Dispersed camping attack

[Marc]

Are people aware of the attack on disperse camping. They have closed several sites in Alabama hills. They working on Colorado remote sites now. The Blue Ribbon Coalition are doing their best to save our life ways. Look it up to see how to help.

 

[maki2]

Situation normal, for the dispersed camping areas ...every year some areas get closed to give them a rest and recovery time, sometimes they close for logging avtivities, road maintained issues, or because the budget for the supervising authority is not sufficient for monitoring them. Some years new areas do open as well as some of the recovered sites being useable again. However, especially in the desert or areas in this current years long drought recovery can be very slow. .

There is not an overall government conspiracy to close them, most of the time it is caused by budget issues. With high fuel prices agencies may well have to reduce patrols as their yearly budgets were determined before the Current war that has created high fuel cost. Something has to give and that might indeed mean closures to balance the budget. Just the same as many of us Nomads are having to curtail our own plans and limit our mileage.

This year there are already closures from fires that happened last year, those areas are will be recovering for many years to come. This is already a bad fire season that has resulted in closures that will last for years.

 

[Marc]

Situation normal, for the dispersed camping areas ...every year some areas get closed to give them a rest and recovery time, sometimes they close for logging avtivities, road maintained issues, or because the budget for the supervising authority is not sufficient for monitoring them. Some years new areas do open as well as some of the recovered sites being useable again. However, especially in the desert or areas in this current years long drought recovery can be very slow. .

There is not an overall government conspiracy to close them, most of the time it is caused by budget issues. With high fuel prices agencies may well have to reduce patrols as their yearly budgets were determined before the Current war that has created high fuel cost. Something has to give and that might indeed mean closures to balance the budget. Just the same as many of us Nomads are having to curtail our own plans and limit our mileage.

This year there are already closures from fires that happened last year, those areas are will be recovering for many years to come. This is already a bad fire season that has resulted in closures that will last for years.

I’m not saying it is a governmental conspiracy. I’m saying it is a conspiracy of groups that believe that people walking on bare feet are the only ones allowed in the back country!! One of the things they are complaining about are the “cat holes” in remote area. I have seen this in the 4x4 world. It affects me in being able to jeep into the back country and camp. A lot of you depend on disperse camping areas of Utah and Colorado, New Mexico. I’m just say be aware of things happening. The squeaky wheel gets the most attention!!

 

[abnorm]

I'm a full-timer......We're "Loving the West to Death"...............Near Sedona they are creating about 200 "dispersed" first-come camping spots..........AND the rangers there now photograph your tag and with a new App they KNOW When/Where you stay'd

http://www.redrocknews.com/2022/02/18/usfs-steps-up-camping-limit
"When installation of signage and placement of boulders is complete, a Forest Order will be put in place that prohibits dispersed camping and campfires in the 32,130-acre area that makes up most of the national forest in west Sedona. This aims to keep campers in the eight designated areas, reduce violations of the 14-day stay limit, protect the fragile desert landscape by prohibiting visitors from creating their own dispersed campsites and campfires, while also keeping them from trespassing on private land."

"Once the Forest Order is in place, campers and recreationists visiting Coconino National Forest in the area of Forest Road 525 will be able to use and camp in eight designated dispersed camping areas comprised of nearly 36 acres that accommodate about 10-35 campsites in each area, totaling 150-200 campsites—depending on the size of the vehicle, trailer, or RV."

https://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/coconino/news-events/?cid=FSEPRD1022082

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

Natural progression. As more and more people use the back country things that used to be tolerated can no longer be done.
- When I was young washing dishes and taking a bath in a lake was tolerated; no longer.
- Rafters on the Colorado river have for a number of years packed out their feces.
- Same with backpackers in some areas of the Sierra's.
- Quartzite requires a 10 gallon black tank or parking close to an outhouse.

It is a combination of some areas being too popular and some people thinking anything goes. Expect more rules in the future and expect to start paying for enforcement.

 

[frater secessus]

Quartzite requires a 10 gallon black tank or parking close to an outhouse.

I suspect those are LTVA-specific rules.

 

[Morgana]

Even on Mount Everest ...
https://www.nationalgeographic.org/article/trash-and-overcrowding-top-world/

 

[maki2]

- Quartzite requires a 10 gallon black tank or parking close to an outhouse

Spacem..an that is not not true of ALL Quartzsite BLM camping areas. It only applies to The La Posa North, South, West and Tyson Wash. Those areas are not free BLM, you have to ay to camp there. The fees help cover the cost of services that are provided which I cludes a waste water dump facility, dumpsters, fresh water filling stations and some vault toilets. If you are not "self contained" per their definitions then you have to camp within 500 feet of a vault toilet.

You could have easily verified the information you posted before you posted any BLM rules to this community.

 

[user 16179]

Spacem..an that is not not true of ALL Quartzsite BLM camping areas. It only applies to The La Posa North, South, West and Tyson Wash. Those areas are not free BLM, you have to ay to camp there. The fees help cover the cost of services that are provided which I cludes a waste water dump facility, dumpsters, fresh water filling stations and some vault toilets. If you are not "self contained" per their definitions then you have to camp within 500 feet of a vault toilet.

You could have easily verified the information you posted before you posted any BLM rules to this community.

Good job. Universal statements comparable to the one you are referring are EXACTLY the cause of Facebook rumor and fallacy. Especially "you can camp 14 days, "you have to move 25 miles" and "I'm going to Arizona, what is the best BLM area to stay at?" Every one of those show up in posts time after time across the internet. While every one of those MAY be accurate for a specific area NONE of them are universally accurate across the SW.

 

[BelgianPup]

Regarding the cat holes they're fussing about... Are the people leaving them uncovered? Otherwise, how would they know the holes are there?

 

[towboater]

Regarding the cat holes they're fussing about... Are the people leaving them uncovered? Otherwise, how would they know the holes are there?

2 yeas ago while staying on FR525 if I went for a hike I didn’t wander off without watching out for little white tissue spots. People to lazy to dig a cat hole. Dry climate didn’t break down toilet paper or feces

 

[Marcos989A]

Rule of Thumb: if you can't leave it the way you found it or better, don't go, stay away.
I nearly always try to remove something that does not belong that I did not contribute. It only takes a second and feels good to do your tiny part. Doesn't have to be just the wilderness either, it can be anywhere. I couldn't care less about others' "looks".

 

[user 16179]

2 yeas ago while staying on FR525 if I went for a hike I didn’t wander off without watching out for little white tissue spots. People to lazy to dig a cat hole. Dry climate didn’t break down toilet paper or feces

Even if buried there are popular camping/hiking areas that are so crowded it's easier to miss fish in a barrel with a shotgun than someone's cathole. Think AT around the shelters and the John Muir Trail, from end to end. According to LNT principals the TP should be packed out.

 

[Calaverasgrande]

back in the 90s there were a ton of ravers throwing unpermited parties on BLM land.
There was nobody to complain about the noise, but a ranger woudl come through a a week later or so and find thousands of water bottles, food waste and discarded trash.
This caused a lot of blowback on people like me and my friends who were not ravers but were throwing parties on BLM land.
Even though we always left places much cleaner than we found them, we started getting hassled on all BLM spots.
Wonder if the overlander types or AT folks are contributing to some animus?
Or perhaps the van life popularity has reached a breaking point in some areas.
On the east coast I am not seeing many more camper van types than I did 10 years ago.
But it's less temperate in general on the east coast.

Fair to say, not all people clean up after themselves. A lot of folks just do whatever they like. If they aren't caught red handed they keep doing it.
I'm not going to yell at someone for leaving a mess, or narc them out to rangers. But it does impact everyone.

 

[Malamute]

Fair to say, not all people clean up after themselves. A lot of folks just do whatever they like. If they aren't caught red handed they keep doing it.
I'm not going to yell at someone for leaving a mess, or narc them out to rangers. But it does impact everyone.

Interesting turn of phrase "narc them out". They deserve no respect or tolerance, and yes, it definitely impacts everyone. Why would they rate a pass if its going to ruin things for me? I have a lot more I could say, but it would probably be removed.

I for one have zero tolerance for or reservations about turning in people that trash the places I love. Saying nothing either to them or rangers is condoning and being complicit in their activities. I would tend to report rather than confront, except as regards fires left unattended.

Dash cams can be good resources.

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

Spacem..an that is not not true of ALL Quartzsite BLM camping areas . . .
You could have easily verified the information you posted before you posted any BLM rules to this community.

Universal statements comparable to the one you are referring are EXACTLY the cause of Facebook rumor and fallacy.

I wasn't posting a definitive guide to camping restrictions on BLM land.
I was simply responding to the premise of the OP that restrictions are something new.

 

[Morgana]

Yeah, considering the whack stuff that regularly makes it through here, I really would not have considered this one a major crime against critical thinking. The post contained an inaccuracy. It got corrected. The OP's main point still stands. Stuff worked the way stuff is supposed to work.

 

[CrowsWingTeardrop]

Interesting turn of phrase "narc them out". They deserve no respect or tolerance, and yes, it definitely impacts everyone. Why would they rate a pass if its going to ruin things for me? I have a lot more I could say, but it would probably be removed.

I for one have zero tolerance for or reservations about turning in people that trash the places I love. Saying nothing either to them or rangers is condoning and being complicit in their activities. I would tend to report rather than confront, except as regards fires left unattended.

Dash cams can be good resources.

I agree. Zero tolerance. I've lost count of the campsites I've cleaned up over the years. I have no problems letting a Ranger know who left garbage or a fire. If I can get a photograph (that zoom lens is good for more than wildlife) of the person and their vehicle, even better. Direct confrontation is situational, if you don't feel safe about it do not engage. That said, I have watched my wife pick up garbage others have left and take it right back to them and say "you forgot this" and walk away. Puts me on edge, but I look like an angry old man so they'll take their garbage from her and mutter "thank you"

 

[MortimerEbinesr]

Back when I was young & really stupid, I thought it was cool to dump my trash out of uncovered floor shift especially in front of law enforcement. For the last 50 years I've always had a plastic grocery bag hanging from floor shifter or a knob. I walk my dog 21/2-5 miles a day & never been on a walk without seeing cigarette butts, aluminum cans, one ounce liquor bottles, & lately discarded face masks. I live about 10 miles from the Washington coast and there are hundreds of miles of logging roads that are gated & locked because of pickup truck loads of trash & garbage dumped there. It didn't take me long to realize that littering wasn't job security for county jail trusties. It seems that I might be more evolved then some . (lol) That is funny from an old fart who considers himself an ill tempered old man with guns. I gave up hunting 30 years ago, I don't want to hurt anything with four legs. that include the mice I catch with a live animal trap, & release them in the woods. The jury is still out on some two legged animals.

 

[jacqueg]

Are people aware of the attack on disperse camping. They have closed several sites in Alabama hills. They working on Colorado remote sites now. The Blue Ribbon Coalition are doing their best to save our life ways. Look it up to see how to help.

Frankly, I'd like to see MORE areas closed. IMO, the feds are are bending over backwards to keep areas open. The trash and erosion in some places is pretty disgusting.

Yes, I'm a full-timer.