Improving airflow in a Nissan NV2500

Van Living Forum

Help Support Van Living Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

thezenvan

Active member
Joined
May 8, 2017
Messages
32
Reaction score
0
I recently installed the Maxxair Deluxe 5100 on my Nissan NV2500 High Roof, it's currently running well using an external battery.

I'm looking for ideas to improve the airflow since the cargo space gets a little hot during the days sitting in the Florida weather (been getting 90+ degrees lately) and I don't always have the option of parking in the shade.

There is an exhaust vent in the back of the cargo area on the driver's side but it doesn't seem to do much when the fan is pulling in air. Currently I've been using a swamp cooler with the fan and it's been working OK but I'm looking for a more fixed solution. What I'm considering is cutting a hole in the cargo floor and installing a floor vent (or 2) to allow the cold air underneath the van inside and have the fan pull out air to get a nice airflow but I'm open to any other suggestions.

I searched the forum but couldn't find an answer hence the post, thanks.
 
Yes, good idea, opposite end to the roof outflow, try to exhaust anything producing heat inside without it going into the living space.

Marine screw ports for air-tight sealing while underway, CO kills!

Screening keep out the wildlife.

Likely you don't need fans for intake assistance, but search for SternWake's postings on his ventilation work, lots of good stuff there.
 
We have an NV 3500. We put in two 4 inch floor vents with screw in deck plates, one in each back corner. On the bottom, we put in varmint screens, and with the insulation and flooring, the floor surface is 3 inches above those varmint screens. When using the vents, I just cut out small circles of screening and put them in place with 6 inch hose type clamps around the"neck" of the deck plates. It helps a huge amount in circulating air and keeping the inside temp close to the outside-though when it's 115F, that really doesn't make any difference. Just make sure you close the vents before you drive. Carbon monoxide will get ya.

We also installed two marine ports in the upper door area (we have a hightop). Our bed is 36 inches off the ground and without some kind of window, it was claustrophobic. We couldn't find windows that would fit in the upper cut-outs. The ports are small, but we can open then and they came with screens. The ports are very secure and we can also look out the back from the bed. And we'll be good in case of 30 foot following seas!

Along with the above, we have rainguards on the driver and passenger windows. Between the floor vents, the ports and leaving the front windows undetectably open, we have more than adequate ventilation for all but the hotter days.
Ted
 
Take a good close look at the area behind the rear license plate on the rear door.

I'm not a fan of cutting a hole in the floor, but cutting a small vent opening, that is hidden under the license plate is an option.

You can install a pre-made vent, drill several 1" holes, or some other solution. Use a screen to keep bugs out, and a material cover or flap to close it up for winter.

Also, you will either need to mount the license plate on 1 inch spacers and/or longer bolts, or you can hinge it so it angles outward an inch or two at the bottom, creating a 'rain shelter'.

I did this on my van, although the Ford E-250 rear plate is mounted on a plastic insert, so it was super easy to do.

No one knows its even there, unless I point it out to them from inside the door.

Obviously I dont have the roof fan running when the vehicle is parked and the engine is idling...Common sense in use.

As an alternative, you might want to look at pop-out vents like you see on horse trailers, and the cab of large sleeper trucks.

I used one of these on my trailer, but I mounted it on the side wall, and horizontally, so it can remain open even during heavy rains.
 
I like speed adjusted but powerful computer fans exchanging outside air for inside air, and utilize both intake and exhaust fans, and with reflectix on the sunny side windows can keep my van's interior cooler than until about noon, then same as ambient temps, and by late afternoon when things start cooling off is the only time it is warmer in the van than outside it, and not for long.


I have not done so yet, but I will be replacing my one silverstone FM121 exhaust fan on my ceiling mushroom exhaust vent  with a Noctua Industrial 3000 rpm  120mm fan.

The Noctua can move the same overall CFM as the silverstone(with no restriction/resistance), but for 25% less energy consumed, and has more than 2 times the static pressure rating.  As my exhaust fans blow into a mushroom vent through a 4.75 to 4.0 inch stepdown ring, there is considerable restriction, so the higher static pressure rating should prove very beneficial to overall airflow and perhaps allow the same or higher airflow for signifiantly less noise and amperage consumed.  Perhaps.

While the silverstone fm121 fan comes with a speed controller, the Noctua does not. But I have seen that Noctua is offering a speed controller that will control the speed of their PWM fan versions via the fourth PWM wire.

https://www.amazon.com/Noctua-NA-FC...r=1-12&keywords=computer+fan+speed+controller

https://www.amazon.com/Focused-NF-F...id=1499709718&sr=1-1&keywords=Noctua+3000+pwm

While I do not really require better ventilation, I am just so impressed with Noctua fan's engineering that I must obtain one of these high rpm industrial versions, and perhaps use less juice to move more air for less noise.

While I have the rain vents on my front windows, they are more for extra shade than ventilation.  When I want to keep the interior cooler I have tight fitting reflectix shades stuffed into these windows which would allow very little air to be pushed past them by my intake fans located in a sliding conversion van window in back.

Also, while the 120MM computer fan has the most product choices, a bigger fan can move more air for less noise and sometimes less amperage consumed.

The 180MM silverstone fm181 fan can move ~150CFM for 0.28 amps, and is very quiet, and comes with speed control.  My intake fans reside by my head in bed and i can sleep with the fm181 on full speed inches from my head, and love the airflow.  My intake shroud has room for 3 fans, one 180 and two 120mms and fits tightly so any air moved by the fans cannot to a 180 and recycle through the blades.  A fan shroud for 100% air displacement is so much mroe effective than just a fan placed in an open window.

  Usually the 120MM ones in my shroud  are rarely turned on.  it has to be HOT to require them, and 120MM at higher rpms are not quiet, but the fm121s at minimum speed are.

Speed control  of the fans, is very necessary, in my opinion.

Controlling PWM fans via the fourth wire is something I will be working on soon. I have one extremely powerful 120mm Delta fan that needs to be tamed as the airflow and noise are too much 99.5% of the time, but I would love that 252cfm that 0.5% of the time.

The 4th PWM wire needs a PWM signal sent at 5 volts.

While all fans can be speed controlled by using a PWM motor speed controller, or LED light dimmer on the red and black power wires, this is not a good idea on 4 wire PWM fans, and a lot of fans when slowed via the power wires will make a whining sound at reduced speeds, and the PWM signal might be bad for The motor itself.  Those exploring this route should find pwm motor speed controllers with 21Khz or higher as only Fido should be able to notice the whining. Most are in the 11 to 15khz range, so do your research and find one which claims 21Khz or higher.  I know of one person using a PWM motor speed controller on the industrial Noctuas and claims they do not hum nor seem badly affected by the 15KHZ PWm signal he feeds them on their powerwires, but the damage would eb cumulative, and they are located where any additional noise would not be a concern.

Many fan speed controllers also do so by controlling the voltage fed to the fan via a voltage buck converter.

These buck converters will require some overhead though, meaning if they are fed 12.8vDC the highest voltage they might allow on the output is 11.8v, and thus the max fan speed is not realized, which I find unacceptable, where as a PWM fan fed a PWM signal on the fourth wire should have the full speed range available, and perhaps suffer less conversion losses, meaning mroe efficeint.

When I have some acquired the  components to cobble together to feed the fourth wire a 5volt PWM signal, successful or not,  I will update on one of the other ventilation thread in which I have already posted a lot of info.

Those not into the DIY of electrics  concerning fan speed control should likely consider the silverstone fans which come with a built in Speed control like the FM121 or fm181 or the  fm92, which should mate nicely with some 4 inch marine vents for those exploring holes in the floor.

The noctua Industrial versions are just so well engineered though, that hacking their 21$ speed controller, to mimick a computer mother board, should be quite easy to accomplish for about 45$ with fan and speed controller.  Not an inconsiderable sum, unless one is a ventilation Nazi.

The Noctua industrial versions also have some higher ingress protection ratings, meaning they are more resilient in dusty or moist atmospheres.  Most all my fan failures have been from salt air laden moisture issues rotting the circuit board.  My silverstone fm181 fan had its windings and circuit board coated with DEoxit shield spray, and the wires, where they are soldered to the circuit board, I covered this problem area with either 'amazing goop' or dielectric silicone grease, can't remember. 

So far so good, but even if the FM181 fails tomorrow, I'd get another as it is so effective, and quiet
Silverstone offers a AP182 180mm fan which is much more powerful, and expensive, but I found it does not like battery charging voltages at max speed.  The hub would get stinky plastic hot.  this might have been a contributing cause to its failure, but green corrosion on the wires where they are soldered to circuit board was its the death knell.

My complaint with the silverstone fm 121/181 fans is their white color.  I prefer black as it make it much harder to notice them in my conversion van sliding window, which only ever gets fully closed in winter.  It is screened and security protected with fine mesh chicken wire.  I have removed the impellers and spray painted these fans black, though one can easily throw off the balance of the impellers if not careful.  A black sharpie works OK, but takes forever and comes off during fan blade cleaning.

Computer fans vary so widely in air moved for amps consumed and noise made than anybody who just slaps just any fan in place will not realize the full benefit available from computer fans.

Look at the engineering which goes into some Noctua fans.

http://noctua.at/en/products/fan

Their latest offering in the 120mm range is not yet available on Amazon or Newegg, nor it it designed to be a powerful fan, but its efficacy when attached to a computer heatsink is impressive.

I have a Noctua NF-f12 on the condenser of my compressor fridge pushing air through it instead of the original fan location which pulled air, and was rather stunned at the reduction of compressor run times.  The Noctua fan draws 70% less juice, makes half the noise, and decreased the time which the refrigerator ran from about 5.5 minutes to just over 4.5 minutes each time it cyucled on, during my tests.

Their newest fan:

http://noctua.at/en/products/fan/nf-a12x15-pwm 

apparently performs even better when attached to airflow restrictive finned heatsink, but draws 0.12 amps instead of the NF-F12's 0.05 amps.  As the new fan is 10mm thinner, it might also allow even less restriction in my fridge cabinet.  I've no problems with 0.07 more amp consumption and can retask the NF-f12 to exhaust my electrical cabinet getting rid of a loud ineffiecient 80MM fan I pulled from a failed Wfco converter.
 
SternWake said:
I like speed adjusted but powerful computer fans exchanging outside air for inside air, and utilize both intake and exhaust fans, and with reflectix on the sunny side windows can keep my van's interior cooler than until about noon, then same as ambient temps, and by late afternoon when things start cooling off is the only time it is warmer in the van than outside it, and not for long.

Where do you position the fans to allow for maximum airflow?
 
My 3 intake fans are in the lower portion of a conversion van sliding window in back of van, blowing over my side to side bed, on drivers side, which measures about 7.5 inches tall and about 21 inches long. The 180mm fan is exposed first when I slide the window open. I do not always open the window even the full width of the 180mm fan.

I have two inline fans at the highest part of my fiberglass roof exhausting through a mushroom vent. They are counter rotating, spinning opposite directions. Two inline fans that spin the same direction have issues with lack of flow and weird noises, but counterrotating work in unison to move more air.

The mushroom vent is an older version of one of these,

http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1|619045|1970800&id=1193043

The fan which came installed in this is only 1000 cubic feet per hour. Better than nothing, but nothing like the ~150 cubic feet per minute(9000 cubic feet per hour) the two inline fans can now force through it at max speed. I ripped out the motor and fan a while back to reduce restriction. I am not recommending this product^. I installed it in 2001 when it was ~55$ mainly to keep my surfboards inside from frying and having their wax melt and drip. it was effective at this but was inadequte for human comfort in direct sun. Placing a computer fasn upto it made a noticeable improvement and from there I just kept improving the airflow through this existing vent to the point it is today.

I like the mushroom vent for the rain factor, but it is restrictive to airflow. I'd prefer a larger fan spinning slower through a larger vent, but again it is very effective how I have it set up now. I'd just do the roof exhaust differently if I had to do it over. Perhaps with one of these style vents:

http://www.defender.com/category.jsp?name=mushroom-vents&path=-1|6880|2290139&id=2290143

But really the maxair or fantastik fans are hard to beat, except for stealth.

This fan currently feeds the silverstone fm121

https://www.amazon.com/ARCTIC-F12-P...qid=1499724158&sr=8-5&keywords=arctic+f12+fan

i do not have speed control on the arctic f12 fan, On or off only. In winter time it mostly stays off unless I am cooking. It greatly increases the airflow when forcefeeding the silverstone fm121, it also reduces the noise the silverstone makes at highest speed, and when off presents little restriction to the silverstone fm121..

For interior air circulation I have other fans on an adjustable gooseneck that is mounted to a 2 inch spring clamp that i can clamp most anywhere to direct fan flow anywhere desired. I speed control these by voltage. One was a 92mm van tec tornado fan( which recently failed) and the other is an 80mm vantec tornado. These are actually relabelled Delta highspeed fans which can be had cheaper under that branding, just find the high rpm versions. They have steering vanes which concentrate the airflow into a nice aimable column. I also use these as white noise if there are screaming kids or barking dogs doing the nails on chalkboard inside my skull. They are quiteloud on highest speed but basically silent on 3volts. They do not start on 3 volts though, need to start on 4.5v or higher then back off to 3v. rare that I use more than 9 volts.

Since the 92mm fan failed, I replaced it with an older 120MM fan I had laying around convenient, which I do not like as much, but it is better than no fan. The smaller size is nice and being lighter the gooseneck can hold it in more positions to aim where desired.

These interior fans that I control by voltage, I use these to control that voltage in 2,4.5,6,9, and 12 volts

https://www.amazon.com/CyberPower-C...99724645&sr=8-4&keywords=powerline+dc+adapter

These have a design flaw though, their spring loaded tip can be tweaked sideways in the 12v receptacle and blow the fuse to the receptacle. I remedied this with appropriate diameter adhesive lined heatshrink covering all but the spring loaded tip. The two I have been using have worked for at least 5 years now, but I probably would use a different method today if strtign from scratch, eithe rthe 21Khz PWM motor speed controller or perhaps a voltage buck converter whose potentiometer I replaced with a more ergonomic one.

SO I use computer fans to suck in fresh air through a sliding window, near the bed area in the back of the Van, exhaust fans on the roof to suck the hot air from the roof, and 2 internal fans inside to either blow directly on me, or to blow towards the intake fans to circulate that cool around the interior of the van.

I once considered the floor vent, but do not require it. The intake fans in my side window are not easily noticed painted black in their black painted acrylic shroud behind black bug screen and security chicken wire.

I've also employed computer fans in a friend's stick and brick bathroom, exhausting out a small window.

https://www.amazon.com/BitFenix-Spe...1499726634&sr=8-1&keywords=230mm+computer+fan

It is about 160cfm and pretty quiet.

I put in a clear acrylic shroud for 100% air displacement, and when on, it will keep the mirrors inthe bathroom from fogging during a hot shower. a lot of air gets sucked under and around the bathroom door. I used a 120 to 12vDC adapter/wall wart, and it comes on with the light.
 
I cut vents on the side of my van, for me it's better than opening windows.  The vents feed my swampcooler but with a roof vent running in reverse it'll allow good airflow.  
side vents.jpg
 

Attachments

  • side vents.jpg
    side vents.jpg
    92.9 KB · Views: 6
for holes in the floor or back you must be able to seal them 100% while driving. highdesertranger
 
My earlier post was directed at using the roof fan as the main source of airflow, with additional intake openings, but the conversation now also talks about some additional fans for supplemental airflow.

Just for information on computer fans, if you mount them vertical, that is, the frame is vertical, and the airflow is horizontal, then you can use sleeve bearing or ball bearing fans.

But if you operate them in any other orientation, you should buy the ball-bearing type for maximum life.

I like the NMB Smartfans and the Rotron Fans...good industrial quality stuff. 

I modified one of my NMB Smartfans for use in the vehicles, (truck use before APU) and then the van, it comes with a thermistor temperature sensor, designed to reduce the fan speed automatically as the ambient temperature drops below about 95 degrees. This a server-grade fan and set up for that use.

I modified it years ago with a series resistor and now the fan rotates at high speed above about 70 degrees, then drops to low speed as the ambient gets closer to about 60-65....which is perfect for interior use over the bed at night. By morning, assuming cooler temps of course, it is running very slowly and quietly.

Keeps this human comfy!

IMG_20170711_075540.jpg
 

Attachments

  • IMG_20170711_075540.jpg
    IMG_20170711_075540.jpg
    63 KB · Views: 12
My Meanwell rsp-500-15 came with a 40mm x 20mm NMB fan. Extremely powerful for such a tiny fan, very loud too.

I employed a 60mm and 80MM noctua fans as supplimental ventilation to it as it was not really designed for the task I ask of it, 40 amp for as long as a depleted battery can take it.

While I've not yet mounted a Noctua on the horizontal plane, they have neither a sleeve or ball bearing hub, but what they call SS0 bearing

http://noctua.at/en/sso-bearing


Most fans are rated at 50.000 hours, the noctua are rated at 150,000.

Sleeve bearing fans are best avoided in my opinion when possible, unless they are cheap and easy to swap out when they inevitably get noisy. One can usually peel the sticker off the hub and place a drop of oil on them, which helps for a while, but this should be an indicator it will soon be time for a new fan.
 
Hey buddy, what we got right there is an oil-cooled computer fan!

Pretty neat.... :)

In a few years they will probably come out with anti-gravity dilithium crystal bearings!

These fans, I've had for years...one of the NMB Smartfans ran at a repeater site for years and years, 24/7, embedded in the floor of an equipment cabinet on the roof of a grain elevator, exposed to extreme summer heat, and splashing rain, 225 feet above the ground, and over 150°  on the roof, and down to about 0 degrees in the winter.

The worst problem was the grain dust, (very abrasive), rat dung, pigeon crap, and feathers....I had to blast away at all that crud with a leaf blower about 3 times a year. So, all that grit and garbage it was blowing, and then the leaf blower air blast, and somehow, the darn thing still works.

Yeah, it might make a bit more noise now than it did when it was new 20 years ago...but I dont mind, in fact the white noise is soothing to me when trying to drift off to sleep.

For my next van build I will surely look at those Noctuas...they will probably last longer than me and my descendants!
 
I am truly impressed with how much engineering goes into the Noctua Fan designs. My finger is hovering over a click order on their industrial 3000 rpm version of the nf-f12 and their speed controller, but I have not quite earned that money yet to pay for it.

That version is only IP52 rated, but they have IP67 rated ones in the 2000 rpm version or in the 24v versions.

Dirty fan blades can really slow down and wer out a fan faster. My exhaust fans on the roof collect an impressive amount of dust, as I cooking fumes alow a greasy build up to help the dust stick. Both my exhauset fans have proven remarkable resilient, much more so than my intake fans that are grabbing at salt laden moist air.

Keep fan blade cleaning in mind wherever one installs them
 
thezenvan said:
I recently installed the Maxxair Deluxe 5100 on my Nissan NV2500 High Roof, it's currently running well using an external battery.

I'm looking for ideas to improve the airflow since the cargo space gets a little hot during the days sitting in the Florida weather (been getting 90+ degrees lately) and I don't always have the option of parking in the shade.

There is an exhaust vent in the back of the cargo area on the driver's side but it doesn't seem to do much when the fan is pulling in air. Currently I've been using a swamp cooler with the fan and it's been working OK but I'm looking for a more fixed solution. What I'm considering is cutting a hole in the cargo floor and installing a floor vent (or 2) to allow the cold air underneath the van inside and have the fan pull out air to get a nice airflow but I'm open to any other suggestions.

I searched the forum but couldn't find an answer hence the post, thanks.
   ... I've got the Maxxair 10 spd [don't know #] in the ceiling of my 2500 NV, I have no side windows so I just keep front windows,side door & one rear door open [screening intact] and air seems to move OK - I guess it all depends on how much heat an individual can cope with ...
 

Attachments

  • IMG_20170613_085044.jpg
    IMG_20170613_085044.jpg
    161.9 KB · Views: 11
tx2sturgis said:
My earlier post was directed at using the roof fan as the main source of airflow, with additional intake openings, but the conversation now also talks about some additional fans for supplemental airflow.

From responses I read about my question I gathered that it might not be a good idea to go with the floor vents as that could allow exhaust fumes to enter the van so I was thinking about having an additional intake openings in another spot besides the floor. I mounted the Maxxair fan in the middle of the roof and I plan to install 2 solar panels, one on each side of the fan so I'm not sure I'll more room on the roof for an additional fan.

Do you have the fans mounted next to additional intake openings?
 
thezenvan said:
so I was thinking about having an additional intake openings in another spot besides the floor.
Do you have the fans mounted next to additional intake openings?

Did you read my post about that?

Number 4 way up there.
 
tx2sturgis said:
Did you read my post about that?

Number 4 way up there.

With all the notifications I missed it. Just read it, thank you.

I'll check if that would work well on my van, I don't recall exactly how the license plate area is setup from the inside.
 
With a powerful roof exhaust fan, one can have the air intakes where they will do the most good for a human wanting a passive breeze, or just suppliment with an internal fan to aim at ones body.

Intake Vents on the floor are likely a bad idea on vehicles wil leaky exhausts. I'd not stress it so much on a vheicle with a still good exhaust path.

Put the maxair fan on high and listen closely to it, then crack a door. Does the fan noise change and did a large amount of air flood in?

If the roof exhaust fan can't pull in fresh air then it will be louder and not do very much
 
Top