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catlova

Member
Joined
Mar 5, 2018
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Welcome!

What brings me here...

Hi everyone.  I find myself interested in van-life recently.  I currently live with a roommate and close to work, but I long for my own space as I have never lived on my own in my life (Bay Area native explains why I guess lol).  I also have never had my own pet, which I find sad since I love animals and even work in a dog-friendly office.  (My roommate has an elderly cat so another pet in the household is not welcome.)

I check craigslist pretty regularly for studios but they are higher than I am willing to pay.  I could afford them, but I also have dreams of early retirement and travel so it seems a waste of money.

What happened recently was I came across a cute tiny studio that was actually priced affordably a few towns over that I thought could work for me.  I surprised myself by calling the number on the ad, and spoke with the lady about her place.  (I had not been planning to move so soon but wanted to jump on this great deal.)  Nothing ever came of it - I'm sure she found someone very quickly.  But during the time when I was considering the place, I realized how much of my stuff I was willing to give up so I could fit in there and have a place of my own -- and not even near my work.  I'd already been interested in tiny houses but wouldn't have a place to put one near work either and would have to save up to buy or build one and then end up paying RV fees to live which is not the end of the world but vandwelling provides a better option.

So I began reconsidering vandwelling because I realized I am willing to give up a lot of stuff to live small.  I binged watched a bunch of youtube and have been reading everything I can about it.  The more I learn the more certain I become that this can work for me.  Bob's youtube channel especially made me realize I could do this if I put my mind to it and took action.

The main reason i am so interested is because I can save a lot of money and put that toward my retirement.  I can figure out my expenses, which will of course be much lower each month, and then save a nest egg that I can draw off of for travel/living.  I went many years without retirement (never offered at my work places) and then socked away about $50,000 on my own in a 401k in just about 1.5 years.  But that's all I have which at almost 40 is not enough.  However, if I do this vanlife thing, I can save even more and my expenses will be lower so I can eventually (and fairly quickly I think) get to a point where I can travel.  :heart:

So I plan to save up for a stealth van, build it out, and then move into it.  I plan to park nearish or in the city where I work, and continue to work full time until I have a nest egg that I can draw from for an extreme early retirement.  I have been interested in early retirement for a while, so I'm already familiar with the math needed to make it happen:

25 times your annual expenses, and draw off 4% from your nest egg investments each year
(It's all explained well over at Mr. Money Mustache's website, or Choose FI, although they are mainstream compared to vandwellers!)

The one thing I'm worried about is finding places to park where I can be stealthy and won't have to spend a lot on gas driving far from my work.  I also need to find places to park where my van will be safe while I'm at work.  Parking is pretty bad in the city where my work is, but you are able to find some places and I think if I do a lot of research beforehand, I should be OK.  That is my plan, anyway.  This weekend I was thinking I might try to do some reconnaissance lol.  Try to find potential future parking spots or areas.  I have some ideas already but I need to research more on that front.  I want to have a number of places I can draw from so I can vary my parking each night to avoid capture...er, getting knocks on my door.

Which Van?

As far as the van goes, I am leaning toward a Chevy Express cargo van, extended, and installing a high top on it with Fiberine.  So my budget has to include enough for both of those, and of course, trying to find as low mileage as I can.  I am thinking $20,000 for the van, adding the high-top, and converting it to livable.  My goal is to save up that amount by my next birthday, so I can buy the van on or near my birthday.   ;)

Stealth is really important since I plan to work full time in an urban setting for quite a bit to save up money.  I'm not sure how long it will take, but I want to save up not just enough to travel, but to have a nest egg I can consistently draw off of for traveling.  Another idea is to save up for a small home, tiny home, or real estate I can rent, but for now the plan is just to start saving a nest egg.  Anyway, back to vans..

I have been learning so much lately about different conversions, and I've been so impressed by people's choices out there.  I think for myself I will design my van eventually in this way:

light-weight items and light-weight build out where possible
simple and non-electric where possible (I can charge many things at my work)
no solar panels for now - need to be super stealthy as this will be my home to avoid paying a high rent
I do want insulation and a light weight wood paneling I think, some nights it gets cold here
storage for a small folding bike and inflatable kayak
storage for work clothes
I'm not sure if I am too tall to sleep width-wise across the van or if I'll need it to be length-wise (I'm 5'7")

The People in my Life  :heart:

I love the people in my life but I know some of them are not very open to this and I'm not sure they'd be supportive.  So I am keeping hush about it for now, which is why I feel the need to start this journal and share my excitement and planning thoughts here.  I think I will introduce this as building a camper van and then just start living in it and those that can know without freaking out will find out and the others I'll keep quiet about it.

Maintaining My Anonymity

For obvious reasons, maintaining my anonymity is super important right now.  I need to be stealthy to make this happen smoothly.  But once I have my nest egg and can quit my job and start traveling, I'll probably loosen up and get out there into this community.  I may be a bit general at times when it comes to my personal life, just to avoid identifying myself.  Hope no one minds.  I know I'm leaving a digital footprint here but I'm hoping to remain anonymous and at the same time make some new friends and learn all I can from you helpful peeps.  I wonder if there are any other full-time workers who are being stealthy living in a van?  I seem to come across a lot of people who are traveling but my intentions are to work until I have a big enough nest egg to retire on.

Thanks and Happy Traveling!
 
Welcome to the CRVL forums catlova! Sounds like a workable plan! If possible try sleeping at some of stealth spots with your current vehicle to get an idea of what you'll be facing living full-time in a van.

To help you learn the ins and outs of these forums, this "Tips & Tricks" post lists some helpful information to get you started. We look forward to hearing more from you.
 
Thank you for the warm welcome and the helpful link.  I will check it out.

Good suggestion about trying out van life before committing to it, but I don't have a vehicle I can use in the mean time to test out the plan.  Maybe I will figure out a way to try it out before I buy though.
 
This week I cancelled an online course program that would cost about $2,000.  The reason is I realized I was more excited about learning about vanlife than learning the skill I was studying...I kept putting off studying and found I wasn't as committed as I needed to be to spend $2,000 on it.  Also, I researched whether that field could be done remotely and the answer was not really.  So that made it even less exciting and I'm glad I quit it.  I saved $2,000 (the money was already saved up) and there are other ideas I have for working remotely potentially that I'm just more interested in and already feel I'd be better at or more interested in learning.

Because of the big quit, I moved the $2,000 to my vanlife fund.  Then I got my paycheck and was able to throw another $1,000 toward vanlife so that makes a total of $3,000 as my initial starter fund.  Not a bad start.

I use YNAB which I was lucky enough to win for free a few years ago, which means I pay no subscription but am able to budget using their program offline.  It works great and I know how much money I have for any little thing down to the penny.  It also gave me some basic accounting skills that I'm able to use at work, so yay for that.

Another thing I use is Google sheets to forecast budget and plan out how long it will take to save up for something.  It looks like it will take me 7-9 months to have enough for a Sprinter van, but I'll probably want to save longer than that so I can have enough to convert it.  Guess it depends on how great a deal I get on the van.

I have been binging youtube a lot and thinking about the features I want in my own conversion van.  There are a couple of conversions I've seen that I really like, and keep going back to, so I'll probably take ideas from here and there and put them together to make vanlife my own.

Still more to learn, but I'm enjoying it.

So I have a ways to go to save up enough to start this.  It might take a year or two, but I think it'll be worth it to create my new little home that I'll be happy with and that can still be stealthy enough for me to hide in the city in plain sight.

Now I'm off to make bread in my breadmaker and get some exercise.  Enjoy your weekend everyone!  :)
 
The bread takes 4 hours and all ingredients have to be at room temperature, so it'll be ready pretty soon now (it's evening now).

Tonight on the way home I did find a couple streets that I thought could work for stealthy sleeping parkings spots.  They are in a town over, but the town is safer than the town I'm in now, so worth the gas.  Both streets I found were in the industrial section of the city.  I'd like to find some spots that are more pretty like parks or nature-y type spots.  I've started keeping an eye out when I'm driving for good vanlife parking spots so I can make mental notes for later on.

I also browsed Home Depot and Walmart today with different ideas in mind as far as the conversion.  I ended up buying a front waste pouch (fanny pack) from Walmart that I can use on my hikes rather than lugging my backpack.


I also went to Chipotle and bought some other snacks, so spending, but not enough to dip into my vanlife savings fund.

I think I might watch Without Bounds (I think it's called that) which I may have seen before.
 
People are tricky, you can't afford to show
Anything risky, anything they don't know
The moment you try
Well, kiss it goodbye

Aimee Mann, "It's Not" lyrics

I think I've let my family's opinions dictate how I've been living my life.  The $3,000 I had saved for van life got spent and I also moved to a studio in a town over from my work.

I should be happy having my own place, and I am in some ways, but I'm not completely content.  My commute, dreadful.  My rent -- almost half my income each month.  I'm saving for retirement, but not as much as I'd like.  I work as an EA and my boss is retiring, meaning my job security is now shaky.  Since so much of my income goes to rent, it's been hard to save an emergency fund.  I need to figure something out.

Enter youtube.  I've been watching the last few days and I'm interested in van life again.

I've been thinking I can get a cargo van, stealth it out for a while, save up money for a better van build, rather than starting with the perfect van build right from the start.  Just take it step by step and do what I need to to make life doable living stealthily in a van in the East Bay.

I am going to start a van life fund again.  And keep watching those youtube videos.
 
Many of us are stuck in work, rent/mortgage, waiting cycle. Don't give up, but use this time to try out,practice the lifestyle (weekends,holidays) until you are really ready, emotionally and physically, to make a change. I am still tent camping whenever I can while working full time and socking away $$$ towards the goal. The camping is my reward/release and has helped me fine tune my plans/goal.
Best of luck to you!
 
You make a good point and thanks for your encouragement!  I am tent camping in the summer and really looking forward to it.  I'll be kayaking (I have an inflatable kayak), hiking, and camping all by myself.  It'll be my first time camping alone so it'll be a good test of how I like it.

Maybe I should try out van life before I really dive into it, so as you said, I'd be ready.  I can rent a camper van somehow or small RV and just try it out for a week or two or for a month, to really make sure this is what I want to do.  Life is a bit easier with a place of my own, but I'm sure paying for that convenience.  I would love to be traveling with a van but I know that wouldn't be my reality just yet.  (I'd be staying at my home base and working full time, saving up $.)  That said, I am working on changing some things in my life so I can work remotely at some point in the future.  I'm skilling up, but it takes a while and in the past I've let my lessons slide.  I'm going to try harder to get my coursework done each day, and also to save my money since that's the stage I'm in at this point.  Saving and learning.

I'm shaping some goals lately related to my health, my remote work skills, and to my finances.  I'm hoping to have certain things accomplished by my birthday and by the end of the year.  I might share more as time goes by but that's it for now.

Hope everyone has a great day :)
 
My rent has gone up 70% in 4 years. My pay, most indubitably, has not.  Goodbye California. Your a great place to be raised in, but a terrible place to retire at.
 
That's awful!  Sorry to hear that.  Hopefully you've found a more affordable situation!


Fyi I am Catlova, but it's been so long I forgot the password, and couldn't find the reset email although I tried about 3-4 times and looked in lots of folders.  So I created a new account and I wrote it down this time.

I'm still at the same studio which has been very nice during the pandemic.  It's made me appreciate it more than ever since I share a really nice backyard garden with the house in front and I have 2 nice windows that look out to the garden.  Working from home I could actually appreciate the view and started growing veggies in the veggie boxes.

However my company decided to go fully remote and eliminate my position since they no longer would have an office they said.  So I'll work a couple more months and finish up some things and then I'll be out of a job.

So this has been pretty sad and scary news, although I am feeling like I'll be able to get by and hoping I can land a good position soon that's remote.  I also am more interested in returning to some courses I'd bought years ago that I never fully finished.  I bought Skillcrush and did some of the tech track but I am now more interested in the Visual Design track.  At my work I've been able to do the social media for a client and I've found I really like creating the graphics, so I'd like to get more skilled in visual design/art and find work as a remote Visual Designer.  For now I am looking for remote work as a EA, Office Manager, or Communications Assistant/Coordinator, or Social Media Manager.

Anyways, besides work I also acquired a cat named Melody.  Future van plans would need to accommodate my mostly indoor - outside on a leash cat.  I will be looking into how other van dwellers with cats do.

While financially this might seem like a good time to live in a van for me to cut expenses, actually it's not because I've been helping my parents out so much this past year as they are both in poor health and are resistant to paid caregivers.  I also really love the studio.  I have not been able to find a studio that has as much charm and a garden, veggie boxes, windows, hardwood, etc....it really is a gem.  So if I left it I would definitely have to feel sure.

My brother in law has been looking for work since September.  I know the economy is opening up and there are more opportunities, but I also know there are tons of applicants who have been trying to land a job for months and months.  I did have a chat/phone interview this morning but may have shot myself in the foot with my salary range being too high for what the position entailed.
 
Hopefully businesses will figure out by September (as that is how long the government has funded increased unemployment, basically giving $15 an hour to people out of work) that they must pay a living wage to their employees or go out of business.
 
Yes.  I'm just thinking there will be so much demand for jobs that low wages will be accepted though, sadly, since there are millions who lost their jobs from the pandemic.

I was just watching a youtube about poverty in America.  It was a recent one about Wyoming and really an eye opener.  It made me feel humble and grateful for the incomes I've been able to pull in just by the luck of being raised and living in a place where most (not all) salaries are at least decent.  It's high cost of living, too, but even when I was a server after college I was making good money because the minimum wage was higher 15 years ago in SF ($8.75? if I remember) than it is now in Wyoming for servers there ($2.13).  Add on tips and I was doing fine, whereas even with tips in Wyoming you're still struggling.  Pretty sad.

It makes me think about economics, and the 1%.  It's the small businesses that often can't easily afford to raise their wages for their employees.  However big corporations pay their CEOs 33% of their lowest wage worker.  That's what's common.  One CEO, of Gravity Payments in Seattle, a few years back raised all his employee's wages to $70K by lowering his own salary by $1 million.  They are still doing very well and retention is great there.  That is why I'm for a basic income for low wage earners.  I don't believe that anyone should have to work more than 40 hours a week to live decently unless they want to.

Here's the youtube I was watching called Living on Minimum Wage: 

I better get back to my job hunt.  Hope all is good with everyone reading.
 
It sounds like you do a lot for your parents, for which I commend you.  I know you love your studio, but is there a possibility to live at your parents' home?  Or to park a cheap tiny home or broken RV in their back yard so you can live independently and practice vanlife?  I heard that San Francisco rents went way down during the pandemic, but I'm sure you must be paying a lot for the studio, especially if your income stream will end soon.  Taking rent payments out of the equation will bring you much closer to your goal.
 
MG1912 said:
It sounds like you do a lot for your parents, for which I commend you.  I know you love your studio, but is there a possibility to live at your parents' home?  Or to park a cheap tiny home or broken RV in their back yard so you can live independently and practice vanlife?  I heard that San Francisco rents went way down during the pandemic, but I'm sure you must be paying a lot for the studio, especially if your income stream will end soon.  Taking rent payments out of the equation will bring you much closer to your goal.

My parents are elderly and in poor health so for now I want to be near them and able to help.  I'll be staying with them for 6 weeks while my dad recovers from surgery, so I'll see how things go.   There place is a mess that stresses me out so it'll be a lot of clean up.  If it comes to it, yes I could probably move back in with them.  I'm not yet ready to roam far just because of their poor health.
 
Having helped my mom for a while, I am considering moving in for a period to save on rent.  I could also then continue some design courses I have and not worry about the cost of the software, and then pursue more freelance work.  I don't think I'd do that step if I were keeping the studio - I'd have to find a full-time job and we'd have to get a caretaker for my parents.  I'm having a hard time finishing up my job (full-time) and helping my mom at the moment.  I end up working evenings and weekends because there are so many breaks to help her.  And this is without my dad home from the rehab place, I'm sure he'll need care also.  My parents would prefer me to an aid, so it works out that way also.

I'm not 100% decided but leaning that way.  I need to write out the pros and cons like financial, career-wise, having my own space, etc.

However this would give an opportunity to save up for a van/tiny home/what have you - and also then I could easily have time for the build because I wouldn't have to work for the rent, or I could work around my freelance hours.

It's a big change.  Really want to do one of those weight-matrix for making hard decisions things.
 
I am very much almost very nearly decided to move in with my parents for a time, help them out, save up money, and then purchase a Sprinter-type van or small RV (but leaning to a Sprinter for the stealth/ease of parking) and going from there, embarking on vanlife.  (Finding a good caretaker for my parents, of course.)

The only reason I am not totally decided is because I happen to have an especially nice and cute studio with garden set up, in my hometown and close to friends and family.  However I feel like if I don't take this opportunity and do this now, I might never have as good a chance to get into vanlife.  I would be paying rent for ever.  And even as much as I was making (a decent amount for my industry and the area), I still wasn't able to put away as much as I wanted to in my retirement.  I was in sort of a circular holding pattern, not making forward momentum with my retirement nest egg because my monthly expenses were too high to do anything but maintain the status quo.

Studio
Pros:
Very cute and includes an enclosed porch
Has a lovely garden with a birdbath, bird feeders, hanging flowers, fruit trees, paths, and pretty garden lights and my own veggie boxes
Laundry in my enclosed porch
Backyard porch set up
Studio is practically inside the backyard garden
I have all my things just how I want them, all my nice things I particularly like (like my bed, silverware, artwork, etc.)
It's close to family and even closer to friends
Rent is $1400, which is cheaper than for smaller/ugly studios with less amenities and no garden in the area
Has shiplap and fancy tile work in studio room and kitchen
Kitchen is a galley kitchen, large and usable unlike most studios
backyard studio - very safe
Lots of windows and natural light inside
Wood floors and tile floors
Modern and clean design
It's just very charming
I have room for all my kitchen gadgets like Vitamix blender, juicer, Instapot, toaster oven/air fryer, and more.

Cons:
My neighbor who lives in the house in front treats the backyard as her personal junk yard, seriously marring the beauty of the garden.
She put in a huge trampoline which blocks the view of the pretty garden.
There is no saying that she would ever leave.
She won't clean up (I have been throwing out the obvious garbage, cleaning up after her basically since I moved in a couple years ago)
Fyi we are friends and I do not bring up the junk much because I keep things friendly in my living environment, but the junk does bother me and is the reason I started looking for other studios/room shares in the area a while ago because the pretty environment I live in is ruined by her junk.
The $1400, while cheap for the area, is still pretty steep for studio rent any where else.

Staying with parents and getting into Vanlife
Pros
It's my own.  I wouldn't be paying rent to anyone, ever again, if I didn't want to, allowing me to save oodles money.
As I'm losing my job, this is the most economically feasible option.  My savings would definitely last and likely grow since I'm retaining that one client and can find more clients or gigs.
I can have a set up where my favorite appliances are used: toaster oven/air fryer, Vitamix, juicer, Instapot.
I'll bring my cat and take her on lots of adventures with me (harness and leash).
If I don't like my neighbors, I can just leave.
I can boondock and save on rent.
With a good stealth van set up, I can sleep many places for free.
I can visit my friends and family when I want to.
I can bank extra money I make above living expenses and grow my retirement fund.
I can see other parts of the country, state parks, nature a lot more than I do now.
I can bring my inflatable kayak with me.  Or maybe get a hardshell fold-up kind, and bring Melody (the cat) with a cat life jacket.
I can take hikes with Melody, either in a hiking cat backpack or on a leash/harness set up.
I would probably have more time for things I enjoy.
I can bring a projector and have movie nights.
I can stay in really beautiful locations.
I can meet new people and make new friends.
I can still have the things I love around me, like my favorite artwork, my kitchen gadgets, my silverware, ceramic bowls, favorite Boho rug, etc.

It's sad to say goodbye to my studio, which felt like a once-in-a-lifetime luck-out to live somewhere so lovely and close to friend and family, in a great neighborhood, etc.  However I must remember a couple things: 1) The reality of my studio set up was my neighbor constantly junked up the yard, really frustrating me and making our lovely spot look like a junkyard 2) I wasn't able to save a lot for retirement, and was really barely saving anything because every month it seemed there was always some big expense, whether car repairs, insurance, medical, etc. and 3) Now is the perfect time to change my life in a significant way, get into vanlife, and have the space to save up and make this change due to staying with parents and having freedom from not having the job (ending soon although I will retain one client).

It's still sad to see that lovely studio with the garden go though.  Honestly I have never found a studio set up as nice over my years of looking for a place to rent.  If it was cheaper, I would be keeping it, and probably definitely if I had a tidy neighbor.  It would be much, much harder to leave.  I try to look to the future and appreciate how happy I'll be when I have my vanlife set up with my things just so and that make me happy.

I do have an appointment to see one rental room with a friendly roommate which is less than the studio, but I don't think I'll go with that either.  The idea of not having to make rent, being able to build up my freelance business and get into vanlife is way better than staying in the same old, same old.  I would have to find full time work either way with the studio or this roommate situation.  I'm liking vanlife also for that reason.

If you've read this far, thank you - just felt I should write out my decision process which is helping me know for sure this is the direction I want to go.
 
The $1400 a month rent would send me packing regardless of anything else.

You could always move somewhere that is wayyy cheaper and still save for your van. Are you going to build your client list again? Can you do it from the road?
 
I have been following a lot of people who moved back home, and it has become clear to me that setting expectations with your parents early on is important to the long term success of the arrangement. You are their kid, but you are not a kid. They need to accept that. You are also still their kid. You need to accept that. As long as they don't expect you to behave like an obedient minor, and you don't expect them to treat you like a completely-equal adult on equal terms (it's their house and their rules, and you are staying for free, so you should subordinate to them to a degree), it will be fine. It's when expectations are not clear, and people let frustrations boil over, when problems occur.
 
Stealth visitor said:
Bitty is back I see.


Bitty??? Really??? Jeez we haven’t seen her on here for a couple years it seems like!
 
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