Enough solar to run computer for 9 hours/day? What's a good starter kit?

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TMG51

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As I intend to work from the van, one important mod is solar to support my computer... I'm thinking I'll need to get a work laptop as energy use is surely less than my PC (500w power supplies are common for desktops I think?).

Could someone point me towards a "starter kit" that may be appropriate? Primary usage will be:

  • Running computer and monitor (or laptop) 9 hours/day
  • Occasionally supporting dome lights
  • Intermittent use of water pump
Everything else will run off propane, or be used when the engine is running. The aforementioned three items I would like to support independent of running the engine.
 
A lot depends on how much work you're willing to put into building a photovoltaic (PV) system.

Let's start by analyzing your power needs.  For a back-of-the-envelope estimate, I'm assuming that you'll get a high-end laptop, with an average power draw of 50 Watts (I'm highballing this guess, so as to ensure that you have a good power reserve).  That would give you a daily power requirement of around 450 Watt*hours.  To support that, you would want a battery bank with a capacity of at least 900 Watt*hours; 1800 Watt*hours would be better.  For a 12V battery bank, that would be a battery capacity somewhere between 75 Amp*hours and 150 Amp*hours.  For the larger bank, around 200W of PV panel would suffice.

An easy (but expensive) way to achieve this would be to get a Goal Zero Yeti 1250 power pack, two 100W PV panels and two Goal Zero MC4-to-8mm adapter cables.  Since the Yeti 1250 includes an integral charge controller and inverter, as well as 12V output ports, this system would be a simple, turnkey solution that would easily meet your needs.
 
AuricTech said:
Let's start by analyzing your power needs.  For a back-of-the-envelope estimate, I'm assuming that you'll get a high-end laptop, with an average power draw of 50 Watts (I'm highballing this guess, so as to ensure that you have a good power reserve). 

You may, in fact, be low-balling it.  I have a high end Lenovo, a model w530.  It comes with a 170 watt ac power supply.  Can't even buy a 12 volt dc for it, they just aren't made.

Regards
John
 
It will really depend on what kind of laptop you get and how big the screen is. The bigger the screen the more power it'll eat.
 
TMG51, the biggest problem with PV system kits is that the charge controller bundled with the kit is quite often a low-end controller without user-settable charging parameters. As such, the system may end up chronically undercharging or overcharging the battery bank, neither of which is good for battery life. A good charge controller will let you match the charging voltage and charging profile to the battery manufacturer's specific recommendations. To me, it makes sense to spend more on the charge controller, since extending my battery bank's life will save me more money in the long run. For a PV system of the size your needs seem to indicate, a good PWM controller should work well; an MPPT controller is likely to be cost-ineffective unless you end up with a PV system in the 400+ Watt range.

By the way, since your PV system's intended use is to allow you to work from your vehicle, it may well be a tax-deductible business expense. It's worth looking into, anyway....
 
I'm slapping my hand so as not to type what I think about lenovo computers...

Okay, the car cord is available here:

http://www.energyplusbatteries.com/PDc758v17a5/IB1210_10-LENOVO-ThinkPad-W530-120-Watt-Car-Cord

I bought a clunker dell laptop at a garage sale for $20 because it had a car cord with it. It maxes out at 1 gig of ram, and will still run circles around the lenovo w530.

Anyway, for lenovo, the car cord draws a max of 6.3 amps and will allow you to use it as well as charge the battery.

What I do is plug in my car cord for about an hour twice per day, that will charge the battery while I'm using it, but keeps the power usage to a minimum.

I'd forget about the solar, get a 100ah deep cycle house battery and just charge it while driving, because you're not going to want to be parked in the sun all day just to charge your house battery.

I also carry a 12v DC gas powered generator for backup power, but I haven't needed to use it since I started charging my house battery while driving over a year ago.

If you're going to spend all of your time outside the vehicle, or have portable solar power that you can put in the sun while you park in the shade, then it might be okay, but if you're planning on working or spending much time during the day inside your vehicle, parking in the sun is a miserable choice in the summer.
 
$1400...wow. Those are like the early kits that we made fun of for being so over priced. Now we make fun of the cheap ones for being so cheaply made. go figure.

For $1400 I have so far 750w of solar in three panels, a Morningstar TS-MPPT-60 controller, a Tripp lite 1250fc inverter capable of 2800w for 30 minutes. The cables will cost $50 if I go series, $100 if I go parallel, plus assorted switches and fuses still to come.

Until now I have been using smaller systems with one 24v panel, a Eco-worthy 20 amp MPPT controller, a set of 50 ft 10 awg cables all costing around $400-$500. Want a better controller, spend more. Don't need as much, spend less.
 
I'm a pretty heavy power user and I'm on my laptop a lot and 200 watts is all I need and that includes 12 volt fridge.

Get a Renogy 200 watt kit and if that doesn't do it get another 100 watt panel. It' so cheap now that unless you are really broke or don't have any room on your rig, I'd just always start with 200 watts. If you're that broke then why are we even talking about it? Just buy a Renogy 100 watt kit because that's all you can afford. If you have the money, buy a 400 watt kit and you will NEVER have to think about power again!!!

Remember, you are buying for the worst day of the year--a storm that lasts for a week in the winter when the days are already short and the sun never rises very high. If you buy JUST enough for the summer, you WILL run out in the winter.
Bob
 
Off Grid 24/7 said:
I'm slapping my hand so as not to type what I think about lenovo computers...

Okay, the car cord is available here:

http://www.energyplusbatteries.com/PDc758v17a5/IB1210_10-LENOVO-ThinkPad-W530-120-Watt-Car-Cord

I bought a clunker dell laptop at a garage sale for $20 because it had a car cord with it.  It maxes out at 1 gig of ram, and will still run circles around the lenovo w530.

Thank you.  I will certainly look into that unit.

Funny, I've had Dells, and I've had Hewlett Packards, and I've had nothing but trouble with them both.  The Lenovo has been entirely trouble free.

I don't insist on bleeding edge machinery.  Bit with an I7 multi core processor and 32 gigs of ram, she certainly seems fast enough for me.  I'm planning to replace the hard drive with a Samsung SSD.

Thanks again for the pointer to that dc supply.

Regards
John
 
My laptop has a 100 watt DC to DC power supply. The other night I streamed several movies in a row, until way too late. I have a RC watt meter inline on the power cord. The laptop alone consumed 42.96 amp hours in about 8 hours*. I was running the sound through my stereo. That and my 12v fridge and my fans/lights used up another 23 AH. My battery monitor claimed to be down 62AH when I shut down the laptop.

At 3pm the next day my single group31 battery had been held at 14.9v for 3 hours. My amp hour counting battery monitor indicated 100%, but it lies.
I have 198 watts if Solar. This time of year, it is almost always more than enough to get the battery to 97% or higher.
In wintertime, it is not, and I am at 32'N in a sunny climate.

Streaming a movie at full brightness is about 4.5 amps, the meter goes from 4.2 to 4.8amps

Typing this right now is 2.4 amps, bouncing from 1.7 to 3.3 with a rare 4.8 reading

There is about 10 feet of 10 gauge wire from the fuse block to the Anderson powerpole which feeds my DC to DC laptop power supply, so voltage readings on the watt meter are 0.5v or more, less than actual battery voltage. The watts the laptop pulls is accurate, but the voltage drop knocks off accuracy on the amp hours displayed.

If you need 9 hours of laptop use daily, the solar you require is More than me. The variable is how much the laptop actually draws in how you are going to use it. Huge variables exist in different laptops. Cycling the laptop's battery is wasteful, unless you know you will be able to charge it when you have an excess of solar, or are driving, or get to plug it into the grid. When I am charging my laptop's depleted battery and using it at the same time, I have seen 8.9 amps consumption, and the DC to DC converter does get warm.

http://www.amazon.com/GT-Power-Analyzer-Consumption-Performance/dp/B00C1BZSYO

* these are not 100% accurate, I'd say 88% to 97% depending on the load. Light loads are less accurate, and It cannot read loads under ~0.1 amp

They only come with 12 awg aluminum wires. I replaced this with 8 AWG wire right to circuit board and have 45 amp anderson powerpole connectors, and it can now pass 40 amps for hours without heating up excessively. Accuracy also improved.

Please don't try and pass 40 amps through these consistently with the provided 12awg aluminum wire. I'd say not more than ~20 amps continuously with it. The 130 amp claim is only for short bursts.

These only measure current flow in one direction. There is a source side and a load side. So it either measures amp flow out of the battery, or into the battery. One could wire in two and do some math and use them as a battery monitor in some smaller setups.( keep that ~20 amp limit in mind unless you modify it with fatter wire) They only count to 64 amps hours before reverting to 0.
 
akrvbob said:
I'm a pretty heavy power user and I'm on my laptop a lot and 200 watts is all I need and that includes 12 volt fridge.

Get a Renogy 200 watt kit and if that doesn't do it get another 100 watt panel. It' so cheap now that unless you are really broke or don't have any room on your rig, I'd just always start with 200 watts. If you're that broke then why are we even talking about it? Just buy a Renogy 100 watt kit because that's all you can afford. If you have the money, buy a 400 watt kit and you will NEVER have to think about power again!!!

Remember, you are buying for the worst day of the year--a storm that lasts for a week in the winter when the days are already short and the sun never rises very high. If you buy JUST enough for the summer, you WILL run out in the winter.
Bob

This seems like good advice, here. I think I'll plan to start out with the Renogy 200 watt kit. Thanks.
 
remember, you don't start with the solar, you start with your needs. Then enough battery to cover them for as long as your budget and space allows. Now you look at how much solar those batteries require to get them back up relatively quickly when the sun does come back. 1-1 is the rule of thumb but I prefer 2-1 after trying to get a 220w panel to bring up a 250 Ah bank at 12.1v. After 5 hours of brilliant sun on a freezing day the bank was up to 13.1v and far from full. I didn't want the battery to sit there partially charged so i had to hook up a charger which is the last part of the equation...a back means of charging.
 
I say start with your wallet and buy all you can afford. If all you can afford why bother finding out what your needs are? Buy the 100 watt kit and adjust your use to it. If it's all you need, then you are done.

The majority of vandwellers need and can be satisfied with 200 watts. If you have the money, buy a 200 watt kit. If it's not enough, buy another 100 watt kit. Yes, you have two systems, but I consider that a blessing since you have redundancy; if one system fails you still have power. I have three distinct systems and I like it!

Or, get the 200 watt kit and get the upgraded controller so you can add another one to it later when you can afford it. But controllers are so cheap now I think just buying a new cheap one is better.

If you have the money, start out with a 300 or 400 watt kit. You'll never have to worry about power even in a storm and nearly all of us can find a way to use extra electricity. :p

Start with your wallet!
Bob
 
akrvbob said:
I say start with your wallet and buy all you can afford. If all you can afford why bother finding out what your needs are? Buy the 100 watt kit and adjust your use to it. If it's all you need, then you are done.

The majority of vandwellers need and can be satisfied with 200 watts. If you have the money, buy a 200 watt kit. If it's not enough, buy another 100 watt kit. Yes, you have two systems, but I consider that a blessing since you have redundancy; if one system fails you still have power. I have three distinct systems and I like it!

Or, get the 200 watt kit and get the upgraded controller so you can add another one to it later when you can afford it. But controllers are so cheap now I think just buying a new cheap one is better.

If you have the money, start out with a 300 or 400 watt kit. You'll never have to worry about power even in a storm and nearly all of us can find a way to use extra electricity. :p

Start with your wallet!
Bob

Well, I can afford a 400 watt kit, but I'm trying to prioritize and economize. I'm sure there will be countless expenses down the road as this life takes hold on me.

But power is a big restriction: Is it big enough to spring for overkill right off the bat? :-/

I'm buying my van this Friday. It already is set up with a front and rear battery. I've yet to figure out what the batteries are rated for, or whether the rear battery is also charged by the engine. I think #2 is the first thing I should figure out in this equation. But I'm tempted to pile on the solar regardless.
 
TMG51 said:
I'm buying my van this Friday. It already is set up with a front and rear battery. I've yet to figure out what the batteries are rated for, or whether the rear battery is also charged by the engine. I think #2 is the first thing I should figure out in this equation. But I'm tempted to pile on the solar regardless.

If the van has two batteries, and there aren't any solar panels already installed, I would say there is a 99.999% certainty that the rear battery is being charged off the engine.

Regards
John
 
Optimistic Paranoid said:
If the van has two batteries, and there aren't any solar panels already installed, I would say there is a 99.999% certainty that the rear battery is being charged off the engine.

Regards
John

I omitted from detail that there's also a plug-in for campground electrical hookup. I reasoned the 2nd battery may be charged from that instead of the engine.

But I agree and am hopeful that the 2nd battery is most likely charged by the engine; I will check this with a multimeter at my next opportunity.
 
TMG51,

Let me know what you figure out. I am also looking for a similar solution of up to 11 hours for work and entertainment purposes.
 
4GNomad said:
TMG51,

Let me know what you figure out.  I am also looking for a similar solution of up to 11 hours for work and entertainment purposes.

Will do - I'll update this thread in the coming days/weeks.
 
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