amp hour rate:90
BCI Group Size:31
CCA at 0 degrees F:800
MCA at 32 degrees F:1000
Minutes at 15 amps:348
Minutes at 25 amps:210
Minutes at 5 amps:1265
Minutes at 50 amps:87.4
Minutes at 75 amps:53
Minutes at 8 amps:706
Reserve Capacity:200
Volts:12


I assumed they are 110 amp hours each but when I set up my Tri-metric meter for 220 hours it shows 100% way before they are full. Can anyone tell me what the actual amp hours are?
 
They are 105 ah. I have no idea what was going on with the tri-metric. That's a good looking battery, how much was it?
Bob
 
Humm I have two of them, so I'll have to drop my Tri metric setting down to 210 rather than 220. That will make them show as being charged even more than they show now..

As for the batteries, they were $169.00 each at sam's plus all the BS charges they get you for.

This is my set up.. Well at least a early pic of it.

http://vanigans.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/011.jpg
 
You can't just add up amps in and amps out to determine if a battery is full. Higher loads will deplete the battery more than small loads and not all energy you put in is absorbed. Some is lost to heat. Also, not all 105Ah batteries are created equal - some may have lower losses than others and it will change depending on how old and abused the batteries are.

I would guess the creators of the trimetric came up with a formula for dealing with these losses but it isn't quite working with your system - you'll need to talk to them or just fiddle with things until it works. If using a higher number than the manufacturer's rating works then go for it.


Also, make sure you strap those batteries down - they do like to wander.
 
I don't see the 'shunt' in the picture.
Do you have it installed and is its type programmed correctly?
Have you double checked all of the programming points and followed the initial charge procedures to set the meter accurately?
 
johnny b said:
I don't see the 'shunt' in the picture.
Do you have it installed and is its type programmed correctly?
Have you double checked all of the programming points and followed the initial charge procedures to set the meter accurately?

The shunt is right between the charge controller and the inverter, but slightly below them. I'm pretty sure I programmed it correctly, but I'll have to read through the manual again.

The Charge controller on the other hand I'm not 100% sure if it's right. I set it up to the batteries specs as it said to do in the manual, but I couldn't set it as a 12v system. If I left it on 12v the charge controller gives a overload warning. The only way I can get it to work is to set it on auto detect for the voltage.
 
All loads on the battery must be wired to go through the shunt.

All vehicle grounds must be fed through the Shunt, if any wires /cables go directly to the battery (-) that does not go through the shunt, then the trimetric is not reading all the loads on the battery

Batteries===========//SHUNT\\===========ALL Loads (-)
..........................................................................All charging ==
..........................................................................All vehicle grounds
;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;Negative Bussbar

If any wire goes directly to the battery (-) which does not come from the battery side of the shunt, then the current will not be counted by the trimetric.

I took the original starter battery to engine ground, and made that my engine to shunt ground. My frame/ Firewall to starter battery ground became my Frame/Firewall to Shunt ground.

This way My shunt sees alternator current. Anything that is grounded right to the frame will be counted by the trimetric.

The ground is shared between both starter and house batteries. Anything grounded directly to the starter battery is bypassing the shunt and not being counted.

Make sure to label the wires so that the there is no condusion as to which cables goto the battery from ONLY the battery side of the shunt . All other cables to the LOAD side of the shunt.

Many stock lights and perhaps the stereo is grounded right to the frame, or firewall. If the starter battery bround does not go through the Shunt then this current is not counted by the Shunt/trimetric.

Only if you are not doing any alternator charging of the house battery, AND all house loads and only house loads are run through the shunt, will the trimetric be accurate.

If the trimetric has an 'amp hour from full' screen, try to use that rather than the percentage remaining. Battery capacity is always shrinking as they age, so the Percentage will be off unless the total amp hour capacity is lowered and actually represents the actual remaining capacity. Reliance on percentage remaining Screen is unwise.

Even when wired properly to monitor ALL current into and out of the batteries, you can only really expect 90% accuracy, at best. Throw really high amp draws in there, and that figure drops.

The sense wires leading to the shunt from the trimetric are sensitive to interference. Did you use twisted pair wire? It does not appear to be. Twisted pair is not just two wires twisted. It is two pairs of two wires twisted. Any 120Vac lines in the area should not run parallel with the twisted pair sense wires and certainly not in direct contact. Where they have to cross each other, 90 degree angles. Basically you want the twisted pair sense wires as far as can be from all other wires carrying current. Obviously this is difficult to achieve perfectly, but some distance and crossing at 90 degrees helps greatly.

Also some 12v loads can cause interference on these sense wires. Twisting the (=) and negative two wire, tightly in a drill helps reduced interference.

You can also take additional steps like wrapping the twisted pair in aluminum tape and grounding the aluminum tape, or run them in metal conduit.

I have the same shunt. That one Store bought cable on the bottom of your shunt. That is a steel connector. It is a very poor connection.

A quick story about that store bought 4awg cable. I had two 4 awg wires from shunt to house battery in parallel. One cable had those steel ring terminals, the other had a higher quality copper connector crimped on.

I put my Clamp on Ammeter over both these cables. 4.2 amps were flowing from my house batterie at the times. Then I Put the clamp on Ammeter over just the store bought cable with steel ring terminals . It was passing 0.7 amps. I put the Clamp meter over the other 4 awg cable with the copper ring terminals, and it was passing the remaining 3.5 amps. I cut off the steel connectors, used my Hydraulic crimper on some new ring terminal lugs, and remeasured. Both cables were now sharing the load equally.

Here are those highly resistive stamped steel ring terminals (notice the rust?) I replaced, sticking to a magnet. These also suffer quickly from corrosion in a flooded battery environment not only due to to charging gasses, but just the dissimilar metals, as the copper is just crushed inside the steel then a hole is drilled through it.

APstoresbatterycable_zps94f3dcde.jpg


Also SAE store bought battery cables are narrower diameter than AWG rated wires, by upto 20%.

Genuinedealz will make you up high quality cables if you do not have the proper tools for crimping. Those steel connectors are just problems waiting to happen.
 
Thanks for all that info, I didn't realize all the grounds in the system needed to go to the shunt. I only have the meter and the charge controller hooked to it. My panels are grounded to the body as well as my inverter and 12v power points.

The battery system isn't hooked into the van's electrical system, meaning it's isolated from everything including the alternator.

I'll have to rework the grounds to get everything within the solar system hooked into the shunt.

Thanks for that reply.
 
If you are not using the alternator to charge the house batteries, then the stock original grounds do not need to flow through the shunt. But anything grounded to the frame, which is taking power from the house battery, HAS to go through the shunt, or it will not be read correctly.

It is not much more difficult to wire up the shunt so that it measures alternator amperage. I highly recommend taking advantage of the alternator as a charging source for the house/solar batteries.

The sun is not always shining.

Also the grounding of the panel frame to the chassis is kinda unnecessary. If lightning were to hit your vehicle that ground is not going to make any difference
 
SternWake said:
If you are not using the alternator to charge the house batteries, then the stock original grounds do not need to flow through the shunt. But anything grounded to the frame, which is taking power from the house battery, HAS to go through the shunt, or it will not be read correctly.

It is not much more difficult to wire up the shunt so that it measures alternator amperage. I highly recommend taking advantage of the alternator as a charging source for the house/solar batteries.

The sun is not always shining.

Also the grounding of the panel frame to the chassis is kinda unnecessary. If lightning were to hit your vehicle that ground is not going to make any difference


I rewired my 12v fridge to ground at the shunt and it's reading that load properly, but still not reading the incoming amps correctly from the solar. It's always showing like 1.5 amps at best.

I have the ground coming out of the charger going to the shunt but I also have the solar grounded at the body where the wires enter the van and then again at the charge controller I have another ground to the body.

Should I remove both of those and instead ground the shunt to the body?
 
Run the ground from solar panel right to the shunt. If you ground the Solar panel to the body then the current will find a path to the solar battery through the engine battery ground and you will not read the full solar current, which is what you are seeing happen now.
 
SternWake said:
Run the ground from solar panel right to the shunt. If you ground the Solar panel to the body then the current will find a path to the solar battery through the engine battery ground and you will not read the full solar current, which is what you are seeing happen now.

Ok I'll do that tomorrow and that should get everything grounded at the shunt at that point.
 
I just wanted to update, that moving all the grounds to the shunt did in fact fix the meter issue. I have had several days of rainy weather followed by cloudy days, so in the last few days I've only been able to get the batteries at 100% just once.

I was down to 61% this morning and only made it back to 94% again. The meter is now working right, I just need some sunny days.. LoL

On a side note I've had to unplug my 12v fridge. It's a older Norcold DE-251D but it's not cycling properly and was running non-stop. Gonna have to play with it some in hopes of getting it to cycle properly.
 
Lucky mike said:
sounds like a stuck thermostat

I'm not sure, originally it was cycling properly but then I had it drain my batteries way too low when I noticed the issue with the meter not reading right. I thought perhaps it was the charger not getting a full charge or something but I didn't notice it had stopped cycling at the time.

Originally I just had the fridge sitting in the van hooked to the batteries not mounted up. I since built a cabinet for it and wrapped it with insulation. I left the back with no insulation and just did the sides, top & bottom but I wonder if maybe it's not getting enough ventilation.

What is odd, is if I turn it down to the #1 setting out of 5 it will cycle sometimes but not like it should.
 
Fridges do not force things to be cold. The remove heat from things placed within., via the condenser. If the condenser cannot transfer heat to the atmosphere. The fridge will not work. It will burn out if not ventilated properly. The single beat way to increase fridge efficiency is by making sure ambient air xan flow across the condenser.

Glad to hear you got the monitor operating properly.
 
SternWake said:
Run the ground from solar panel right to the shunt. If you ground the Solar panel to the body then the current will find a path to the solar battery through the engine battery ground and you will not read the full solar current, which is what you are seeing happen now.

Hmm... I just hooked up my solar panels, didn't consider grounding them. Is it imperative to ground solar panels?
 
I should have been more clear in those quoted words.

in residential applications solar panel frames must be grounded. Usually to copper piping that is in the ground, or a solid copper stake driven into the ground.

in terms of the positive and negative wires coming from the panel. Both negative wire and positive should go directly to charge controller. If the current is to be measured, the ground from the cc must go through the shunt. The ground wire from the panel, or cc cannot bypass shunt, or charge controller.

The panel frame itself can be grounded to the frame chassis, or not. No solar current will pass through the frame. The frame is to be grounded in the event of a lightning strike, in residential applications. If lightning hits a parked van. Grounding the panel to the frame will do little. Everything electronic is toast anyway at that point.

please forgive typos. Am on phone., not laptop
 
Good news, after thinking that it might be ventilation related I looked through the manual that I had for it and it confirmed as well if there wasn't enough ventilation the compressor wouldn't cycle.

The only thing I could remember changing before it stopped working, was I added a shelf right above the fridge. I built the cabinet so it vents out the top. I had left a corner open at the top but I guess the shelf was still blocking too much.

I removed the shelf and the fridge has started cycling once again. I'll have to give it a day or two before I feel safe buying any food that needs refrigerated but it seems to be doing the typical 3min on 3min off cycle that it's supposed to do.
 
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