Two stepvan alternatives (can't decide)

[slartybogarty]

Hi all.

I'm seriously considering purchasing one of the following, and having a hard time deciding which.

1) 2009 Ford E350 cutaway stepvan.  Retired from Frito Lay.  194k miles.  5.4L V8 Triton.  This vehicle looks like a mashup between an Econoline and a stepvan.  The 18x8x7 cargo area sits ABOVE the wheel wells, and this one would likely be more a more comfortable drive . $12K.

2) 2003 Workhorse stepvan.  Former local delivery truck. Cummins ISB 3.9L, Allison transmission.  234k miles.  18ft box.  $13K.

Does anyone think this is a no-brainer, or have any insight to pass along? 
Much appreciated!

 

[highdesertranger]

Welcome slartybogarty to the CRVL forums! To help you learn the ins and outs of these forums, this "Tips, Tricks and Rules" post lists some helpful information to get you started.

Most of our rules boil down to two simple over-riding principles: 1) What you post should provide good information (like your introductory post), and 2) Any response to someone else's post should make them feel glad they are part of this forum community.

We look forward to hearing more from you.

Lets see Ford running gear versus GM with a Cummins/Allison combo. For me it's a no brainer, the Cummins all the way.

Highdesertranger

 

[slartybogarty]

Thanks for the input, Ranger! I agree about the engines, but the body on the other one is just such a cool platform! https://www.truckpaper.com/listings/trucks/for-sale/206102123/2009-ford-e350

 

[highdesertranger]

That is not a step van, It's a box truck. However that is irrelevant. It's whatever makes "you" happy not what I want. For me I still vote for the other one. Do you have a link to the other one? Highdesertranger

 

[bullfrog]

"All that glitters is not gold!" Both are too new for me to comment on although the fleet buses and trucks from 1990 to 2000 the Allison transmissions were outstanding and the later computer controlled ones even though they had some computer problems still performed well and actually got better fuel mileage than manual transmissions.

 

[slartybogarty]

Link to the Workhorse: https://www.commercialtrucktrader.c...OM+CHASSIS-FORWARD+CONTROL+CHASSIS-5016706099

Heading out to look at it in a few minutes.

 

[bullfrog]

The forward control chassis would be a big plus for maintenance and repairs.

 

[tx2sturgis]

The Frito Lay vans spend their entire local work life hauling very light loads in what is called 'rack jobber' duty. They tend to be in good shape and not abused...mostly. But as always, you need to do 'due diligence' in your inspection if you get that far. 

On that (or any) stepvan:

Look at the front wheels, are they as wide as the rear outside duals? Or more inset, and narrow, and inline with the rear INSIDE duals?

Makes a difference.

If the front axle is narrow, move along. Find another one to look at.

If the front axle is wide, and the front wheels 'FILL' the wheel housings, investigate further, you have a TRUE heavy duty chassis.

 

[slartybogarty]

Thanks for the tips, sturgis. I looked at the Workhorse today, but didn't have an eye out for axle width. What I did find out is that the engine appears to be well maintained, but the box would need a lot of work to seal. The roof was all fiberglass, pretty beat up and cracked, and so were the wheel wells.

 

[tx2sturgis]

Fiberglass roofs on a cargo box van or step van are to be avoided in most cases. New, they are fine, but as they age they deteriorate and when they are 20 years old or more they can begin to fall apart.

Once that happens the integrity of the side ribs and walls will begin to weaken....not a good thing to have to repair...unless you have lots of sheet aluminum just laying around!

 

[slartybogarty]

And yes I did notice along with the beat-up fiberglass that there were other cracks in the corners and warping/deformation in the sides of the box. Thanks for confirming what looked might be a quite involved repair job.

 

[PlethoraOfGuns]

Duh, Cummins all the way. That Ford is not a step van, more like box truck. The cab of box truck is steel and will eventually rust. The whole step van will be aluminum and will last you a thousand years. Box truck will be a much more quieter and pleasant right. The step van, haha, good luck, you better love that type of ride quality. Step van will get twice the fuel economy and will be the easiest thing to maintain ever, period. Box truck will most likely enjoy highway speeds. Step vans usually tell you how fast they want to go. Box truck is getting towards the end of it's engine life. Step van is getting close to it's halfway point of engine life. Might find more mechanics willing to work on box truck than the step van. the box truck looks to be cool and unique, but unique isn't always good when considering the fixing of things. The new normal is Sprinter vans. I applaud you for not going the well-travelled route. Regardless of which one, I would avoid fiberglass roofs and roll up rear doors.

 

[flying kurbmaster]

I think the Ford looks cool What I don’t like is the large rear overhang behind the wheels. As for the fibreglass roof that would not worry me, a few sheets of aluminum, a tube of caulking and a box of pop rivets would sort that out in no time if it turned out to be a problem, it may not be a problem, and if you were always aware and didn’t over load the rear the overhang may not be a problem either. For me personally they are both too long but that is just my preference.

 

[66788]

Thanks for the tips, sturgis.  I looked at the Workhorse today, but didn't have an eye out for axle width.  What I did find out is that the engine appears to be well maintained, but the box would need a lot of work to seal.  The roof was all fiberglass, pretty beat up and cracked, and so were the wheel wells.

I noticed the wheel wells , but a fiberglass roof is a deal breaker for me.

I scanned Craigslist every day while living in Sacramento for a suitable step van.   One day a 1990 GMC Grumman Olson showed up and the only giveaway that it may have been the van for me was where it listed type of fuel as diesel.   It was a Cummins 4BT with a rock crusher 4 speed manual trans and a Dana rear end.   I bought it for $3,200.00 cash and it only needed tires.   It had 144K miles on it, which is really low miles for a Cummins 4BT.

That was 4 years ago and I completed a nice build that has dual pane windows, a full size 1 piece fiberglass shower with roof vent, full size bed, 2 burner stovetop with vented range hood, sink, ARB compressor fridge, Suburban 6 gallon hot water heater, 40 gallon fresh water tank, gray water holding tank, Air Conditioning, Propex vented forced air heating, MaxxAire vent,  480 watts of roof mounted solar, 40 Amp MPPT controller with remote control panel, pure sine wave inverter, and a digital control center that precisely monitors fresh tank, holding tank, and propane level.  The cabinets are real oak with a nice stained finish.

I might have $7,500 in it, but I've saved way more than that living comfortably with my cat in it for more than 2 1/2 years.

Patience is a virtue and good deals will come along.   Wait for what you really want, don't accept second best in life.

 

[tx2sturgis]

 As for the fibreglass roof that would not worry me, a few sheets of aluminum, a tube of caulking  and a box of pop rivets would sort that out in no time if it turned out to be a problem...

You are making this repair sound simple, and for a well-equipped shop, yeah it might be, but you also need to consider that you need a place to do the work, preferably in a garage or shop, and you need helpers, and you need a way to lift those aluminum sheets, hold them in place, and a way for the workers to be up there and safe, such as on a scaffolding, as the work is done. 

Not to mention a good sized area or work surface to cut the sheets to the exact sizes needed, and all the tools and supplies. Where I worked, we had a good sized, well-equipped truck shop and we still 'farmed out' the work to repair facilities with the equipment to do the labor-intensive job that also included welding the aluminum ribs and beams in some situations. Typically these trailer repair facilities will have rolls or sheets of aluminum stored in the overhead area of the shop so they can easily be slid out over the open box and fastened down.

If the repair involved the removal of the entire length of deteriorating fiberglass sheeting, then you have to get rid of the huge torn up sheets of fiberglass...they don't fit in your local dumpsters unless you cut them up. They don't belong there anyway. Our third party facilities had to pay for a roll-off dumpster and then pay to have that junk hauled off. 

Not really something for one person to tackle in their back yard or in the parking lot of Home Depot, although, with determination and help, just about anything can be done. But its just NOT a simple job.

 

[flying kurbmaster]

It is simple you can buy 4x8 sheets of aluminium, the van is 93 inches wide, a small break either borrowed or you pay someone to do it where you buy the aluminium, à 90 degree bend at both ends 1 3/8 inches in ,5 sheets overlapped sealed and pop riveted off a step ladder or one section of scaffold.I could do this by myself, not a problem. Go right over top of the fibreglass sealed to it. Start from the back, I bet you could even walk up on the roof with a board over the ribs or a piece of ply as you move along.

 

[tx2sturgis]

There are only two days a year here when the wind doesnt blow...good luck doing it outside by yourself anywhere that the wind blows like it does here. And yeah, you gotta have a scaffold or forklift of manlift of some sort to get high enough to work on it.

And you acknowledged the use of a sheet metal bending brake (those cost money!) and a scaffold....two things a lot of people looking for a van to live in don't own. Renting them and hauling them home or somewhere is still gonna complicate things and cost money. Or as I said earlier, a trailer shop can do it if you really want to pay for that, versus just finding one that has an aluminum roof to start with.

And again, for those on the forum looking for a box truck or step van, I advise they decline consideration of an old fiberglass roof on the box, and keep looking for one with an aluminum roof.

Of course many DIY guys and gals will have no problem repairing a damaged or severely worn fiberglass roof, but most of the members here are usually looking for a driveable stepvan that's ready to head home and start building out the interior.

Just my opinion and others will differ. And that's OK too.

 

[PlethoraOfGuns]

There are plenty of step vans out there. Be patient and find the one that works best for you. I'm pretty mechanically inclined and I would never want to tackle converting a roof from fiberglass to aluminum. Get an aluminum roof that was done right from beginning, at the factory, that won't leak and save you all the aggravation. Used that saved aggravation for vehicle breakdowns later on.

 

[highdesertranger]

"Used that saved aggravation for vehicle breakdowns later on."

spoken from experience.

Highdesertranger

 

[PlethoraOfGuns]

Haha, unfortunately you're right.